A giant bundle of soundcard questions

[Makaseo]

To keep it short, I've got:

Presonus Audiobox USB hooked up to 2x Yamaha HS50M's

and a pair of M50's driven by a cheap Behringer HA400.

 

My setup has served me well for a long time, but the interface and amp are pretty basic--the cheapest I could find that weren't complete rubbish.

 

Now since I've moved from a MacBook Pro to a desktop, I'm considering a PCI or PCI-E soundcard. Sadly, I'm completely new to the desktop audio scene and have no idea what I'm looking at.

What would be my best bet around or under $150? Or would anything at that price range be a downgrade?

 

I'm also not sure how the 5.1 or 7.1 outputs on these cards work--would I be able to have RCA or TRS outputs from two of them act as L/R mono outputs and still use one for stereo headphone outs? So far only the Essence STX's outputs really make sense to me while others like the DX and DGX with their surround sound outs don't.

 

I've also been reading some people on this lovely forum say that external is always better than internal. Is this mainly because of EMI from the PC components? I have my DAC + amp fairly close to my PC as it is, and don't really hear much interference, but I can see why it might be worse when there's no proper shielding or distance. Or is it due to the subpar-quality headphone amps on them? As long an amp can drive my headphones and keep the sound character fairly neutral, it'll suit my needs.

 

I should mention that the reason I'm considering going internal is because I find myself moving my PC between two places every so often, and the extra hardware is an inconvenience.

 

Any answers, comments, or recommendations are a huge help. I know these questions might be a bit much, but I figured I could get at least some help from everyone here.

 

Thanks in advance for any advice!

[Godlygamer23]

If you're worried about EMI, get a sound card with an EMI shield on it. They work. And there's many variations that can cause EMI. For sound cards, Creative offers their new Sound Blaster Z cards. I'm using their Sound Blaster Z card(the cheapest one) and it works quite well.

[ShearMe]

A 7.1 card normally has six 3.5mm jacks.

One for line in
One for mic in
One for normal stereo which doubles as the front L/R speakers in a surround setup
One for center speaker and subwoofer
One for side L/R
One for back L/R

External setups really keep the EMI down simply by being outside of the PC, and if they have their own power supply that helps immensely as well. I'd recommend trying out your on board audio for awhile and see how it compares to your external setup. You shouldn't be using those headphones with that amp, however. The impedance recommendation is minimum 80 ohms, while the M50s are rated at 38 - on board might actually be better!

And that Presonus isn't meant to be a DAC, but rather an ADC. I guess it works if it works though - you wont get any better sound out of your speakers with a different DAC or soundcard. ;)

[Helltech]

External DAC > Soundcards IMO. Yes the EMI, but mainly driver support. When you move your PC between places is the second place permanent? Or is only for like a day or two at a time? if so you could get something like an E17 just for transporting. 

[Makaseo]

A 7.1 card normally has six 3.5mm jacks.

One for line in

One for mic in

One for normal stereo which doubles as the front L/R speakers in a surround setup

One for center speaker and subwoofer

One for side L/R

One for back L/R

External setups really keep the EMI down simply by being outside of the PC, and if they have their own power supply that helps immensely as well. I'd recommend trying out your on board audio for awhile and see how it compares to your external setup. You shouldn't be using those headphones with that amp, however. The impedance recommendation is minimum 80 ohms, while the M50s are rated at 38 - on board might actually be better!

And that Presonus isn't meant to be a DAC, but rather an ADC. I guess it works if it works though - you wont get any better sound out of your speakers with a different DAC or soundcard. ;)

 

Thanks for the detailed info!

Just to clarify, though: would I be able to take one stereo out and split to L/R RCA and use another one for headphones? Or would I have to use the front panel headers connected to the sound card?

Also, wouldn't the Presonus be a DAC as well as an ADC if it has both mic ins and balanced TRS outs?

I guess I was expecting soundcards not to be better than my current setup. My concern at this point is, would getting something like a Xonar DX (if I can use it the way I'm assuming I can) be any worse?

[ShearMe]

Just to clarify, though: would I be able to take one stereo out and split to L/R RCA and use another one for headphones? Or would I have to use the front panel headers connected to the sound card?

 

Some soundcards/drivers allow you to switch what the jacks do, but I am unsure of specific examples to recommend for this purpose.  :(

 

 

Also, wouldn't the Presonus be a DAC as well as an ADC if it has both mic ins and balanced TRS outs?

 

I looked at the very undetailed spec details on their website - said it had a line level output but didn't specify what it was outputting. If you're successfully using it as a DAC as well then they should really update their feature list to include this! 

 

 

I guess I was expecting soundcards not to be better than my current setup. My concern at this point is, would getting something like a Xonar DX (if I can use it the way I'm assuming I can) be any worse?

 

The DX doesn't have a headphone amp, but that probably wont be a big deal with the M50s.

