Very soft hissing in speakers

[jasonmdylan]

Ok, so I'm back with another audio question.

 

So I ended up getting a DAC to take care of my audio latency issue (even though I got the latency under control, the 3.5mm jack wasn't having any of it.) So now I'm using optical digital out>DAC>3.5mm speaker. 

 

I got the DAC hooked up and all was well. Was having an issue with occasional white noise so I unintstalled the realtek driver (later I figured out the issue was just that I needed to force 2-channel PCM sound, so that is kinda my fault). 

 

Now, ever since I uninstalled the driver, and I mean immediately after it uninstalled and the sound went out, I hear a soft hiss from the speakers. It's really faint, but enough to notice even with some ambient noise in the room. I'm wondering if anyone knows why that may be happening.

 

Once the computer restarted, it loaded the default HD Audio drivers and it was still hissing. Reloaded Realtek and still hissing. Rolled back to before the uninstallation with System Restore, still hissing. Unplugged the DAC and all cables, then plugged everything back in, still hissing. 

 

Anyone have any idea how to stop it or what it could be?

 

Thanks

[toastfacegrillah]

Ground loop? Tried putting the speakers on a different power circuit? or have an isolator lying around? Just a guess

[unknownmiscreant]

1 hour ago, toastfacegrillah said:

Ground loop? Tried putting the speakers on a different power circuit? or have an isolator lying around? Just a guess

Ground loop is 50Hz hum. Not hissing. This doesn't look like a hardware issue.

 

For OP, disable your onboard audio codec in the bios, reinstall the latest drivers for the DAC, and set it as the default output device in windows. Can we get the model of the DAC and some system specs.

 

I had an issue with occasional hissing from my soundcard when I had the "allow applications to take exclusive control of this device" options disabled.

[seduce_me]

Try a powered USB hub

[unknownmiscreant]

1 hour ago, toastfacegrillah said:

Tried putting the speakers on a different power circuit? or have an isolator lying around?

Also realized, a different power circuit won't do anything. If a house has been wired properly, the earth pins of all power points are connected to a stake in the ground outside. Trying an isolator is likely also pointless. If you want to isolate something from the earth circuit, the best bet is to put some kapton tape on the earth pin.

[toastfacegrillah]

1 minute ago, unknownmiscreant said:

Also realized, a different power circuit won't do anything. If a house has been wired properly, the earth pins of all power points are connected to a stake in the ground outside. Trying an isolator is likely also pointless. If you want to isolate something from the earth circuit, the best bet is to put some kapton tape on the earth pin.

It fixed my issue, I had my DAC's power supply on the same powerboard as my PC, Changed boards and eliminated it completely.

[unknownmiscreant]

1 minute ago, toastfacegrillah said:

It fixed my issue, I had my DAC's power supply on the same powerboard as my PC, Changed boards and eliminated it completely.

I would expect plugging a DAC and a PC PSU into the same powerboard to cause issues. The PC PSU inherently will inject alot on noise onto the supply of the DAC, due to the increased resistance caused by the powerboard. This will mean the power supply in the DAC is stressed more as it tries to filter this noise out.

 

Were you experiencing a 50Hz hum or hissing or buzzing? All are quite different, and you will know the difference when you hear them. Hiss/buzzing is power supply/shielding issues, hum is ground loop.

[toastfacegrillah]

6 minutes ago, unknownmiscreant said:

I would expect plugging a DAC and a PC PSU into the same powerboard to cause issues. The PC PSU inherently will inject alot on noise onto the supply of the DAC, due to the increased resistance caused by the powerboard. This will mean the power supply in the DAC is stressed more as it tries to filter this noise out.

 

Were you experiencing a 50Hz hum or hissing or buzzing? All are quite different, and you will know the difference when you hear them. Hiss/buzzing is power supply/shielding issues, hum is ground loop.

Yeah that all sounds spot on to what I experienced ^ however I just remembered I didnt change the DAC power (It's USB power) it was my 5 Channel Mixers power pack, but same same result

 

I actually had a little bit of both, the 50Hz hum was eliminated entirely by changing boards. However I still experience a very dim buzz but thats probably due to the insane amount of wiring bunched up on my 22 plugs running off 1 outlet (100 year old house)

[jasonmdylan]

2 hours ago, unknownmiscreant said:

Ground loop is 50Hz hum. Not hissing. This doesn't look like a hardware issue.

