Purpose-based alternative buyers guide!

[TotallyKaos]

First of all: I'm a 16 year old Dutch teenager, and I'm not sure if all my English sentences are 100% correct, so if you've got some spelling, grammar or other language-related comments, please send me a PM/DM.

 

Thank you!

 

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Hey fella's,

 

I'm here posting this topic to make you guys more concious about the things you are going to buy for your next computer, wheter it's a complete or partial gaming setup, high end workstation, or just a regular shared computer for in and around the house, this is where you've gotta be if you wanna be really sure or want to get the most performance for your money and for the purpose the computer is going to be used for!

 

I'm starting this topic because very much people which are giving you advice about which parts you should buy for your upcoming computer or expensive gaming/workstation -computer is not always correct or totally true.

I have a good example of an equal situation;

 

"Right now you have 2 CPU vendors, Intel and AMD, it's almost a given fact that Intel is ALWAYS faster than AMD chips (of the same generation etc. etc.) and very much people are giving you the advice to buy an Intel chip, 'because' you are building a gaming-rig(for example). And those people are just blindly giving you the advice to buy that new Intel chip (a nice recent example is the 3570K/3770K vs. AMD FX 8350 ) BUT they didn't even gave the other side a chance, they don't even know about the other side of the story. Because the AMD chip (in this case) is MUCH faster in gaming performance, 9 times out of 10 the AMD chip is getting more frames per second while the Intel chip gets a little behind."

 

Short way; this is called a "bias", that says that it isn't totally true, or it isn't really based on real life facts or something like that(you know what I mean...........I hope so.....)

 

And THAT is the exact reason why I'm starting this topic, because I want to give YOU a good advice based on facts and real life situations, without biased opinions and stuff.(I am NOT offending or blaming other people for giving "bad" advice, I just want to do it BETTER....)

 

How I'm going to do that, that'll be in the next post!

 

Peace!

[TotallyKaos]

Okay if you want to get a super-balanced and dedicated advice, you can copy and paste the following list of things, fill in the blanks, and post it underneath the third post in this topic, then I'll reply via a quote, multiquote or DM/PM (that will be your choice, included in the list below ;) ).

Warning: this is NOT a laptop refined-buyersguide!

Follow this and you'll be happy! ;)

List;

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*What is your budget, how much can you stretch and what is the absolute maximum amlut of money you want to spend on your new computer?! (I want 2 options, one WITH and WITHOUT peripherals, so I can build up a better balance between both)*

*What will the purpose of the computer be that you are planning to buy?

*What are you planning to do with your computer, looking in a 3 to 5 year perspective?

*What does the computer HAVE to do?

*What does the computer NOT have to do?

*What are your minimum and maximum demands for the computer to do properly?! (What features can be unattended and what features totally NOT?)

*How long does the computer have to last?

And how do you want to be replied?

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I'll base all of my answers on real life situations, not on expectations!

I'm trying my best to get the most personalized and satisfying configuration for your next computer, if you don't answer properly I can't make a personalized list!

This is Max, signing out!

[TotallyKaos]

Reserved, because I can >:D

[Rhizo]

*What will the purpose of the computer be that you are planning to buy? Multipurpose

 

*What are you planning to do with your computer, looking in a 3 to 5 year perspective? Literally, everything... video edit, photo edit, game, fold, mine, code, etc.

 

*What does the computer HAVE to do? Everything

 

*What does the computer NOT have to do? N/A

 

*What are your minimum and maximum demands for the computer to do properly?! (What features can be unattended and what features totally NOT?) Well, it needs to just about anything I want it to do.

 

*How long does the computer have to last? Until I get a 4k monitor, so let's say 3 years?

 

And how do you want to be replied? Here

[TotallyKaos]

*What will the purpose of the computer be that you are planning to buy? Multipurpose

 

*What are you planning to do with your computer, looking in a 3 to 5 year perspective? Literally, everything... video edit, photo edit, game, fold, mine, code, etc.

