How to get rid of speaker hum/buzz?

[zfrnz]

Hello LinusTechTips forum,

 

With the computer I built a few months ago, I produce music. Until then, I was producing off of a crappy $400 laptop I got four years ago. I have a Focusrite 2i4 and a pair of KRK Rokit 5's. Even with the old laptop, I had an occasional coming from the speakers even when I'm not playing any audio, but it got much worse when I built the computer. I have a constant hum coming from the speakers while idle and some more noise when I move the mouse. It gets a tiny louder and worse as the intensity of the workload increases (more synths, tracks, more programs open in background, etc), and it's annoying to monitor audio with the noise. I've tried to ignore it up until Christmas, when I acquired a GTX 1060. I tried a couple games out, like GTA V and Minecraft with shaders (they're only PC games I have, I'm not much of a gamer ). When the GPU fans kick in and the system is under load, the speakers produce a terrible loud high pitched squeal that makes it difficult to concentrate on the audio or even have the speakers on. The noise changes in pitch when I move the mouse to look around in game. It literally sounds like a chainsaw.

 

My cable management is pretty good and no audio cables are touching any power cables. I also am sure it's from my computer, as I can drive the speakers from my phone with no problem at all.

 

I brought this up to a friend of mine who is a bit more knowledgeable in the audio realm, and he said to try some balanced 1/4 TRS cables instead of the unbalanced TS 1/4 cables that I am using now. I looked into this and in theory, it should work. However, a few reviews for the balanced cables stated that they did not fully destroy the hum. Also, my friend is working off of a MacBook Air, which is definitely less power hungry than my beast of a PC, and that probably means less hum in general.

 

This hum/squeal really hurts my ability to produce and even use the speakers in general, and I want it gone! Does anyone have any suggestions besides the balanced cables? Can anyone confirm that the balanced cables will work? Thanks in advance.

 

TL;DR - Computer makes speakers produce a hum while idle and a worse squeal while under load, need help getting rid of it

 

(sounds are attached)

HumIdle.wav

HumGpuUnderLoad.wav

[johnt]

59 minutes ago, zfrnz said:

-snip-

Have you considered using a DAC? I think you might be experiencing some heavy electrical interference from the components inside your case.

[GreenZombie]

Use RFI & EMI shielded power supply. Switch to fluorescent lamps to something else. If the monitor has a built-in AC adapter to check its shielding. Be sure to connect all the devices RFI / EMI protected earthed. Do not use a threaded connection to earth, but to the grounding system at one point. Do not under any circumstances use the "least expensive" audio cables, but well enough protected / insulated.

I had a similar type of problem with the previous active speakers. found a solution to the problem ...... 20lb sledgehammer.

[zfrnz]

3 hours ago, JohnT said:

Have you considered using a DAC? I think you might be experiencing some heavy electrical interference from the components inside your case.

How would a dac help with electrical interference?

 

If I got one, would I be able to use both the dac and the audio interface at once or does the dac act in place of the interface?

[zfrnz]

34 minutes ago, GreenZombie said:

Use RFI & EMI shielded power supply. Switch to fluorescent lamps to something else. If the monitor has a built-in AC adapter to check its shielding. Be sure to connect all the devices RFI / EMI protected earthed. Do not use a threaded connection to earth, but to the grounding system at one point. Do not under any circumstances use the "least expensive" audio cables, but well enough protected / insulated.

I had a similar type of problem with the previous active speakers. found a solution to the problem ...... 20lb sledgehammer.

Not the most fluent in your electrical terms...

 

So if I were hook my speakers up to one of these mofos, it would fix everything? All of my components are hooked up to one surge protector/power strip, 

 

I definitely need better cables, though, the cables I have are just random ones I had lying around.

 

Back to the original question, would balanced 1/4 cables potentially help fix the problem?

[Brennan Price]

Try these steps, they may help you more than me trying to explain it all to you 

http://www.psaudio.com/ps_how/how-to-find-and-fix-hum/

[zfrnz]

12 minutes ago, Brennan_Price said:

Try these steps, they may help you more than me trying to explain it all to you 

http://www.psaudio.com/ps_how/how-to-find-and-fix-hum/

Thanks! It's definitely a ground loop...

 

I think I'm gonna experiment with some new cables before I spend $70 on a HumX

[Brennan Price]

3 minutes ago, zfrnz said:

Thanks! It's definitely a ground loop...

