Tried mechanical, going back to membrane

[denarced]

Hello all,

 

I thought I'd share my story on trying a mechanical keyboard. There's quite a hype at the moment about mechanical keyboards and I thought I'd share my opinion which does not conform to the generally held beliefs.

 

The short of it: I find that my old Logitech Illuminated keyboard is better than the Ducky Shine 2 that I bought in early May this year. More specifically I got DK9008S2-CFIALG with Cherry MX blue switches. I stopped using the Ducky this Monday. So you can see that I really wanted to give the mechanical one a real chance; that's almost two months of trying to get used to the blue switches.

 

My first reaction to the blue switches was that I hated them. The reason was that they felt so heavy. I literally had to change the way I type. I'm a touch typist and I just lay my palms on the keyboard's palm rest. With Ducky I couldn't do that because it was so heavy to type. I measured that it took 20g more to push the key down with the Cherry MX blue switches as compared to the Logitech. However it didn't take too long to get used to keep my palms in the air when typing and that resolved the issue.

 

I did get sort of used to typing with the Ducky after a few weeks and at this point I came to a couple of conclusions:

1. Follow Slick's and Linus' advice: try the different mechanical keyboards first if you can. Where I live I simply do not know anyone who has a modern mechanical keyboard with Cherry MX switches so for me it wasn't an option and because of it, I'm 150 euros in the hole. A coworker was able to try my keyboard and based on that he didn't buy one with blue switches so I guess it wasn't a total lost. And if it was then just for me :)
2. There's a claim going around that the tactile sensation will make you a faster typist. That claim is usually accompanied by one that says the same thing about the click sound. Just like this post, you should consider that an anecdote. Until you have some scientific research data, feel free to ignore that claim. I didn't experience any increase in my typing speed. Furthermore I measured the words / minute and it is the same which it has been for years with membrane keyboards: on average 70 words / minute.
3. I originally thought that one clear benefit of mechanical keyboards is that the keys can be removed. I liked this because then I can wash them. This is an actual benefit because with my Logitech Illuminated I actually can't put them back once I've removed them. I'm using my second Illuminated for that very reason.

All in all: no regrets. I'm not completely done with the mechanical keyboards. My coworker bought a Ducky with mostly red switches and those felt a little better. So the type of switches matter at least for a touch typist.

[sonarctica]

Some people don't like mechanical keyboards, it's just a preference people have.

 

I switched from this 10€ keyboard:

 

 

to this:

 

 

The difference was so massive that I fell in love with the G710+

[MisterZero]

I tried a many keyboards, aBlue a Black a Brown and a Red, and I must say, the one I like most is Brown, and I may want to try the Green, because I don't like the clicky noise, but like heavy keys :)
But your experience is a very good example of what Linus says, try the different switches before you buy the keyboard.

And if you want to test the switches, you can have a test kit from different manufacturers. I think WASD sells some of those.

 

Cheers :)

[GamerDude]

I tried a many keyboards, aBlue a Black a Brown and a Red, and I must say, the one I like most is Brown, and I may want to try the Green, because I don't like the clicky noise, but like heavy keys :)

But your experience is a very good example of what Linus says, try the different switches before you buy the keyboard.

And if you want to test the switches, you can have a test kit from different manufacturers. I think WASD sells some of those.

 

Cheers :)

Actually, if you don't like clicky noise, then forget Green.....I have a Trigger Green, and it's as clicky as the Blue on my QF TK, perhaps a tad more so. No matter which switch types I've used, from Red to Black to Blue to Brown to Green, I tend to bottom out when I type, and when I do....there's a 'clack' sound. I'd believed that all mechanical KB's are the same, my Model M buckling spring is loud as well, but when I tried typing on my just acquired Topre KB, man, what a difference, It is quiet....not silent, but much quieter than any Cherry switches. And the feel is similar to my Model M.....

 

BTW, I'd only started on mechanical KB's 8-9 months back, I now have ten excluding a yet to be released Ducky YOTS. Having tried and liking mech KBs, I don't see myself ever going back to membrane KBs.

[TheProfosist]

There are a good amount of people that prefer scissor switches, at least your using a board that has relatively good ones.

[denarced]

BTW, I'd only started on mechanical KB's 8-9 months back, I now have ten excluding a yet to be released Ducky YOTS. Having tried and liking mech KBs, I don't see myself ever going back to membrane KBs.

Why ten? You didn't like the first nine or just wanted to try different kinds?

[Anult]

You could always buy a sampler kit from WASDkeyboards: http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/wasd-sampler-kit.html

 

This way you can try all the key switches (apart from blues obviously) without burning a big hole in your pocket.

