Streaming tips

[Magneson]

Having followed quite a few of the streams I hope I can contribute with a little input from an AV tech pov.

Streams can be difficult, especially with multiple streams consolidated into one like in the case of the Tech Support challenges that I've been lucky enough to catch live two times (of two?). Or handling keys/titles on WAN show for example. I think most of the technical issues there can be sorted with a bit of training and a rethink of the equipment used. Ideally it should be considered to contact a rental house and get a deal there (equipment rental + tech/training). I don't know the local market in Canada/US, but if AV alliance is something to go by, Stagevision in Vancouver should be an option. It could also be a way to make videos of the more heavy AV equipment that will run 8K+ and more if they stock it. 

 

If that isn't an option, or if keeping it in-house is preferred, getting a hold of a dedicated video mixer and giving each input stream its own computer/laptop would probably improve the technical parts quite a bit. Then output the single video signal from the mixer over an Atem streaming bridge, OBS or whatever streaming solution being used. This isolates problems to single parts for easy troubleshooting if something goes wonky. The single part can then be cut out while troubleshooting without disturbing the stream. Considering LMG now has a considerable amount of BM cameras, an Atem 2 M/E Production Studio should be a reasonably priced choice. BMs mixers are a bit finicky when it comes to resolution and framerate as they don't scale, but apart from that they are generally nice and simple to work with. They also have camera control in the mixer which can be great when using multi-camera setups. Built in audio mixer (although with a generally extremely hot signal) with audio follow can quickly manage simple tasks like discord calls. An alternative to this could be a Roland VR-50HD Mk II, but I'm uncertain if it has enough layers to deal with 4 simultaneous streams + keyers.

 

To control a multi-part setup like that, the simplest option is to use a streamdeck, but drop the streamdeck software and run Companion from bitfocus.io instead. Companion integrates with a lot of AV hardware and software (like QLab and ATEM mixers) via ethernet, making simultaneous control of many complex parts easy. 

[FakeFBI]

streaming like movies, or like live stream?, this writing is confusing as hell

[Mark Kaine]

I just click on "go live" in GFE, not that complicated ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

Spoiler

although it sure sometimes doesn't seem to want to work... 

 

2 hours ago, ComputerBuilder said:

streaming like movies, or like live stream?, this writing is confusing as hell

this is typical for most "tutorials" the people writing them are usually not good at... writing... 

[Magneson]

I'm sorry if my writing isn't up to your standards. Not intended as a tutorial, but I think the points are valid. With audio drop-outs and what seemed at times as a lack of control, this is how it's usually solved. While gfe is fine for single person streams, more complex arrangements require more complex systems/solutions. OBS is great for what it is, but maybe not as great as dedicated solutions. 

[LogicalDrm]

5 hours ago, Magneson said:

I'm sorry if my writing isn't up to your standards. Not intended as a tutorial, but I think the points are valid. With audio drop-outs and what seemed at times as a lack of control, this is how it's usually solved. While gfe is fine for single person streams, more complex arrangements require more complex systems/solutions. OBS is great for what it is, but maybe not as great as dedicated solutions. 

You are writing it without examples. Which makes it confusing. Ideally you should have timestamps for parts of Tech Support challenge VOD to point out failures, what you think they are about and how to fix them. Also your title isn't really helping, or the starting paragraph. And since this is community forum, your start seems to be targeted to community, not as critique towards LMG.

 

LMG is hardly new to streaming. WAN Shows have been  a thing for 8+ years. And they have gone much better with it. Even when they were doing it remotely. The key issue in WAN Shows for majority of time is that they don't have dedicated producer to take care of technical side of things. Like someone who could prepare everything, and monitor it while things are going. So the issues with intro scene and stuff like that fall down to does Linus remember how things are done and is there update to software which would break things.

 

With these dedicated streams they usually have someone in producers role (Anthony or Jake, maybe others now too). Reading chat, checking preview etc. With Tech Support Challenge they have added issue that they aren't fully in control of things. They are relying on internet connection of their contestants, those camera setups, software used by them to communicate and so on. Now, I haven't watched the latest, and since you have wall of text without context to quickly check, I can't comment on whether your critique is warranted or bit overboard.

