Planning my first custom loop. Advice?

[heikkikon]

So it's my first time watercooling, and as I did with my PC build, I started planning early. I've already been looking at the parts for a month and I'm aiming July-September for actually building the loop.  :rolleyes:

 

Currently running 4x retail SP120's + 1 Fractal Design Silent R2 in my PC, but I'll be replacing the Corsair ones with Noctua's NF-F12 IndustrialPPC's and putting one SP120 in place of the Silent R2 as well as replacing my case with the Define R5.

 

My reasons for watercooling were:

1. Getting some OC headroom. My 4670k hovers around 60-70°C while gaming, and I've yet to overclock it.

2. Getting rid of noise. Even though all my friends say my PC is pretty quiet, it's still not quiet enough for me. The CPU and GPU fans spin up when gaming and my case isn't optimized for silence either.

3. I want to show off my rig - in LAN parties as well as to friends visiting.

4. I want to get a better score in firestrike >.> Link

 

[spoiler=Reference material]

Source

Source

 

Questions:

1. Does it matter if the water flows from my GPU to my CPU? Is this going to affect temps much?

2. Do I need any specialized tools for cutting the tubing or will scissors do the job fine? Maybe small garden cutters?

3. Am I better off getting the EK pump-res combo or should I get a separate pump and res?

4. I'm limited in my choice of coolant. EK-Ekoolant EVO or Mayhems X1?

5. How the heck do I use spoilers on the forum?

6. Pre-mixed clear coolant VS distilled water? If distilled water, what else do I need to keep my loop clean and prevent corrosion?

7. DDC or D5? Which one is quieter? (2x 240 45mm rads)

 

NOTES:

1. Current estimated cycle for draining and cleaning the loop is 3 months or less.

2. Tubing and fittings are 16/10mm = 3/8" ID, 5/8"­­ OD

Case:

1x Fractal Design Define R5 Black Window Product page | Radiator compatibility chart

 

Tubing:

2x PrimoChill 16/10 PrimoFlex Advanced LRT tubing - clear Product page

 

Coolant (this or distilled water):

2x Mayhems Pre-Mix X1 1000ml Clear Product page

1x Mayhems Dye Deep Red 15ml Product page

 

Rads:

2x AlphaCool NexXxoS XT45 Full Copper 240mm Product page

 

Fans (one for back exhaust):

5x Noctua NF-F12 industrialPPC-2000 PWM Product page

 

Pump Choices:

DDC:

1x EK-XRES 140 DDC 3.2 PWM (incl. pump) Product page

1x EK-UNI Holder DDC V2 Product page

1x EK-DDC Heatsink Housing - Black Product page

D5:

1x EK-D5 PWM Motor (12V DC PWM Pump Motor) Product page

1x EK-D5 Cover Kit (Black) Acetal Product page

 

Reservoir (if D5):

1x EK-XRES 140 D5 - Acetal (Original CSQ) Product page

 

GPU Block + Backplate:

1x EK-FC980 GTX - Acetal Product page

or

1x EVGA Hydro Copper Waterblock for GTX 980 Product page

1x EK-FC980 GTX Backplate - Black Product page

 

CPU Block:

1x EK-Supremacy EVO - Nickel (Original CSQ) Product page

or

1x EK-Supremacy EVO - Acetal+Nickel (Original CSQ) Product page

 

Fittings:

10x EK 16/10 Compression fittings - Black Product page

??x EK Angled 90° G1/4 - G1/4 - Black Product page

1x Koolance QD3 Male Quick Disconnect 16/10 Black Product Page

1x Koolance QD3 Female Quick Disconnect 16/10 Black Product Page

 

For cleaning the loop:

Enough Distilled water

Enough cleaning concentrate

 

Estimated cost: 700 - 800 €

 

Thanks for your input!

 

First topic started by me! Yay!

 

EDIT: Updated parts list with links to product pages.

[Foxxer]

Welcome to the forums.

 

1. Not really, it is barely noticeable, maybe a 1 or 2 °C difference.

2. I usually use a sharp razor blade, get a perfect cut every time. Make sure the scissors are not dull.

3. This depends on you, EK products look and preform great. I heard they use the Swiftech pump mcp655 too. 

4. Many strongly suggest you stick with a silver coil and distilled water as dyes tend to degrade the tubes and stain blocks.

5. What do you mean? 

[heikkikon]

-snip-

4. Many strongly suggest you stick with a silver coil and distilled water as dyes tend to degrade the tubes and stain blocks.

5. What do you mean? 

 

Wouldn't a ready clear coolant just be the same? I'm also doing this for the show factor, which is why i'd like to put in the red dye. From what I've read/watched red dye is the worst when it comes to staining the loop, but I'm fine with that. I guess I'd just have to flush and clean the loop more often - once every two months or something?

 

I mean spoilers on the forum

[Foxxer]

No, distilled water is different than a coolant, I used red tubing instead of clear ones, it looks like as if I added some dye.

If it's for shows then do it I guess, bet it will look badass.

