Convince me to buy AMD. (Seriously)

[Curufinwe_wins]

4 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

I really don't need to talk you into buying an AMD. That would be wrong to do on my part. 

 

Can you imagine?? I buy a 3700X today at newegg 300$ bucks, a year from now it drops to 150$. Just like my 2700X did. Wanna have a salty feeling?? Do that. Mad as Fuck about it honestly. I spent my left Arm on a slower AMD cpu lol. And then watch people buy the same thing on a much tighter budget. Crazy to think 16 thread performance at only 150$ bucks and I can still call it HEDT IMO.

Eek. I actually bought in at a great time honestly. Not only did I get pretty darn good value out of the 5820k (after overclocking), but my GPUs realistically have pretty darn good performance relative to common mainstream ones. (1070 pref equivalent at stock, 1080ti equivalent in a good game to sli. So 2060, and 2080).

 

But I don't generally worry about depreciation, since I almost certainly won't resell. And massive depreciation got me a 1.5 year old good car for less than half of the value it had new.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Caroline said:

 it's lightning fast compared to my previous 2005 Sempron

My Athlon 220ge is lightning fast compared to your 05' Sempy haha!! 

 

Neat fact, you can easily passively cool both!!

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

Eek. I actually bought in at a great time honestly. Not only did I get pretty darn good value out of the 5820k (after overclocking), but my GPUs realistically have pretty darn good performance relative to common mainstream ones. (1070 pref equivalent at stock, 1080ti equivalent in a good game to sli. So 2060, and 2080).

 

But I don't generally worry about depreciation, since I almost certainly won't resell. And massive depreciation got me a 1.5 year old good car for less than half of the value it had new.

If you don't worry about depreciation, then you cannot scuff a lick at pricing and your budget. You buy to your needs at that point and then throw in the stuff you want as well.

Biting the bullet here.... and leaving terms like desktop and high end on the counter over there......

 

If you just need a usable system.... even a cheaper Zen + is going to a performance gain for you all across the core count increase and also IPC.....

 

Now to convince you.

 

Money is no object per say.

 

Mild number crunching, want frame rates.

 

12 threads will carry you for some years. Seek this at a minimum. 16 would be ideal. (8 cores is pretty much mainstream + smt)

Memory speed for gaming carries some performance gains, and it's actually cost effective and easy. Not a lot of tweaking setting XMP and off you go ( AMD doesn't normally just set DOCP and go. This is a major draw back) So Intel for this angle here.

Like @Beerzerker said, AMD cost less. As I mentioned before, are also more efficient to run. (I'm sure you're not worried about that much)

 

AMD chips run cooler....

Mine's lid-less. And even that, Zen + so 12nm not 7.... and can still run it on the stock shipped cooler. 

 

But eh, @Fasauceome pretty much had a decent line up on the jist of round about platforms at X (500ish) price. 

 

But for sure, AMD has "cheap - er" going for it. IMC is cheap'er, price is cheap'er, so performance to dollar makes it look good for near same computing power in a general whole of things.

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

16 minutes ago, Caroline said:

Even a lemon is lightning fast compared to that junk.

You and I differ.

I think a Sempron can really rock some shit up for it's time.

 

My (Ryzen) Athlon 220ge probably stomps quite a few older rigs out there. 3.8ghz OCCT stable, no problem. (little shakey at 4)

 

2008

 

 

2019

 

[Curufinwe_wins]

15 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Snip 

 

That isn't strictly true. Short/medium depreciation is just a useless concept if you intend on running everything till it breaks (value=0) and the expected lifespan is not correlated with the rate of depreciation in the short term.

 

Which I would argue both to be true. TVOM is still a thing though. Anyways, the rest of the comment was super good summary so thanks)

 

This sounds stupid, but I expect my real decision matrix will be going to different stores around me and seeing what I can buy tomorrow right away. It was still good to check first given infinite availability, but I don't expect to see that.