 

*What does the computer HAVE to do? Everything

 

*What does the computer NOT have to do? N/A

 

*What are your minimum and maximum demands for the computer to do properly?! (What features can be unattended and what features totally NOT?) Well, it needs to just about anything I want it to do.

 

*How long does the computer have to last? Until I get a 4k monitor, so let's say 3 years?

 

And how do you want to be replied? Here

 

My answer will be:

 

AMD FX 8350

MSI 990FXA-GD80

2x Asus HD7970-DC2T-3GD5

2x Samsung 840 Pro 256gb SSD in RAID0 for main "disk"

2x Seagate Barracuda 15 4TB drives in RAID0 for storage disks

Something along the lines of 16GB/32gb's of RAM, doesn't really matter what RAM, just buy the cheapest from Kingston or Corsair (will cost a total of like a $125 dollars maximum.) and choose for a 2 or 4 DIMM configuration

 

And a nice 80+ Gold power supply, the case is subjective so I can't choose for you....

 

I didn't quite figured it out very well (was still in editing mode but I accidently published it) so the list isn't done yet, I have to add your budget that you want to spend on the computer and accessory's etc.

[Jay123]

Your English is very good considering it is a second language

[TotallyKaos]

Your English is very good considering it is a second language

Well thank you, yeha maybe it's because I read a lot of English books and that I copy the way they talk etcetera.

Nice to hear that my English isn't really bad at all! :D

[ixi_your_face]

Nice to hear that my English isn't really bad at all! :D

 

Your english is way better than most people i've talked to.

[tbc]

why are you recommending raid 0 for storage?

[jaccotjuhhh]

why are you recommending raid 0 for storage?

 

rhizo requested an "all round" pc. so it would be a profit if it was fast. and to make it fast you just put 2 hard drives in raid 0. and by putting 2 hard drives in raid 0 you "double" your storage.

this is what i assume. (since i am not him i can't know for sure):

hard drives most likely live a life of 5 years. since rhizo requested a pc that lasted 3 years, he doesn't have to worry about hard drive failures. so we don't really need the safety that raid 5 and raid 1 gives you.

[jaccotjuhhh]

*What is your budget, how much can you stretch and what is the absolute maximum amlut of money you want to spend on your new computer?! (I want 2 options, one WITH and WITHOUT peripherals, so I can build up a better balance between both)*  my budget is around 950 euro, and my absolute maximum is 989. and i do not need peripherals (except for the case if you consider it a peripheral)

*What will the purpose of the computer be that you are planning to buy?  to be used as a personal computer

*What are you planning to do with your computer, looking in a 3 to 5 year perspective? mainly gaming in 1080p. i might upgrade to 4K or dual monitor later.

*What does the computer HAVE to do?  run triple-A games. and it has to be very quick in running/loading programs.  it also must be overclockable, and it must be able to dissapate the heat.

*What does the computer NOT have to do? it is not going to be used as a video/photo editing pc. nor as a storage pc.

*What are your minimum and maximum demands for the computer to do properly?! (What features can be unattended and what features totally NOT?) i would like it to have a fast SSD, preferably 2 in raid 0. i do not need another hdd for storage since i have a hdd already. but i do like to have quite some storage on the ssd to store some games/programs (256 would be plenty).  it also has to be able to run games like bioshock infinite and battlefield 3 at atleast 50-60 fps at high/ultra settings. and it has to be future proof to the future games.
 

*How long does the computer have to last? i'd like to have it last as long as possible. my previous pc died because it got old. (it's REALLY old, it had a gt 320 and a i3 550 in it)

And how do you want to be replied? just here in this topic.

 

 

greetings from a fellow dutchman

[TotallyKaos]

why are you recommending raid 0 for storage?

It's just stupid fast :-)

And it drive failure is just a very limited phenomenon, it CAN happen but it almost never happens so there's no reason to (especially for customers like we mostly are) to recommend RAID5/RAID6/RAID50/RAID60 or any other super-reliable storage solution.