 

I can say that since they probably can't have dedicated and private setup due to COVID restrictions (like contract with ISPs to make sure all connections are stable), the key issue is with what software they are using for video conferencing, and are they doing it on one call or multiple calls and then merging all to one. I doubt that any of the issues are because of hardware restrictions. I would guess network on either end, and software used for conferencing, are the main problems. Something which they would normally go around by doing local recording like with Scrapyard Wars on location.

Edited November 25, 2020 by LogicalDrm

[Magneson]

6 hours ago, LogicalDrm said:

You are writing it without examples. Which makes it confusing. Ideally you should have timestamps for parts of Tech Support challenge VOD to point out failures, what you think they are about and how to fix them. Also your title isn't really helping, or the starting paragraph. And since this is community forum, your start seems to be targeted to community, not as critique towards LMG.

 

LMG is hardly new to streaming. WAN Shows have been  a thing for 8+ years. And they have gone much better with it. Even when they were doing it remotely. The key issue in WAN Shows for majority of time is that they don't have dedicated producer to take care of technical side of things. Like someone who could prepare everything, and monitor it while things are going. So the issues with intro scene and stuff like that fall down to does Linus remember how things are done and is there update to software which would break things.

 

With these dedicated streams they usually have someone in producers role (Anthony or Jake, maybe others now too). Reading chat, checking preview etc. With Tech Support Challenge they have added issue that they aren't fully in control of things. They are relying on internet connection of their contestants, those camera setups, software used by them to communicate and so on. Now, I haven't watched the latest, and since you have wall of text without context to quickly check, I can't comment on whether your critique is warranted or bit overboard.

 

I can say that since they probably can't have dedicated and private setup due to COVID restrictions (like contract with ISPs to make sure all connections are stable), the key issue is with what software they are using for video conferencing, and are they doing it on one call or multiple calls and then merging all to one. I doubt that any of the issues are because of hardware restrictions. I would guess network on either end, and software used for conferencing, are the main problems. Something which they would normally go around by doing local recording like with Scrapyard Wars on location.

Thank you for a good response LogicalDrm! Reading it again now you are absolutely right, I was not clear on what I tried to communicate, and I will try to take your response to better my writing. Working as an AV technician, I also have a very specific definition of what streaming is, and have not considered that it is used in a much broader sense than live streaming a multi-camera/screen event. I also probably spot minor errors which for the most part people don't pick up on. I should probably consider that as well before speaking. The issue in question was the audio drop-out with a following stream reset in the latest tech support challenge. Having followed LMG for some years now, they usually deliver great content! I was in no way trying to diminish their work, only trying to ask them to try push it that little bit further to make it perfect. I understand now that this is not the right forum to post it in so sorry for the inconvenience.

[LogicalDrm]

1 hour ago, Magneson said:

Thank you for a good response LogicalDrm! Reading it again now you are absolutely right, I was not clear on what I tried to communicate, and I will try to take your response to better my writing. Working as an AV technician, I also have a very specific definition of what streaming is, and have not considered that it is used in a much broader sense than live streaming a multi-camera/screen event. I also probably spot minor errors which for the most part people don't pick up on. I should probably consider that as well before speaking. The issue in question was the audio drop-out with a following stream reset in the latest tech support challenge. Having followed LMG for some years now, they usually deliver great content! I was in no way trying to diminish their work, only trying to ask them to try push it that little bit further to make it perfect. I understand now that this is not the right forum to post it in so sorry for the inconvenience.

I understand what you were after. Like said, I haven't watched this latest stream yet. But I have been vocal critic of their livestreams in past, mainly for the lack of producer to check audio quality and making preparations. Linus has addressed it in past. And since he does lurk on forums, its likely he has seen this thread. Though if not, you editing title to be more descriptive will help to make difference between LMG livestreams, general streaming to Twitch/Youtube, streaming media to TVs and streaming games from main rig to weaker device.