So this guy just told me....

[ShearMe]

Tell your friend, if he wants to save $50, he can get some HD558's

[FluffyNuggets]

Tell your friend, if he wants to save $50, he can get some HD558's

He wants wireless idiot. Keep up with that good advice there!

[MayflowerElectronics]

He wants wireless idiot. Keep up with that good advice there!

 

Yeah idiot. @ShearMe

[ShearMe]

He wants wireless idiot. Keep up with that good advice there!

Oh, I'm such an idiot yeah lol

[FluffyNuggets]

Oh, I'm such an idiot yeah lol

No argument here. 

[MayflowerElectronics]

No argument here.

I know right? So ignant.

[TofuAce]

Pfft... ATH-(AD)700x Master Race calling out the HD558/598 peasants. 

 

Edit: Master Race Edit for Victory!

[EmoRarity]

Pfft... ATH-700x Master Race calling out the HD558/598 peasants.

. With their odd and slightly muddy bass response.

[TofuAce]

. With their odd and slightly muddy bass response.

 

Forgot the AD part of the AD700... Master Race hasn't mastered long term memory.

[EmoRarity]

Forgot the AD part of the AD700... Master Race hasn't mastered long term memory.

What are words anyway.

[TofuAce]

What are words anyway.

 

 

[aithos]

Honestly, most people can't tell the difference.  In fact, I'd wager if we set up a blind test that at least some of you would fail to pick which pair was which at least some of the time.  PC sound cards are largely not developed with Audiophile quality headphones in mind, and unless you're running a separate amp you're probably not even getting the best out of your Sennheisers.  Speaking of which, the Sennheissers are nice headphones, but I wouldn't call them Audiophile level at a $200 price point.  I'd say they are enthusiast quality, but Audiophile implies high end and unless you're comparing them to something like the Sennheisser hd800's then they aren't Audiophile.

 

This just looks like a post where people can come to brag about how dumb the pleebs are when really they aren't much better.  I mean who sits down to listen to music with headphones anyway, real audio enthusiasts have an impressive home theater system...

[TofuAce]

...unless you're running a separate amp you're probably not even getting the best out of your Sennheisers.  Speaking of which, the Sennheissers are nice headphones, but I wouldn't call them Audiophile level at a $200 price point.  I'd say they are enthusiast quality, but Audiophile implies high end and unless you're comparing them to something like the Sennheisser hd800's then they aren't Audiophile.

 

... I mean who sits down to listen to music with headphones anyway, real audio enthusiasts have an impressive home theater system...

 

 

Glad I'm not an audiophile or a real audio enthusiast then. I'm too cheap and enjoy making music more than paying to listen. Heh, must be my non-golden musician ears.

[ShearMe]

Honestly, most people can't tell the difference. In fact, I'd wager if we set up a blind test that at least some of you would fail to pick which pair was which at least some of the time. PC sound cards are largely not developed with Audiophile quality headphones in mind, and unless you're running a separate amp you're probably not even getting the best out of your Sennheisers. Speaking of which, the Sennheissers are nice headphones, but I wouldn't call them Audiophile level at a $200 price point. I'd say they are enthusiast quality, but Audiophile implies high end and unless you're comparing them to something like the Sennheisser hd800's then they aren't Audiophile.

This just looks like a post where people can come to brag about how dumb the pleebs are when really they aren't much better. I mean who sits down to listen to music with headphones anyway, real audio enthusiasts have an impressive home theater system...

People like you are what's wrong with the audio industry. Money does not equal quality.

[MayflowerElectronics]

People like you are what's wrong with the audio industry. Money does not equal quality.

 

I was just about to say the same. Some of the best headphones I've heard have all been under $200, some of the worst have been above $500. *Beyerdynamic T1's*

[aithos]

People like you are what's wrong with the audio industry. Money does not equal quality.

 

There isn't a direct relationship between money and quality, but if you think that as the price increases the average quality level doesn't go up then you're either in denial or uninformed. People like me are what are wrong with the audio industry? And what exactly does that mean, what do you know about me?  If I was less mature I'd be insulted.  Let's make something very clear, I'm not judging anyone here, the Sennheisser's are very nice headphones and I've considered getting them for my gaming setup.  That doesn't make them fit the definition of Audiophile and it isn't an insult to either them or anyone who owns them.  The definition of a piece of Audiophile equipment is at a very basic level "high end audio".  It is what it is, don't get all upset over a distinction in terminology.