Edited July 6, 2013 by Pintend

[denarced]

To some extent I doubt the sampler kit's effectiveness. I think in order to truly evaluate one must be able to actually type with keyboard for hours or at least for 30 minutes. Just to demonstrate the problem: I've almost never had a problem with any keyboard based on one minute tryout. And that's still better than the sampler kit because you actually can type. Only the most horrible keyboards are revealed as such in one minute tryout.

[Gorgatron]

You could always buy a sampler kit from WASDkeyboards: http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/wasd-sampler-kit.html

 

This way you can try all the key switches (apart from blues obviously) without burning a big hole in your pocket.

That is awesome. Retard question here: Can you actually take out a switch on a keyboard and place one of these in to sort of get that "natural" feel?

[Anult]

That is awesome. Retard question here: Can you actually take out a switch on a keyboard and place one of these in to sort of get that "natural" feel?

 

I don't think so. You could always build a stand out of lego or knex to rest the key switches in so you can try them out though.

Sucks it doesn't come with a stand as I think adding 2 to 3 dollars for even the option of a stand would have been beneficial.

Edited July 7, 2013 by Pintend

[MdX MaxX]

Sorry to see you disappointed.  I mean, in the end, it's really up to you.  999 people may think mechanical is the best thing ever, but there's always that thousandth person.

 

During my switch, I also felt that I had to change the way I type.  But I think I'm having the opposite issue; the keys are too sensitive at times. :lol: My fingers need to be a little more curled and slightly more precise in order for me to avoid accidental keystrokes.  And having a wrist rest was a new thing for me.  But after a few weeks I have definitely become used to it, and my typing is probably better than it was with my old membrane.  And the mechanical keys just feel so good! :P

 

I have Browns, though, which are a little lighter than Blues, at least in my experience.

 

If you're looking for light switches, try Reds for sure.  They're SO light.  They're not springy feeling like Blues, though, more like soft membrane switches.

 

Anyway, yeah, my two cents.  You can't necessarily make a judgment after a week of use, but mechanical just isn't for some people.

[GamerDude]

Why ten? You didn't like the first nine or just wanted to try different kinds?

It's more for collection and satisfying an urge for something new. I started out with a Trigger Red and an Armaggeddon MKA-3 Black Hornet Cherry Red, expanded my collection to include three Ducky, one Filco, another Trigger but with Green switch, a QF TK Blue, a Model M and just a couple of days ago, I'd gotten a Topre Realforce 103-55G, and I love it! The YOTS is a definite buy as I've already deposited some cash to reserve a YOTS Blue. In my neck of the woods, there are guys who'd collect KMACs, HHKB, Topre and so forth, and they would spent good amount of cash to buy very nice key caps......sometimes, up to >100USD for a single key cap. That's.......esoteric to me as I can't wrap my mind 'round the concept........

 

Edit - While mechanical KB's may suit a vast majority of people, there's a small number of peeps who dislike it, or simply cannot adjust to it. I made the move from a Logitech G15 v1 and a cheap Armaggeddon membrane KB......and I ain't looking back for sure.

Edited July 7, 2013 by GamerDude

[TheProfosist]

That is awesome. Retard question here: Can you actually take out a switch on a keyboard and place one of these in to sort of get that "natural" feel?

 

well you could but that would require a bit of work and voiding your warrenty

 

 

 

I don't think so. You could always build a stand out of lego or knex to rest the key switches in so you can try them out though.

Sucks it doesn't come with a stand as I think adding 2 to 3 dollars for even the option of a stand would have been beneficial.

 

use a vise or just something that will hold it tight and be steady. Also about shipping a stand, just some sheet metal would work, the problem is shipping it with the rest of the kit.

 

 

 

Sorry to see you disappointed.  I mean, in the end, it's really up to you.  999 people may think mechanical is the best thing ever, but there's always that thousandth person.

 

During my switch, I also felt that I had to change the way I type.  But I think I'm having the opposite issue; the keys are too sensitive at times. :lol: My fingers need to be a little more curled and slightly more precise in order for me to avoid accidental keystrokes.  And having a wrist rest was a new thing for me.  But after a few weeks I have definitely become used to it, and my typing is probably better than it was with my old membrane.  And the mechanical keys just feel so good! :P

 

I have Browns, though, which are a little lighter than Blues, at least in my experience.

 

If you're looking for light switches, try Reds for sure.  They're SO light.  They're not springy feeling like Blues, though, more like soft membrane switches.

 

Anyway, yeah, my two cents.  You can't necessarily make a judgment after a week of use, but mechanical just isn't for some people.

 

There is actually a good amount of people that prefer rubber domes or scissor switches (usually scissor), you would be surprised actually.

 

If you think browns are too sensitive this means they may be too light for you. This may be because your used to typing on rubber domes for so long. You could either work to adapt or if you still find its a problem I would give Blacks or Clears a try.