 

I have a backup motherboard from amazon that can arrive in 2 days, but cpu and other stuff might take up to two weeks right now (very little direct stock at the moment).

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

That isn't strictly true. Short/medium depreciation is just a useless concept if you intend on running everything till it breaks (value=0) and the expected lifespan is not correlated with the rate of depreciation in the short term.

 

Which I would argue both to be true. TVOM is still a thing though. Anyways, the rest of the comment was super good summary yea.

 

This sounds stupid, but I expect my real decision matrix will be going to different stores around me and seeing what I can buy tomorrow right away. It was still good to check first given infinite availability, but I don't expect to see that.

 

I have a backup motherboard from amazon that can arrive in 2 days, but cpu and other stuff might take up to two weeks right now (very little direct stock at the moment).

Well.... Until it breaks = value  = spending X (unknown at this point) dollars.

 

Buy used X99 board (or new if you found one) 

OR

Build a new rig.

 

So the depreciation is now, you buy a new rig, and sell the remaining older hardware to compensate the losses. 
Or it sits in a box, or you recycle it, then still at a cost of a new/used board or new system. 

 

New system = less likely failures, but would be wise to update in entirety, not just partially. Then you may as well buy the used board and get the old girl up and running again with at risk damaging additional parts between the board swap out. 

 

I dunno. up to you. 

I'd build (newer) but perhaps you don't need the absolute fastest meh. DDR5 coming sooner than later. More Zen processors to come should hear some mention from AMD further through the year.

 

Gonna be honest though. I am shocked AMDs Unzipping performance. The new operating system and software installation process is quicker. I can have an OS setup and ready to use faster on AMD than Intel. (A lot of my files are compressed) 

[Curufinwe_wins]

9 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Well.... Until it breaks = value  = spending X (unknown at this point) dollars.

 

Buy used X99 board (or new if you found one) 

OR

Build a new rig.

 

So the depreciation is now, you buy a new rig, and sell the remaining older hardware to compensate the losses. 
Or it sits in a box, or you recycle it, then still at a cost of a new/used board or new system. 

 

New system = less likely failures, but would be wise to update in entirety, not just partially. Then you may as well buy the used board and get the old girl up and running again with at risk damaging additional parts between the board swap out. 

 

I dunno. up to you. 

I'd build (newer) but perhaps you don't need the absolute fastest meh. DDR5 coming sooner than later. More Zen processors to come should hear some mention from AMD further through the year.

 

Gonna be honest though. I am shocked AMDs Unzipping performance. The new operating system and software installation process is quicker. I can have an OS setup and ready to use faster on AMD than Intel. (A lot of my files are compressed) 

Lol, well I'm keeping everything that works, and replacing everything that doesn't (while statistically unlikely, I don't actually know if my cpu still works). I just need to decide what to replace it with. I think I've decided down to 9700k or 3700x, and if I can get my hand on a good (given my constraints and cost preferences) motherboard + water block adapter ill do 3700x. I know around me the intel availability will be higher. But I'll give updates once I shop tomorrow.

 

Used motherboards are asking for pain. And are often not even cheaper. And HEDT boards have SOOOO many things that can go wrong hahahaha. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

Lol, well I'm keeping everything that works, and replacing everything that doesn't. I just need to decide what to replace it with. I think I've decided down to 9700k or 3700x, and if I can get my hand on a good (given my constraints and cost preferences) motherboard + water block adapter ill do 3700x. I know around me the intel availability will be higher. But I'll give updates once I shop tomorrow.

 

Used motherboards are asking for pain. And are often not even cheaper. And HEDT boards have SOOOO many things that can go wrong hahahaha. 

 

You'll be fine with a 3700x. 

I am very super really unsure how it is going to act with your memory sticks in regards to running any XMP setting. I see quite a bit.... no better to say A lot of issues, but at 2133Mt/s (1067mhz) should boot up. Hopefully. lol I dunno.

 

Sad part is I'm serious and laughing at the same time. Please, take the time to scroll this section of the forum to catch a drift. Oh man so many issues out there, and just at this very forum.