 

I was just about to say the same. Some of the best headphones I've heard have all been under $200, some of the worst have been above $500. *Beyerdynamic T1's*

 

This is completely subjective.  Where did you hear it?  What did you listen to?  How was it set up?  Did you directly compare the two headsets under the same listening environment?  If you want to compare a $200 headset to a $500 dollar headset meaningfully you need to be able to answer all those questions and more.  Let's face it, most people who come to forums like this are "enthusiasts" not "audiophiles" .  This is a technology forum, not an audio forum.  I'm not trying to insult or belittle anyone here, but people throw around terms like it's going out of style and it's pretty silly most of the time.

 

The OP in this case came in specifically to belittle someone else and act like a snob over a $200 pair of headphones.  I was simply trying to make a point here and instead I get insulted.  I could have come in and bragged about what I've got and how much better it is than anything anyone else in here owns, I didn't do that because it's rude.  Yeah, I'm an audiophile (second generation) and I take pride in what I have, but creating a thread specifically to insult someone you know isn't a very mature thing to do, and neither is making a sweeping statement that is insulting.

 

When it comes right down to it, money does equal quality.  Companies that make premium gear are only able to charge more because their components are significantly better.  Saying money doesn't equal quality is like comparing a Kia to a Porsche.  Can the Kia do everything the Porsche does?  Sure, but can it do it as well and in style and comfort?  Not a chance in hell.  There comes a point where price accelerates faster than function, the $200 Sennheisser is well below that point.  I will say though, that the Sennheisser is much better than it's price indicates, and it does compete very well with headsets that are quite a bit more expensive, but that's not a general thing..that's a function of the brand and R&D that they spend on their higher end models that trickles down over generations to their other products.

 

Edit: Also, I picked the HD800 to mention because it's the ridiculous flagship product.  Even if I wanted to spend an absurd amount of money on headphones I'd never consider them.  They just aren't practical unless money is literally no object.  In the first place, audio money is far better spent on a home theater setup and not a pair of headphones unless you're in a location where you literally cannot use a real stereo.

[MayflowerElectronics]

There isn't a direct relationship between money and quality, but if you think that as the price increases the average quality level doesn't go up then you're either in denial or uninformed. People like me are what are wrong with the audio industry? And what exactly does that mean, what do you know about me?  If I was less mature I'd be insulted.  Let's make something very clear, I'm not judging anyone here, the Sennheisser's are very nice headphones and I've considered getting them for my gaming setup.  That doesn't make them fit the definition of Audiophile and it isn't an insult to either them or anyone who owns them.  The definition of a piece of Audiophile equipment is at a very basic level "high end audio".  It is what it is, don't get all upset over a distinction in terminology.

 

 

This is completely subjective.  Where did you hear it?  What did you listen to?  How was it set up?  Did you directly compare the two headsets under the same listening environment?  If you want to compare a $200 headset to a $500 dollar headset meaningfully you need to be able to answer all those questions and more.  Let's face it, most people who come to forums like this are "enthusiasts" not "audiophiles" .  This is a technology forum, not an audio forum.  I'm not trying to insult or belittle anyone here, but people throw around terms like it's going out of style and it's pretty silly most of the time.

 

The OP in this case came in specifically to belittle someone else and act like a snob over a $200 pair of headphones.  I was simply trying to make a point here and instead I get insulted.  I could have come in and bragged about what I've got and how much better it is than anything anyone else in here owns, I didn't do that because it's rude.  Yeah, I'm an audiophile (second generation) and I take pride in what I have, but creating a thread specifically to insult someone you know isn't a very mature thing to do, and neither is making a sweeping statement that is insulting.

 

When it comes right down to it, money does equal quality.  Companies that make premium gear are only able to charge more because their components are significantly better.  Saying money doesn't equal quality is like comparing a Kia to a Porsche.  Can the Kia do everything the Porsche does?  Sure, but can it do it as well and in style and comfort?  Not a chance in hell.  There comes a point where price accelerates faster than function, the $200 Sennheisser is well below that point.  I will say though, that the Sennheisser is much better than it's price indicates, and it does compete very well with headsets that are quite a bit more expensive, but that's not a general thing..that's a function of the brand and R&D that they spend on their higher end models that trickles down over generations to their other products.