[TotallyKaos]

 

rhizo requested an "all round" pc. so it would be a profit if it was fast. and to make it fast you just put 2 hard drives in raid 0. and by putting 2 hard drives in raid 0 you "double" your storage.

this is what i assume. (since i am not him i can't know for sure):

hard drives most likely live a life of 5 years. since rhizo requested a pc that lasted 3 years, he doesn't have to worry about hard drive failures. so we don't really need the safety that raid 5 and raid 1 gives you.

 

 

This, my man is exactly what I'm trying to say, it isn't necessary so why would you do it? Got it?! :D

 

*What is your budget, how much can you stretch and what is the absolute maximum amlut of money you want to spend on your new computer?! (I want 2 options, one WITH and WITHOUT peripherals, so I can build up a better balance between both)*  my budget is around 950 euro, and my absolute maximum is 989. and i do not need peripherals (except for the case if you consider it a peripheral)

*What will the purpose of the computer be that you are planning to buy?  to be used as a personal computer

*What are you planning to do with your computer, looking in a 3 to 5 year perspective? mainly gaming in 1080p. i might upgrade to 4K or dual monitor later.

*What does the computer HAVE to do?  run triple-A games. and it has to be very quick in running/loading programs.  it also must be overclockable, and it must be able to dissapate the heat.

*What does the computer NOT have to do? it is not going to be used as a video/photo editing pc. nor as a storage pc.

*What are your minimum and maximum demands for the computer to do properly?! (What features can be unattended and what features totally NOT?) i would like it to have a fast SSD, preferably 2 in raid 0. i do not need another hdd for storage since i have a hdd already. but i do like to have quite some storage on the ssd to store some games/programs (256 would be plenty).  it also has to be able to run games like bioshock infinite and battlefield 3 at atleast 50-60 fps at high/ultra settings. and it has to be future proof to the future games.

 

*How long does the computer have to last? i'd like to have it last as long as possible. my previous pc died because it got old. (it's REALLY old, it had a gt 320 and a i3 550 in it)

And how do you want to be replied? just here in this topic.

 

 

greetings from a fellow dutchman

 

 

Ik ben nu weg naar het bevrijdigingsfestival in Leeuwarden :P ik maakt zometeen als ik terug ben wel even een lijstje!

[jaccotjuhhh]

hahaa okee. ik wacht op je reactie

[Guest Teddybear]

Never mind. I already know what I have to get him.  ;)  I was just testing the water to see your recommendations. 

[jaccotjuhhh]

when can i expect to see your recommendations? i myself had made a list before i found this thread with the following hardware:
cpu: FX-8350

gpu: 7950 x2 in crossfire

storage: none

mobo: asrock 990fx extreme 3

case: aerocool x-warrior

cooler: scythe mugen 3
ram: gskill 8gb

psu: corsair cx750m

 

 

i like to see your recommendations since i am not totally sure about my setup yet.

[TotallyKaos]

when can i expect to see your recommendations? i myself had made a list before i found this thread with the following hardware:

cpu: FX-8350

gpu: 7950 x2 in crossfire

storage: none

mobo: asrock 990fx extreme 3

case: aerocool x-warrior

cooler: scythe mugen 3

ram: gskill 8gb

psu: corsair cx750m

i like to see your recommendations since i am not totally sure about my setup yet.

That is a very good setup! Really, but since you aren't editing any video's or doing even heavier GPU-based tasks but other than games you can better get yourself 2 GTX 660TI's or 670's in SLI, because for most of the games those videocards have a step ahead performance-wise, because Nvidia is more commercial, so yeah.

In that case I'd go for 2x GTX 670 (and budget wise this is also a good option, if it does NOT fit your budget, than go for the 2x 660 TI's, those are almost the same as a 670-SLI setup and costs less.

And go with a Intel 3570K or a 3770K if you want it very extreme :D

This will also give you heavy boosts on super heavy games like the Crysis and The Witcher -series of games, (Crysis is being a whore performance-wise on AMD-processed computers...).

If you don't play Crysis on a daily/weekly base you aren't going to need a Intel CPU, an AMD FX 8350 will do even better in games like Battlefield and all other major games!

Crysis is just a bitch with AMD-CPU's....