 

For OP, disable your onboard audio codec in the bios, reinstall the latest drivers for the DAC, and set it as the default output device in windows. Can we get the model of the DAC and some system specs.

 

I had an issue with occasional hissing from my soundcard when I had the "allow applications to take exclusive control of this device" options disabled.

Specs:

 

Windows 10 64 bit

i7 7700k

ASRock Fatal1ty Gaming-itx/ac

Asus Strix 980ti

16GB Gskill Ripjaw V Ram

Thermaltake Toughpower Grand 850w PSU

H55 Corsair water cooler

OS installed to SSD

 

(I also have an NZXT Sentry 3 fan controller, two mores SSDs and an HDD in a hot swap bay, and peripherals (mouse/kb, printer, external DVD, etc) 

 

Here is a link to the DAC. It's just a cheaper one off Amazon.

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00NJCCAKY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

It can be powered through AC or USB. I'm currently using USB into a port on the back of the mobo. This doesn't have any drivers I can find. I'm guessing that's because it's basically just a passthough circuit board that changes digital to analog to utilize different outputs, nothing fancy. I didn't want to spend a lot of money since two of these boards have had a crackling issue through 3.5mm jacks. I just want sound that works. And it's a Mini-Itx setup, so I don't have an available slot to stick a discrete internal soundcard in. 

 

I'll throw it in since toastfacegorilla mentioned something. This is also a very old house. The wiring in this particular room is only around eight years old, though. And like I said, what's throwing me is there was no hiss until I uninstalled the Realtek drivers. Even after reinstalling them it has continued.

 

Some more things I've tried:

 

Changed the USB port the DAC power is plugged into

Changed the USB port my speakers are plugged into (I have an amBX system, so it powers via USB & AC, plus you need a 3.5mm jack for actual sound input/output)

Physically relocated the DAC further from the case

Disabled sound enhancements in the digital adapter sound properties

 

Hope all that information helps.

[unknownmiscreant]

Try run everything off separate 5v USB AC adapters. Don't use the one that came with the DAC. It looks like junk, so may well have a very noisy output. Try use expensive ones if possible, as they generally have better circuitry inside them.

 

You may find the 3.5mm jacks on the MBO are fine if you run the speakers off an AC adapter or battery bank. If you can, try run both the speakers and DAC off separate battery banks.

[jasonmdylan]

19 minutes ago, unknownmiscreant said:

Try run everything off separate 5v USB AC adapters. Don't use the one that came with the DAC. It looks like junk, so may well have a very noisy output. Try use expensive ones if possible, as they generally have better circuitry inside them.

 

You may find the 3.5mm jacks on the MBO are fine if you run the speakers off an AC adapter or battery bank. If you can, try run both the speakers and DAC off separate battery banks.

 

I'll see if I can find a 5v adapter.

 

Yeah, the 3.5mm jack on the mobo was my original problem. The same problem with two of the same boards (didn't do it with another brand, but I no longer have that one.) The latency would shoot up causing cracks and pops. I finally got the latency under control, but the speakers would still do the same thing. Monitor speakers are fine, digital input soundbar fine, but whenever I plug any set of speakers into the 3.5mm and switch to that output (front or back ports) it would immediately start to crackle again. By the end, before I got the DAC, I found that if I unplugged and replugged the 3.5mm jack on the board, that it would quit crackling... until I put it to sleep or shut it down. So I have no idea on that one. I just got sick of messing with it.

 

But I've got a few different USB AC adapter boxes: phone, roku stick and others. One of them is bound to be the right voltage. I'll try tomorrow or Saturday and see if that fixes it and post any results.

[unknownmiscreant]

2 hours ago, jasonmdylan said:

 

I'll see if I can find a 5v adapter.

 

Yeah, the 3.5mm jack on the mobo was my original problem. The same problem with two of the same boards (didn't do it with another brand, but I no longer have that one.) The latency would shoot up causing cracks and pops. I finally got the latency under control, but the speakers would still do the same thing. Monitor speakers are fine, digital input soundbar fine, but whenever I plug any set of speakers into the 3.5mm and switch to that output (front or back ports) it would immediately start to crackle again. By the end, before I got the DAC, I found that if I unplugged and replugged the 3.5mm jack on the board, that it would quit crackling... until I put it to sleep or shut it down. So I have no idea on that one. I just got sick of messing with it.

 

But I've got a few different USB AC adapter boxes: phone, roku stick and others. One of them is bound to be the right voltage. I'll try tomorrow or Saturday and see if that fixes it and post any results.