 

As for spoilers, just upload a picture then use the "image" icon on the forums toolbar. 

[Arkhen]

Most clear and transparent tubing will degrade and get cloudy over time when using most fluids, both pre mixed and custom. This is especially noticeable with clear tubing and coolant.

 

Most sites which sell watercooling gear also sell cheap tube cutters, which will ensure you get a clean cut. It can also be done with a sharp knife, but I prefer the designated tool.

 

I would use Mayhem's fluid over EK's.

 

The DDC pump top reservoir you listed does have a tendency to get cloudy, when using clear coolant. I've had 2 myself, using the EK pre mixed clear coolant.

And remember to get some anti vibration velcro or pad for the pump, if you plan on mounting it on the pump. Alphacool have such kit.

[heikkikon]

Most clear and transparent tubing will degrade and get cloudy over time when using most fluids, both pre mixed and custom. This is especially noticeable with clear tubing and coolant.

 

Most sites which sell watercooling gear also sell cheap tube cutters, which will ensure you get a clean cut. It can also be done with a sharp knife, but I prefer the designated tool.

 

I would use Mayhem's fluid over EK's.

 

The DDC pump top reservoir you listed does have a tendency to get cloudy, when using clear coolant. I've had 2 myself, using the EK pre mixed clear coolant.

And remember to get some anti vibration velcro or pad for the pump, if you plan on mounting it on the pump. Alphacool have such kit.

How long would it take for them to get noticeably cloudy? Am I looking at more than 6 months?

 

Would it be better to go with - say - a Laing DDC 1T (10W) and an EK top + bottom with a separate tube reservoir? What manufacturer do you recommend for the res?

[Arkhen]

If you use Mayhem pastel nano coolant the clouding really isn't that bad. Personally I prefer using colored tubes though, as I'm not a fan of transparent ones, especially due to the clouding issues.

 

If you use EK pre mixed clear coolant I'd say after 6-12 months you should be able to notice it. Personally I saw it after 6 ish months. And yes, the loop (especially the radiators) were properly cleaned prior to setting it up. I've also had the pre mixed blood red EK coolant, it also left some cloudy residue in the tubes and res.

 

These are the tubes I personally use, in 16/10mm size (and 13/10mm behind the motherboard tray), white version: http://www.primochill.com/product/primoflex-advanced-lrt-flexible-tubing/

[shert73]

 

2. Do I need any specialized tools for cutting the tubing or will scissors do the job fine? Maybe small garden cutters?

3. Am I better off getting the EK pump-res combo or should I get a separate pump and res?

4. I'm limited in my choice of coolant. EK-Ekoolant EVO or Mayhems X1?

5. How the heck do I use spoilers?

 

 

To answer number 2. Scissors work fine, if they are sharp and you are using compression fittings, or just don't care what the end of the tubing looks like. 

To answer number 3. Depends on where you want to mount the res and the pump. 

To answer number 4. I personally use EK's Evo, but many people swear by Mayhem.

To answer number 5. to use a spoiler type {spoiler} what ever you want here, like pic or words than {/spoiler} but make the {} into [ ]

Red dye is the worst for tubes. If you want red id use the red tubes.

Also if you decide to go with a DDC you will need to get a heatsink and a new houseing. your better off with a D-5, this is the one that i use.

 http://www.performance-pcs.com/alphacool-vpp655-g1-4-ig-complete-with-d5-hf-top.html

 

[heikkikon]

If you use Mayhem pastel nano coolant the clouding really isn't that bad. Personally I prefer using colored tubes though, as I'm not a fan of transparent ones, especially due to the clouding issues.

 

If you use EK pre mixed clear coolant I'd say after 6-12 months you should be able to notice it. Personally I saw it after 6 ish months. And yes, the loop (especially the radiators) were properly cleaned prior to setting it up. I've also had the pre mixed blood red EK coolant, it also left some cloudy residue in the tubes and res.

 

These are the tubes I personally use, in 16/10mm size (and 13/10mm behind the motherboard tray), white version: http://www.primochill.com/product/primoflex-advanced-lrt-flexible-tubing/

 

Looking at the same tubing, heard good things about PrimoFlex stuff. 6 months isn't really that bad for me, there's less time between the LAN events I attend and I'd probably flush my loop and clean everything before each anyway. Looking at maybe 3 months between cleaning the whole loop. I'm now concidering going clear first and adding red dye later if it really needs it. I have the LED strips in my current build already.

 

-snip-

To answer number 5. to use a spoiler type {spoiler} what ever you want here, like pic or words than {/spoiler} but make the {} into [ ]

Red dye is the worst for tubes. If you want red id use the red tubes.

Also if you decide to go with a DDC you will need to get a heatsink and a new houseing. your better off with a D-5, this is the one that i use.

 http://www.performance-pcs.com/alphacool-vpp655-g1-4-ig-complete-with-d5-hf-top.html

I'm so used to HTML syntax I forgot how forums work. Thanks.