 

I think I'm gonna experiment with some new cables before I spend $70 on a HumX

Ok, thats sounds good. I had the very same problem with a cheap pair of speakers that I once had. I bought an audio amp and some new bookshelf speakers and it sorted the problem.

[GreenZombie]

41 minutes ago, zfrnz said:

Not the most fluent in your electrical terms...

 

So if I were hook my speakers up to one of these mofos, it would fix everything? All of my components are hooked up to one surge protector/power strip, 

 

I definitely need better cables, though, the cables I have are just random ones I had lying around.

 

Back to the original question, would balanced 1/4 cables potentially help fix the problem?

RFI=radio frequency interference

EMI=Electromagnetic interference

 

Yes Balanced cables to the matter. Protected extension cords make such APC, Belkin etc. local hi-fi shop can also buy overpriced power supply systems. I use APC power supply systems. Below is a link, which may be of help.

 

http://www.apc.com/shop/us/en/categories/power/audio-video-solutions/av-power-filters/_/N-1fwutn1

 

[GamerDude]

I have a Rokit5 G3 too, hooked up to my Oppo HA-1 which, in turn, is hooked up to my rig via a USB cable. I've not had any issue with it even though I was using some spare old RCA cables I had lying around. Recently, I was given a passive Sony subwoofer and a NHT SA-2 subwoofer amplifier. With the SA-2 hooked up in my audio chain, there was a noticeable interference even when the I was only at desktop. Playing games would result in buzz/hum/crackling, the interference was even worse using my Fostex HP-A4 (variable preamp out) hooked up to my Oppo HA-1 via those crap RCA cables. I have a sinking suspicion that the Rokit5 isn't very well shielded and tends to pick up interference (not sure as I'm no electrical engineer, hence it's just a suspicion).

 

I'd gotten some cheap custom cables (Canare cable from Japan, Amphenol RCA plugs) and it help a good deal though there was still some interference on my Fostex HP-A4 to NHT SA-2 to Oppo HA-1 to Rokit5 G3. When I got rid of the NHT SA-5 from the audio chain, the interence was much reduced to the point where I'd only hear it whilst gaming (not that bad), perhaps it's the infamous coil whine issue.......I can't say. I have very 'dirty' power supply in my neck of the woods (in what can be said to be the equivalent of the boondocks). So, I have no choice but to invest in line conditioners (a Castle line conditioner and a Monster Surge protector/line conditioner from years ago when I was into Monster  ) as well as better cables (I guess similar to Monoprice ones). I've also gone the extra mile and bought a number of ferrite chokes to mount on my power cables to help remove any more interference....these chokes are mounted on cables for my Oppo HA-1, Rokit5 G3's, and even on power cables to the PSU on my rigs.

[johnt]

10 hours ago, zfrnz said:

How would a dac help with electrical interference?

 

If I got one, would I be able to use both the dac and the audio interface at once or does the dac act in place of the interface?

Because it moves the conversion outside of your case and away from the devices that could be causing interference inside your PC.

 

What do you mean audio interface? A DAC is basically a sound card that outputs a line-level output. You can still use Windows to control volume. Typically an amplifier is required with a DAC, unless it is built-in, or (in your case) you have active speakers with built-in amps.

[Pomfinator]

9 minutes ago, JohnT said:

Because it moves the conversion outside of your case and away from the devices that could be causing interference inside your PC.

 

What do you mean audio interface? A DAC is basically a sound card that outputs a line-level output. You can still use Windows to control volume. Typically an amplifier is required with a DAC, unless it is built-in, or (in your case) you have active speakers with built-in amps.

OP already has an audio interface, the monitors are hooked up to them, the buzz is still there with the interface.

[johnt]

1 minute ago, Pomfinator said:

OP already has an audio interface, the monitors are hooked up to them, the buzz is still there with the interface.

Yes for his microphone. The OP is having issues with output. 

 

I guess the question is, is the OP using on-board sound for output or his Focusrite?

[zfrnz]

4 hours ago, JohnT said:

Yes for his microphone. The OP is having issues with output. 

 

I guess the question is, is the OP using on-board sound for output or his Focusrite?

I'm using my Focusrite for output, never onboard

[zfrnz]

Thank you to everyone who has replied. You all have been of great help!