Every adapter with a USB port outputs 5v. Some ones for phones output up to 20v, but ONLY after there has been specific handshaking between the phone and AC adpater to make sure the phone can handle it. Look up Qualcomm quick charge specs if you are interested.

[jasonmdylan]

On 11/10/2017 at 6:14 AM, unknownmiscreant said:

Every adapter with a USB port outputs 5v. Some ones for phones output up to 20v, but ONLY after there has been specific handshaking between the phone and AC adpater to make sure the phone can handle it. Look up Qualcomm quick charge specs if you are interested.

Ok, so I tried the AC adapter from one of my Roku sticks. (It's the same as the included AC block from the DAC 5v 1A). Still has a hiss. 

[unknownmiscreant]

3 hours ago, jasonmdylan said:

Ok, so I tried the AC adapter from one of my Roku sticks. (It's the same as the included AC block from the DAC 5v 1A). Still has a hiss. 

Did you also power the speakers off an AC USB adapter. Try power both the speakers and DAC off different adapters and try both the 3.5mm on board jacks and the DAC.

[CrippledROBOT]

On 11/9/2017 at 7:37 PM, jasonmdylan said:

Ok, so I'm back with another audio question.

 

So I ended up getting a DAC to take care of my audio latency issue (even though I got the latency under control, the 3.5mm jack wasn't having any of it.) So now I'm using optical digital out>DAC>3.5mm speaker. 

 

I got the DAC hooked up and all was well. Was having an issue with occasional white noise so I unintstalled the realtek driver (later I figured out the issue was just that I needed to force 2-channel PCM sound, so that is kinda my fault). 

 

Now, ever since I uninstalled the driver, and I mean immediately after it uninstalled and the sound went out, I hear a soft hiss from the speakers. It's really faint, but enough to notice even with some ambient noise in the room. I'm wondering if anyone knows why that may be happening.

 

Once the computer restarted, it loaded the default HD Audio drivers and it was still hissing. Reloaded Realtek and still hissing. Rolled back to before the uninstallation with System Restore, still hissing. Unplugged the DAC and all cables, then plugged everything back in, still hissing. 

 

Anyone have any idea how to stop it or what it could be?

 

Thanks

To confirm you were having pops and crackles related to latency before the DAC? I was too and was unable to fix it despite updating nearly every part of my system, turning off drivers, etc. Did the DAC actually help reduce the latency issues and remove the popping?? 

If so, I may just have to break down and pick up a good DAC. 

[jasonmdylan]

18 hours ago, unknownmiscreant said:

Did you also power the speakers off an AC USB adapter. Try power both the speakers and DAC off different adapters and try both the 3.5mm on board jacks and the DAC.

The speakers are on an AC adapter. It's an Philips amBX system, so you need both a power and USB connection for them. So both the speakers and USB are on separate adapters. I've even moved the speakers to one power strip and the DAC to another.

 

I have also tried both 3.5mm jacks on the board. Even with getting the latency under control, it still crackles via the 3.5mm jacks. That's the reason I finally bought the DAC. If I plugged my soundbar into the optical out, no problems. My speakers however, don't have an optical input.

 

8 hours ago, CrippledROBOT said:

To confirm you were having pops and crackles related to latency before the DAC? I was too and was unable to fix it despite updating nearly every part of my system, turning off drivers, etc. Did the DAC actually help reduce the latency issues and remove the popping?? 

If so, I may just have to break down and pick up a good DAC. 

Yes. The post dwindled off, but here was my original issue: 

 

 

Anyway, like I said above, I got the latency under control where it would stop spiking in LatencyMon and stay where it should. It didn't fix the crackling though. Unless I was on another output: optical, etc.)

 

The DAC did help and worked fine and gave perfect sound until I was stupid and uninstalled/reinstalled audio drivers. Now, the only problem with the DAC is that slight hiss. 

[CrippledROBOT]

15 hours ago, jasonmdylan said:

The speakers are on an AC adapter. It's an Philips amBX system, so you need both a power and USB connection for them. So both the speakers and USB are on separate adapters. I've even moved the speakers to one power strip and the DAC to another.

 

I have also tried both 3.5mm jacks on the board. Even with getting the latency under control, it still crackles via the 3.5mm jacks. That's the reason I finally bought the DAC. If I plugged my soundbar into the optical out, no problems. My speakers however, don't have an optical input.