 

Corsair LPX SK Hynix budgeted memory, so many 3000mhz no post 3200mhz no post..... No one suggest buying a higher frequency than 3200mhz for some really strange reason. RGB memory XMP failuer, reverts OC, no posts, crashes. but mostly can't run cheap low end memory well.  Uhg man. So many with issues. On and on. day in and day out. right here at LTT.

 

And people just keep on suggesting this memory for use and everyone just gets issues from the results. I find myself copy pasting suggested setup for their memory and typically the sweet timing spot Ryzen likes.... A lot of users are newer and it's difficult. There's more than just a setting or two to get memory on AMD to run an XMP profile on lower end budet memory consisting of 3000mhz. 

 

But I never see the guys that have been into tweaking a long time come in asking about these issues, because we find the walls and jump right over em' lol.  

 

Food for thought, please consider a thorough research before making purchases.  

 

Look closely at the AMD motherboards Tier list. It's pretty accurate or close enough. 

It IS worth it to purchase a higher tier board. HOWEVER Even my tiny Itx board can roll with the Top tier boards. (AMD cpus don't overclock) so then it's ..... well it... it doesn't matter anymore. (tear in eye) But for memory clocking, it does matter. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Curufinwe_wins]

15 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Snip

 

Good news is that 8+ usb ports and a boot code display (for amd) means I'm automatically looking at the high end boards. I've tentatively got my eye on the strix-e at the moment.

 

It's replacing a 300 dollar motherboard (from 5 years ago anyways) so you can know I'll pay for better if it is worth it. I just won't buy the 500 dollar vanity boards lol.

[Beerzerker]

I've got two AM4 boards in the 300+ range, one in the 250'ish range myself.
And that's the last I'm investing in such for a VERY long time - Maybe another CPU or two along the way for variety but that's it.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

Buy for whats important to the 

Work you do. 

 

Does avx performance matter to you?

[Sauron]

10 hours ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

Do you happen to know off hand what dual channel 2400 ram on Zen 2 results in for memory bandwidth? 

I'm not sure but the results in the video are with dual channel.

[JoostinOnline]

10 hours ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

So I will need one of a few rather particular motherboards regardless and I expect will have to shell out for a x570/z270 board just to get my feature set.

You actually need a Z390 motherboard. Despite the socket being the same, Intel has forced new chipsets. The easy upgrade path is one of the reasons so many people have been moving to AMD. They don't feel locked down to a platform. Another one being that AMD offers significantly higher performance for multi-core workloads.

 

Whatever you decide, if you need more USB ports you can always get a PCIe expansion card.

[Curufinwe_wins]

1 hour ago, JoostinOnline said:

You actually need a Z390 motherboard. Despite the socket being the same, Intel has forced new chipsets. The easy upgrade path is one of the reasons so many people have been moving to AMD. They don't feel locked down to a platform. Another one being that AMD offers significantly higher performance for multi-core workloads.

 

Whatever you decide, if you need more USB ports you can always get a PCIe expansion card.

No actually I can't just add more pcie cards. I will be using every single slot as is. (Well 1x1, 2x16s and 1x4, I might technically have 1 1x1 left in an atx standard board.)  I could solve some issues with a hub, but pcie slots are at a premium already lol.

 

And yes, I do know it was z390, I just misspoke in the OP on the right number. And never bothered to update.

[JoostinOnline]

33 minutes ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

And yes, I do know it was z390, I just misspoke in the OP on the right number. And never bothered to update.

Okay, I just wanted to make sure, since sometimes people here think they can save money by getting an older chipset. Also for some reason I thought you were a new user.

[Curufinwe_wins]

18 minutes ago, JoostinOnline said:

Okay, I just wanted to make sure, since sometimes people here think they can save money by getting an older chipset. Also for some reason I thought you were a new user.

No worries, I've seen plenty enough justification for that thought.

 

Well I'm a lot less active than I used to be, as most of the moderators here can attest)