[anothertom]

If it is a ground loop you should be able to fix this by having the PC, the 2i4 and the speakers powered from the same extension cable using proper 3 pin grounded connectors (if US then a grounded plugs and sockets at each point). 

 

Otherwise using stereo/balanced jack's between the 2i4 and the speakers, since they both have this option, should solve this in a different, but valid, way. (Read up on differential signaling for more info)

[zfrnz]

59 minutes ago, anothertom said:

If it is a ground loop you should be able to fix this by having the PC, the 2i4 and the speakers powered from the same extension cable using proper 3 pin grounded connectors (if US then a grounded plugs and sockets at each point). 

 

Otherwise using stereo/balanced jack's between the 2i4 and the speakers, since they both have this option, should solve this in a different, but valid, way. (Read up on differential signaling for more info)

Thanks!

 

Everything is connected to the same power strip, and all have the 3 pin plug, and the sounds persist 

 

I am definitely going to order some balanced cables, hopefully that helps

[Audio Carnage]

DAC, RFI & EMI, WTF seriously guys !?!

LOL what a bunch of noobs!

Sounds like a ground-loop to me. Just get a trafo/isolator and you are fine:
http://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/art-dti

[zfrnz]

15 hours ago, Audio Carnage said:

DAC, RFI & EMI, WTF seriously guys !?!

LOL what a bunch of noobs!

Sounds like a ground-loop to me. Just get a trafo/isolator and you are fine:
http://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/art-dti

Thank you!

 

I'm gonna see if some balanced 1/4 inch cables helps at all before looking into one of these kinds of things

[KenjiUmino]

2 hours ago, zfrnz said:

Thank you!

 

I'm gonna see if some balanced 1/4 inch cables helps at all before looking into one of these kinds of things

try balanced cables and if that does not help then look for an inexpensive isolator (direct input box) that has a "ground lift" function - does not have to be a top of the line active box but the ground lift seems to be important.

 

I did some tests at work the other day and flipping the "ground lift" switch on our passive DI box fixed noise problems with yamaha HS series monitor speakers that even had noise when a dedicated audio interface and balanced connection was used (we used a M-audio fast track pro for testing) 

 

getting computers and monitor speakers to play nice with each other is very problematic - anyone wants to guess how many supposedly "faulty" speakers i get to my desk at work because of this ?

ground connection is just one of the many problems - switching type power converters / regulators also might introduce noise to the signal chain even affecting other equippment that is not directly connected to the PC in any way - the band i am with recorded some songs recently and we had the bass amp produce static sounds and rustle at random until we unplugged the laptop from the mains (bass amp was not electrically connected to the laptop in any way other than both wall sockets probably sharing the same power line)

 

this is not a typical "ground issue" as it can also happen with any standard issue phone charger (wich usually only have your countrys default 2 pin plugs on them with no ground/earth contacts at all)

[zfrnz]

22 hours ago, KenjiUmino said:

try balanced cables and if that does not help then look for an inexpensive isolator (direct input box) that has a "ground lift" function - does not have to be a top of the line active box but the ground lift seems to be important.

 

I did some tests at work the other day and flipping the "ground lift" switch on our passive DI box fixed noise problems with yamaha HS series monitor speakers that even had noise when a dedicated audio interface and balanced connection was used (we used a M-audio fast track pro for testing) 

 

getting computers and monitor speakers to play nice with each other is very problematic - anyone wants to guess how many supposedly "faulty" speakers i get to my desk at work because of this ?

ground connection is just one of the many problems - switching type power converters / regulators also might introduce noise to the signal chain even affecting other equippment that is not directly connected to the PC in any way - the band i am with recorded some songs recently and we had the bass amp produce static sounds and rustle at random until we unplugged the laptop from the mains (bass amp was not electrically connected to the laptop in any way other than both wall sockets probably sharing the same power line)

 

this is not a typical "ground issue" as it can also happen with any standard issue phone charger (wich usually only have your countrys default 2 pin plugs on them with no ground/earth contacts at all)

Thanks for the reply! 

 

I ordered some balanced cables, hopefully I won't have to pick up an isolation transformer.

[zfrnz]

The balanced cables removed almost all of the hum. It is not noticeable unless I really listen and put my ear up against the cone. Thanks for the help!