 

Yes. The post dwindled off, but here was my original issue: 

 

 

Anyway, like I said above, I got the latency under control where it would stop spiking in LatencyMon and stay where it should. It didn't fix the crackling though. Unless I was on another output: optical, etc.)

 

The DAC did help and worked fine and gave perfect sound until I was stupid and uninstalled/reinstalled audio drivers. Now, the only problem with the DAC is that slight hiss. 

Huh. I actually managed to fix the issue by updating my ethernet driver believe it or not. 

[jasonmdylan]

On 11/14/2017 at 11:59 AM, CrippledROBOT said:

Huh. I actually managed to fix the issue by updating my ethernet driver believe it or not. 

I tried that myself. Glad it worked for you. No dice for me.

[KaminKevCrew]

2 hours ago, jasonmdylan said:

I tried that myself. Glad it worked for you. No dice for me.

it's probably a noise floor issue

[jasonmdylan]

5 hours ago, KaminKevCrew said:

it's probably a noise floor issue

I appreciate the possible solution, but if the hiss originates from the speakers, then it can't be ambient noise. If you put you ear close to the speakers, the hiss is very pronounced. If I move away and sit at the desk normally, it's still there, just slightly lighter as I'm further away. Doesn't matter if it's noon or 2am. The other thing about that is that it didn't start to hiss until I uninstalled the Realtek drivers. Before that it was fine.

[KaminKevCrew]

7 hours ago, jasonmdylan said:

I appreciate the possible solution, but if the hiss originates from the speakers, then it can't be ambient noise. If you put you ear close to the speakers, the hiss is very pronounced. If I move away and sit at the desk normally, it's still there, just slightly lighter as I'm further away. Doesn't matter if it's noon or 2am. The other thing about that is that it didn't start to hiss until I uninstalled the Realtek drivers. Before that it was fine.

If it's coming from the speakers, then it's a noise floor issue.

 

The term "noise floor" refers to the quietest sound that the amp or DAC is able to produce. If the speakers in question are sensitive enough, they will produce sound even when nothing is playing, as the dac/amp (though, it's almost 100% of the time the amp) have some level of self noise that will get through to the speaker.

 

As for it only starting when you uninstalled the drivers, I would hazard a guess that that's caused by the drivers actually turning the amp off when it's not playing sound, in order to make the issue unnoticeable/harder to hear.

[unknownmiscreant]

You could try reinstall windows. Other than that, your best bet my be to get a better DAC/soundcard, one with some manufacturer drivers. (Canned solution ik, but depending on how much time you will spend sorting this out, it may be a cheaper solution overall.)

 

As for the noise floor, try play something but on really low volume, or go and download Kodi, as that has an option to always keep the audio device alive while it is open.

[jasonmdylan]

9 hours ago, KaminKevCrew said:

If it's coming from the speakers, then it's a noise floor issue.

 

The term "noise floor" refers to the quietest sound that the amp or DAC is able to produce. If the speakers in question are sensitive enough, they will produce sound even when nothing is playing, as the dac/amp (though, it's almost 100% of the time the amp) have some level of self noise that will get through to the speaker.

 

As for it only starting when you uninstalled the drivers, I would hazard a guess that that's caused by the drivers actually turning the amp off when it's not playing sound, in order to make the issue unnoticeable/harder to hear.

Ahhh... that makes a lt more sense! Thanks.

 

6 hours ago, unknownmiscreant said:

You could try reinstall windows. Other than that, your best bet my be to get a better DAC/soundcard, one with some manufacturer drivers. (Canned solution ik, but depending on how much time you will spend sorting this out, it may be a cheaper solution overall.)

 

As for the noise floor, try play something but on really low volume, or go and download Kodi, as that has an option to always keep the audio device alive while it is open.

Yeah, I'm probably going to think about getting a more expensive DAC. Thanks all

[KaminKevCrew]

On 11/16/2017 at 11:01 PM, jasonmdylan said:

Ahhh... that makes a lt more sense! Thanks.

No problem!

 

Also, if you're wanting just a DAC, look at something like a Schiit modi. If you also need to be able to run headphones, a magni/modi combo will be a good option (though you could also go for an all in one like the Fulla 2 for less money.)

 

The item that I use is my Schiit Jotunheim, and I've had no issues with it.

 

It currently has a ground loop issue, but that's not the unit itself - we just got a new house, and the wiring is super old - the wiring does not actually have a ground connection, just a hot and a neutral wire.