 

no mechanical switch at least to me feels anything like a rubber dome but yes reds are the lightest, too light in my opinion. I just bottom the heck out of them but some people may actually want this being used to scissor and rubber dome switches.

 

A week or so of consistent use should be more than enough to see if you like a specific keyboard.

 

 

 

It's more for collection and satisfying an urge for something new. I started out with a Trigger Red and an Armaggeddon MKA-3 Black Hornet Cherry Red, expanded my collection to include three Ducky, one Filco, another Trigger but with Green switch, a QF TK Blue, a Model M and just a couple of days ago, I'd gotten a Topre Realforce 103-55G, and I love it! The YOTS is a definite buy as I've already deposited some cash to reserve a YOTS Blue. In my neck of the woods, there are guys who'd collect KMACs, HHKB, Topre and so forth, and they would spent good amount of cash to buy very nice key caps......sometimes, up to >100USD for a single key cap. That's.......esoteric to me as I can't wrap my mind 'round the concept........

 

Edit - While mechanical KB's may suit a vast majority of people, there's a small number of peeps who dislike it, or simply cannot adjust to it. I made the move from a Logitech G15 v1 and a cheap Armaggeddon membrane KB......and I ain't looking back for sure.

 

Yes for some mechanical keyboards are a hobby, me being one of those. I would just like to point out though that single keycaps being greater than $100 is rather uncommon and if you do have one you would only have one on your board. On the other hand complete keycap sets being over $100 is not uncommon especially for ones that come from Group Buys. Im not saying good ones are $100+ as there are nice ones available for $50+ but you do have much less choice in that range.

 

 

 

@denarced 

 

Having to change your positioning with typing may be because your used to scissor switches. I use a wrist rest that is 4.25in in width stretch my hands out a fair bit.

 

If you thought blues were too heavy give reds a try. You may like them more being used to scissor switches as they are lighter.

 

did you measure the switch at actuation or at bottoming out? The only reason I ask is there will be a significant difference.

 

I dont think your out money. mechanical keyboards have a fairly good return rate when you sell them.

 

Your probably not any faster because your used to the short throw of the scissor switches and your bottoming out the blues as that is what your used to needing to do with the logitech.

 

Being a touch typist it may actually take you a longer to get used to different types of keyboards. Also you May want to look at keyboards with Cherry ML switches possibly because as their like a short throw Cherry MX but feel a bit different. 

[denarced]

If you're looking for light switches, try Reds for sure.  They're SO light.  They're not springy feeling like Blues, though, more like soft membrane switches.

 

Anyway, yeah, my two cents.  You can't necessarily make a judgment after a week of use, but mechanical just isn't for some people.

My coworker has a keyboard with reds and I tried it. They seemed a lot better than the blues I tried. I could go for reds sometime in the future.

[AW3i]

*snip*

[denarced]

I also did some tests to my typing speed.My record on my membrane keyboard was 95 wpm after I got used to my mechanical keyboard I'm around 110 wpm.It's not much but it's faster.Though it wasnt a clear test since i didnt retry the test typing on the membrane keyboard, so it might be that I got overall faster

110 wpm is very nice! And an increase from 95 is definitely not an accident or a coincidence. Do you remember changing anything about your typing style during your "adaptation" to the mechanical? We should probably have a separate thread for the speed difference. A lot of people keep the old membrane keyboard because it's good to have a spare so at least a few people could test their speed.

[I'm Batman]

i switched from sometin like this

 

to this

and now i cant stop typing its soo niceeeee ^-^

[AW3i]

*snip*

[Dsgreek]

Question, a keyboard is a keyboard , to a normal user at least

Mechanical, Membrane, Scissor . Whatever switches .

If it can make you move In a game or even input shit in programs it's cool

A keyboard is for typing.

Lol

[SirReallySam]

fair enough bro, if it doesn't suite you, it doesn't suite you :D

[jbr]

[phillychuck]

Not sure if I could go back, I hate typing on peoples laptops and my wifes/kids PC.  No, she doesn't get a mechanical board because they treat their mouse and keyboard like crap.

 

I think the metal black plate makes a big change, most of the cheapy membranes I've used flex, and that bothers me the most.

[ARod]

Try a Board with Browns or Clears, you will absolutely love it.  I like MX Blue but if that was your only set experience then I can see why you switched back.

 

I own an MX Blue Ducky, if I had to pick only one, the Brown would win though.  

[denarced]

I guess the problem when talking about membranes is that they're just membranes, we don't have anything else. Obviously there are always differences in quality but I haven't run into those sites that review that. Everyone's talking about mechanicals and the focus is mostly on the switches. Even if the some membrane keyboards are excellent and the same "switches" are used in some other keyboard models we'll never know.

[TheProfosist]

If you like membranes give a topre a try. The budget TypeHeaven just launched http://amzn.to/15s19RK and is like a really really nice rubber done with its own little flair.