 

Man is this going to be a repeat of last night?

 

Anything you say about audio is subjective. Each headphone will sound differently depending on who listens to it. I'm not going to sit here and describe to you exactly what I was doing because I'm sure no one cares, and it's probably exactly the same as you do it. I sit down, put the headphones on my head and play music. I ate pizza for dinner, did you need to know that detail as well? This is actually the audio forum, it says it right when you click on it. It just happens to be a sub-forum of a technology forum.

 

Money does not equal quality. Referring to the car analogy - Sure the Kia doesn't look as good or comfortable (highly debatable depending on which model but let's not detail skew your argument) but I'll place a bet that the Kia will last longer than a Porsche. To me that's quality. How long your car will last, or in this analogy, how good the headphones sound, is what I'm getting at. Sure, sub $200 headphones don't have ring drivers, molded from aluminium or anything else like that, but in the end, sound quality is 90% of a factor in a headphone IMO. 

 

Listening to headphones from $30-1000 I've noticed a few things which is that most high-end headphones don't sound much better than their lower tier counter parts. I prefer the DT990's over the $1500 T1's. That's my opinion, and I asked a few friends/family and they confirmed this. There are a few rare headphones that are actually worth the $1000 price tag (LCD2's) but again, people will dis-agree.

[ShearMe]

[snippity]

 

More expensive headphones are better built, yes, but whether or not they have better sound quality is, as you yourself said, completely subjective. If you want to get into semantics, "Audiophile" means lover of music, not lover of audio equipment, so technically no headphone or speaker setup will be up to an audiophile's standards because they cannot reproduce live sound without some form of distortion.

 

I think everyone's on edge from last night's... discussion... so, sorry if we offended; probably could have said things a little nicer.  :unsure:

[TofuAce]

"There isn't a direct relationship between money and quality"

 

...

 

"When it comes right down to it, money does equal quality."

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

"If I was less mature I'd be insulted."

 

...

 

"I was simply trying to make a point here and instead I get insulted."

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

"Let's make something very clear, I'm not judging anyone here"

 

...

 

"This just looks like a post where people can come to brag about how dumb the pleebs are when really they aren't much better."

 

 

 

 

- aithos, 2013. Audiophile of the Year

 

 

http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2012/04/what-we-hear.html - The only response to aithos that is needed.

[aithos]

Man is this going to be a repeat of last night?

 

Anything you say about audio is subjective. Each headphone will sound differently depending on who listens to it. I'm not going to sit here and describe to you exactly what I was doing because I'm sure no one cares, and it's probably exactly the same as you do it. I sit down, put the headphones on my head and play music. I ate pizza for dinner, did you need to know that detail as well? This is actually the audio forum, it says it right when you click on it. It just happens to be a sub-forum of a technology forum.

 

Money does not equal quality. Referring to the car analogy - Sure the Kia doesn't look as good or comfortable (highly debatable depending on which model but let's not detail skew your argument) but I'll place a bet that the Kia will last longer than a Porsche. To me that's quality. How long your car will last, or in this analogy, how good the headphones sound, is what I'm getting at. Sure, sub $200 headphones don't have ring drivers, molded from aluminium or anything else like that, but in the end, sound quality is 90% of a factor in a headphone IMO. 

 

Listening to headphones from $30-1000 I've noticed a few things which is that most high-end headphones don't sound much better than their lower tier counter parts. I prefer the DT990's over the $1500 T1's. That's my opinion, and I asked a few friends/family and they confirmed this. There are a few rare headphones that are actually worth the $1000 price tag (LCD2's) but again, people will dis-agree.

 

I think you missed the point of what I was getting at.  First of all, you can't really compare longevity to sound quality.  Of course a Porsche will last as long as a Kia, I can tell you right now the quality control on the Porsche is a lot higher than a Kia, and at any rate it's how you treat something that determines how long it lasts.  You don't drive your Porsche every day through snow on gravel roads with giant pot-holes, you drive it on nice sunny days on a well kept road with the top down and the wind blowing through your hair.