So I would change the processor (To a 3570K, if the money is there, go for the 3770K), motherboard(I'd suggest you buy a MSI-Z77A-GD45, it's a cheap but reliable motherboard, also good for overclocking and it's a super fine board for running dual grahpics cards as long as it are 2-slot cards!), graphics cards( 2x GTX 660TI in SLI, or if the money is there(and you wanna cut on the processor to a 3570K instead of a 3770K) then you can buy 2x GTX 670 in SLI ! )

That would be my choice, PC-case is subjective, gotta work that out for yourself, PSU-wise I'd go for a reliable brand, Seasonic, Corsair, Cooler Master, Cougar, Super Flower, Tagan(don't know if these last 2 company's still exist...) and go for AT LEAST a 80+ Bronze certified power supply, Silver is the best balance between price and reliability but there aren't as many Silver PSU's out there as there are Bronze or Golden PSU's.

RAM: Go for Kingston or Corsair, otherwise go for Mushkin, Gskill or any other major brand, those are the most reliable brands if you want to go with RAM!

Ditch the Mugen 3 and get a Scythe Mine 2, it has a way bigger cooling surface and the block itself is freaking huge, it's' that huge that you don't even need a fan to cool the OVERCLOCKED CPU, it's that beastly!

And in the Netherlands it's only about 25 to 35 dollars, that's the same as the mugen, but it delivers better performance! (keep in mind that it's a freaking beast, it's big, so keep that in mind when choosing your case!)

[jaccotjuhhh]

alright. but from what i've read is that in future games, they will be capable of using more cores. so the FX-8350 comes good in place since i wanted it to be future proof.

also, the drivers of AMD graphics cards have been improving blanzingly fast and the 7850 is planning to get as good as a 680. so the 7950 would be near a 690, but WAY cheaper. and what amd is most popular of, frame latency bounces. well, since 13.5 there are less frame latency bounces than most nvidia cards.

 

would you please make a list of components for me? please note the pricetag in euros next to it. you might want to take in note of what i just said. and please also keep a spare 50 euros off the budget so i can choose a decent case.

[TotallyKaos]

alright. but from what i've read is that in future games, they will be capable of using more cores. so the FX-8350 comes good in place since i wanted it to be future proof.

also, the drivers of AMD graphics cards have been improving blanzingly fast and the 7850 is planning to get as good as a 680. so the 7950 would be near a 690, but WAY cheaper. and what amd is most popular of, frame latency bounces. well, since 13.5 there are less frame latency bounces than most nvidia cards.

 

would you please make a list of components for me? please note the pricetag in euros next to it. you might want to take in note of what i just said. and please also keep a spare 50 euros off the budget so i can choose a decent case.

 

I'm not at saying this in a nice way: that's kinda bullshit :S

The drivers are still getting better on the AMD side but though, Nvidia is a step ahead in processing, and a 7850 just can't be as fast as a 680, due to the fact that the 680 has like 1/3rd MORE stream processors on it's chip, there is no way a GPU with a significant amount of streamprocessors LESS than another can be faster, it's just impossible....

 

About the better-multicore support you are right, BUT keep in mind that a Quad-core non threaded processor from intel (a 3570K for example) is just as fast (actually a LITTLE BIT slower..) than a octa-core chip from AMD, so that says that when Intel releases an equal octa-core with the Ivy-bridge architecture it will be twice as fast as an 8-core from AMD.... got it?!

 

It's not that the AMD FX 8350 is "SO MUCH FASTER" than the Intel 3570K, it's just that the FX 8350 is constantly bitched down by people who already expect Intel is going to be faster, while they didn't do any benchmarks, but now they've benchmarked it very well, and the 8-core from AMD seemed just a little bit faster on games 9 times out of 10.

 

And the difference in fps is like this:

 

Intel 3570K - 39,5 FPS average

Intel 3770K - 40,5 FPS average

AMD FX 8350 - 42,4 FPS average

 

(this is just an example but this would be the margin of win you would get on an AMD chip right now.)