 

Other than EMI it shouldn't be much different than your current setup, and EMI might not even be a big deal in your computer. In all honesty, there's not a huge difference between audio sources now-a-days. It's mostly about getting one that doesn't have a design flaw that brings down the house, and making sure you have all the features you want. This is why I said and am saying again: try out your on board audio before you buy anything else. If you don't like it, all you've spent is time.  ;)

[Godlygamer23]

EMI does matter. And people can be affected by it.

[Makaseo]

Some soundcards/drivers allow you to switch what the jacks do, but I am unsure of specific examples to recommend for this purpose.  :(

 

 

 

I looked at the very undetailed spec details on their website - said it had a line level output but didn't specify what it was outputting. If you're successfully using it as a DAC as well then they should really update their feature list to include this! 

 

 

 

The DX doesn't have a headphone amp, but that probably wont be a big deal with the M50s.

 

Other than EMI it shouldn't be much different than your current setup, and EMI might not even be a big deal in your computer. In all honesty, there's not a huge difference between audio sources now-a-days. It's mostly about getting one that doesn't have a design flaw that brings down the house, and making sure you have all the features you want. This is why I said and am saying again: try out your on board audio before you buy anything else. If you don't like it, all you've spent is time.  ;)

 

Yeah, from what I know, most production audio interfaces act as DACs and ADCs.

 

I'll definitely take your advice and try out the onboard audio for a good while. Can I assume that any soundcard will sound better than my UD3H's Realtek chipset?

 

Thanks for all the advice, by the way. It's been extremely helpful so far.

[ShearMe]

EMI does matter. And people can be affected by it.

 

What I'm saying is, there might not be much EMI to cause enough of a disturbance with a DX. Who knows?

 

 

Yeah, from what I know, most production audio interfaces act as DACs and ADCs.

 

I'll definitely take your advice and try out the onboard audio for a good while. Can I assume that any soundcard will sound better than my UD3H's Realtek chipset?

 

It's not the chip that matters, mostly, because there's very little difference between a $0.50 chip and a $0.75 chip. :D Still, I'd say almost any card will probably sound better, but the bigger question is, "Is it worth it?"

 

The reason I usually tell people to stick with on board or go external, is because the audible difference between a soundcard and an external setup is close to the difference between a sound card and on board, but you can usually buy an external product(s) in the same price range as whatever soundcard you're looking for.

 

It's like shopping for soda at the store: you can buy a one-serving bottle for a dollar, but you can also buy a 2-litter bottle for a dollar, so why the hell not?

 

 

Thanks for all the advice, by the way. It's been extremely helpful so far.

 

No problemo amigo. I recently looked at my user profile score (2/5 stars) and figured I should try to sound nicer!  :P

[h264]

No problemo amigo. I recently looked at my user profile score (2/5 stars) and figured I should try to sound nicer!  :P

 

I still have 0 stars.  What's this "nice" you speak of?

[t0wer]

I still have 0 stars.  What's this "nice" you speak of?

 

I have 4, but I don't know what they are for, and I didn't know I had them until now.

[h264]

I have 4, but I don't know what they are for, and I didn't know I had them until now.

Somebody has to rate you

[t0wer]

Somebody has to rate you

 

can I rate you, along with the whole audio section NSFW(not safe for wallet)?

but I will say it is safer than head-fi.

[h264]

This is why I said and am saying again: try out your on board audio before you buy anything else. If you don't like it, all you've spent is time.  ;)

 

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/pc-based/237049-realtek-alc1150-audio-codec-115db-snr.html

 

>TI NE5532

http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/slos075i/slos075i.pdf (page3)

 

>output impedance: 0.3 Ohms

 

Nice one, ASRock.  Keep that up and soundcards really will be obsolete.  I didn't notice this before, but I'll have to update the output impedance list on the FAQ.

[ShearMe]

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/pc-based/237049-realtek-alc1150-audio-codec-115db-snr.html

 

>TI NE5532

http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/slos075i/slos075i.pdf (page3)

 

>output impedance: 0.3 Ohms

 

Nice one, ASRock.  Keep that up and soundcards really will be obsolete.  I didn't notice this before, but I'll have to update the output impedance list on the FAQ.

 

Do you have pro Google skills or something? I can never find such detailed specs for a particular motherboard....

[h264]

Do you have pro Google skills or something? I can never find such detailed specs for a particular motherboard....

 

you literally type into google "ALC1150" and that's the first damn link.

 

then you type in "TI NE5532 spec sheet" and you get TI's spec sheet page on their website.  You do a Ctrl+f in the pdf for "output impedance"

 

so hard.

[Gorgatron]

EMI does matter. And people can be affected by it.

EMI. Not even once.

[Gorgatron]

I still have 0 stars.  What's this "nice" you speak of?

Please insert dev_driver_nice.exe

[ShearMe]

you literally type into google "ALC1150" and that's the first damn link.

 

then you type in "TI NE5532 spec sheet" and you get TI's spec sheet page on their website.  You do a Ctrl+f in the pdf for "output impedance"

 

so hard.

 

It's the fourth link for ALC1150 thank you very much.