 

But back to audio, what I was trying to get at is that your opinion (like all audio) is highly subjective.  When you talk about headphones specifically they don't all pair the same way with the same equipment, so that's awesome you prefer DT990's over T1's, but did you specifically set out to try to hear them at their respective bests?  Never mind the fact that people have different preferences for tone, headphones all excel at different types of applications, that is what makes it so subjective.  All my original post was trying to get at is that the OP should't have come in here with the express intent of belittling someone and then acted like a snob about it.

[aithos]

More expensive headphones are better built, yes, but whether or not they have better sound quality is, as you yourself said, completely subjective. If you want to get into semantics, "Audiophile" means lover of music, not lover of audio equipment, so technically no headphone or speaker setup will be up to an audiophile's standards because they cannot reproduce live sound without some form of distortion.

 

I think everyone's on edge from last night's... discussion... so, sorry if we offended; probably could have said things a little nicer.  :unsure:

 

I have no idea what discussion happened last night....I wasn't here, I didn't take part.

[aithos]

- aithos, 2013. Audiophile of the Year

 

 

http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2012/04/what-we-hear.html - The only response to aithos that is needed.

 

LOL.  I guess I didn't phrase things very well.  I wasn't saying I felt insulted, I meant that the post was insulting if you get the distinction.  The money comment was meant to be taken as there isn't a direct correlation between an increase in price and tangible quality, but as you increase in price you get a general increase in quality.  The idea being that it isn't a 1:1 relationship where every increase in price brings an increase in quality.  But if you compare a $50 headphone to a $300 headphone you're going to get an increase in quality, that's all I meant.  As for my final post, I meant that I wasn't literally judging people, I don't know you or the OP, but the original post was pretty offensive.

 

I apologize if I didn't do a very good job of making my meaning clear, sometimes I word things poorly.

[MayflowerElectronics]

I think you missed the point of what I was getting at.  First of all, you can't really compare longevity to sound quality.  Of course a Porsche will last as long as a Kia, I can tell you right now the quality control on the Porsche is a lot higher than a Kia, and at any rate it's how you treat something that determines how long it lasts.  You don't drive your Porsche every day through snow on gravel roads with giant pot-holes, you drive it on nice sunny days on a well kept road with the top down and the wind blowing through your hair.

 

But back to audio, what I was trying to get at is that your opinion (like all audio) is highly subjective.  When you talk about headphones specifically they don't all pair the same way with the same equipment, so that's awesome you prefer DT990's over T1's, but did you specifically set out to try to hear them at their respective bests?  Never mind the fact that people have different preferences for tone, headphones all excel at different types of applications, that is what makes it so subjective.  All my original post was trying to get at is that the OP should't have come in here with the express intent of belittling someone and then acted like a snob about it.

 

Yes, I use the o2/ODAC for all of my testing, which is as good as it gets. I know how to listen to audio.

[aithos]

Yes, I use the o2/ODAC for all of my testing, which is as good as it gets. I know how to listen to audio.

 

What I was trying to say is that different headphones pair better with different amps, your experience using your setup may not be the same as someone elses.  I'm not discounting your opinion, and you're welcome to it...I don't take issue with what you have to say at all.  I take issue with how the OP expressed his/her opinion and how people were talking after that, it was like a bunch of children on a schoolyard whispering about how dumb the one kid is without regard to how that kid might feel.  I was trying to point out that a lot of times people who act like that...aren't very knowledgeable themselves and someone might be making fun of them the same way.

 

You're obviously more knowledgeable than most people, so again, we don't have any problem here...my point wasn't really about the audio quality.  I don't disagree that the Sennheisser 598 are much better than a gaming headset, that's pretty obviously true...

[TofuAce]

"OP should't have come in here with the express intent of belittling someone and then acted like a snob about it."

...

"This just looks like a post where people can come to brag about how dumb the pleebs are when really they aren't much better."

...

I'd say they are enthusiast quality, but Audiophile implies high end and unless you're comparing them to something like the Sennheisser hd800's then they aren't Audiophile.

...

I mean who sits down to listen to music with headphones anyway, real audio enthusiasts have an impressive home theater system...

 

http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2012/04/what-we-hear.html - The only response to aithos that is needed.