 

But it really doesn't make a world of difference, but since the AMD chip is a lot cheaper you can also go for that, at least I would've done that if I'd use my computer for purposes that are gaming-grade heavy or less heavier.

 

If you want to render video's (for example for your Youtube channel) I would go for an Intel 3770K OR FX 8350 because you than have more processing power, more (virtual) cores, but for gaming a 3570K and a 3770K almost equal an FX 8350.

But it still doesn't make a lot of difference, overall the FX 8350 would be the best choice, it's both good for gaming AND rendering, and it's so much cheaper than a 3770K (which does the same thing perfectly) but a 3570K wouldn't be an good option if you wanted to also render video.

[jaccotjuhhh]

so how about the list i requested?

 

 

would you please make a list of components for me? please note the pricetag in euros next to it. you might want to take in note of what i just said. and please also keep a spare 50 euros off the budget so i can choose a decent case.

[TotallyKaos]

so how about the list i requested?

 

That's a fine one!

But again: if only gaming around on maximum settings, choose some Nvidia cards :)

[jaccotjuhhh]

why would i use a nvidia card over a amd one? my arguments for amd are:

- i am switching to 4k in a while, so the extra graphics ram comes out good

- i mainly play battlefield, and amd cards just BLOW AWAY the nvidia cards on that game

- when comparing a 670 against a 7950, the 7950 wins on most occasions. and im not comparing it against the 680 since it's way more expensive

- the equivalent powered amd cards are better priced than the nvidia ones and when buying 2 7950 you get 6 (or 4, i dont remember) triple-A games. and thats something im looking into as well

[TotallyKaos]

why would i use a nvidia card over a amd one? my arguments for amd are:

- i am switching to 4k in a while, so the extra graphics ram comes out good

- i mainly play battlefield, and amd cards just BLOW AWAY the nvidia cards on that game

- when comparing a 670 against a 7950, the 7950 wins on most occasions. and im not comparing it against the 680 since it's way more expensive

- the equivalent powered amd cards are better priced than the nvidia ones and when buying 2 7950 you get 6 (or 4, i dont remember) triple-A games. and thats something im looking into as well

 

You asked me for advice right?! :P

For huge resolution's like something along the lines of a 4k-like res. than I'd say to you: buy quadfire 7970 ghz. edition setup, because those 2 7970's will never have the power to calculate battlefield/crysis on a medium/high setting, I don't even think it will run very well on low either.......

But there are a few people out there who've tried it, but those results can't be used as a benchmark or something like that.

[tbc]

 

rhizo requested an "all round" pc. so it would be a profit if it was fast. and to make it fast you just put 2 hard drives in raid 0. and by putting 2 hard drives in raid 0 you "double" your storage.

this is what i assume. (since i am not him i can't know for sure):

hard drives most likely live a life of 5 years. since rhizo requested a pc that lasted 3 years, he doesn't have to worry about hard drive failures. so we don't really need the safety that raid 5 and raid 1 gives you.

 

 

fast for what exactly?

 

there was aleady an SSD specced and there's no reason that a storage device needs to be fast.  Especially considering how good harddrives are at large transfers already.

 

remember, this is RAID 0, if EITHER drive fails, both drives are toast.  If you actually care about space, you use two drives separately so that you minimize the loss when either drive dies.

 

if you're going to recommend something dangerous, make sure that you put a note somewhere about good backup practices.  Remember that this is a public forum and many people will read the posts and copy/pasta it to their systems without thinking twice.  Don't believe me?  ever heard of people frying their mobos because they copied someone else's suicide run BIOS settings?

[joelthezombie15]

I'm starting this topic because very much people which are giving you advice about which parts you should buy for your upcoming computer or expensive gaming/workstation -computer is not always correct or totally true

a lot of times people are correct but there are a few that are wrong. and i dont think its fair to say no one knows what they are talking about but you do. idk maybe i read wrong or maybe your sentence got messed up but that is kinda messed up. true people make mistakes but usually some one else will correct them. again maybe i read wrong and if i did im sorry but that seems very unfair to the people on the forum who DO know what they are talking about.