 

For the tubing I was thinking of an effect like this

Source

 

I'm torn between getting a DDC or D5 pump. Don't mind the extra work/parts/cost for the DDC. Main concern is noise.

 

Updated main post.

[Arkhen]

I have had 4x D5 pumps in different configs and 3 DDC (18w edition). I'd say the DDC is more quiet than D5 overall. D5 is quiet at 1-2, but 3-4-5 are noticeable. Even with a Monsoon or Bitspower d5 mod kit on top.

 

If you go with D5 just promise me you don't use the vanilla default Laing plastic brackets, they are so damn ugly. Use a proper pump top or res/pump from EK and company.

[heikkikon]

I have had 4x D5 pumps in different configs and 3 DDC (18w edition). I'd say the DDC is more quiet than D5 overall. D5 is quiet at 1-2, but 3-4-5 are noticeable. Even with a Monsoon or Bitspower d5 mod kit on top.

 

If you go with D5 just promise me you don't use the vanilla default Laing plastic brackets, they are so damn ugly. Use a proper pump top or res/pump from EK and company.

I can promise that even if I don't go with D5. DDC pumps look horrible too with the Laing tops Heatsink + Top ?

[Arkhen]

If you don't go with the res pump top, then that is probably my favorite alternative available for that pump. Looks gg, especially with colored coolant.

[shert73]

I can promise that even if I don't go with D5. DDC pumps look horrible too with the Laing tops Heatsink + Top ?

ANYTHING EK is good in my book.

[shert73]

could try this liquid. http://www.performance-pcs.com/ek-ekoolant-evo-liquid-coolant-blood-red-premix-1-liter.html

Red or clear, how ever you want it, i use the UV green

I've never used a DDC pump so i cannot comment on the sounds of one, but like Arkhen said D5s are quite at 1-2 but any higher you can hear it. 

[Foxxer]

DDC can overheat if placed on a insulation pad "foam dampening", they are slightly quieter too, 

due to the fact some D5's have variable speeds thus making them louder a tad.

I would go with a D5 in terms of reliability and air bleeding capabilities. 

[heikkikon]

DDC can overheat if placed on a insulation pad "foam dampening", they are slightly quieter too, 

due to the fact some D5's have variable speeds thus making them louder a tad.

I would go with a D5 in terms of reliability and air bleeding capabilities. 

 

Did just a bit of research and D5 seems to win overall. I'll have to look more into this.

 

This is why I started this thread. No single part is locked in place.

 

Sources:

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/214030-ddc-vs-d5/

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/answers/id-1797211/water-cooling-ddc.html

http://www.overclock.net/t/1483667/d5-vs-ddc

http://www.reddit.com/r/watercooling/comments/2n8qs4/q_pump_selection_ddc_vs_d5/

[Arkhen]

I've never had any issues with my DDC pumps (18w edition) when using anti vibration pads or velcro. As long as you cut a hole in the middle and a path away from the middle, for more ventilation it's all good.

And it's obviously even better if you use the heatsink you linked earlier, though a little overkill.

 

D5 is more powerful and has better bleeding options, yep, but also more noisy. It all really comes down to silence vs performance and what you prefer.

[heikkikon]

I've never had any issues with my DDC pumps (18w edition) when using anti vibration pads or velcro. As long as you cut a hole in the middle and a path away from the middle, for more ventilation it's all good.

And it's obviously even better if you use the heatsink you linked earlier, though a little overkill.

 

D5 is more powerful and has better bleeding options, yep, but also more noisy. It all really comes down to silence vs performance and what you prefer.

 

It's not set in stone yet, but I'm going for quiet operation here.

 

Isn't Skunkworks running on 2 DDC's? I have to check. I've also yet to watch part 1 of Paul's build log.

 

Also, dangit. Missed a good deal on a set of EK 16/10 fittings D: Link That whole set was sold for 40€

Edit: Nvm. they were 13/10  Still, the 90° fittings would've been nice.

 

EDIT: Seems like Paul's using a D5 pump with an attached res and his build is optimized for silence.

[Foxxer]

-snip-

 

How many days did it take to bleed the whole system fully? 

[Arkhen]

It's not set in stone yet, but I'm going for quiet operation here.

 

Isn't Skunkworks running on 2 DDC's? I have to check. I've also yet to watch part 1 of Paul's build log.

 

Also, dangit. Missed a good deal on a set of EK 16/10 fittings D: Link That whole set was sold for 40€

Edit: Nvm. they were 13/10  Still, the 90° fittings would've been nice.

 

EDIT: Seems like Paul's using a D5 pump with an attached res and his build is optimized for silence.

Jay is using D5 pumps in the bottom chamber, near his drain ports. Unless he changed that recently.

 

How many days did it take to bleed the whole system fully? 

With the DDC pumps? Took me 6-8 hours, but I wasn't actively doing it all those hours. When I was active I kept switching the pump to a 7v mod and back to 12v, to create some uneven flow in the build which usually helps a lot when getting rid of air. And of course tilting and shaking the case a little.

This is what's easier on the D5 (with the speed regulator).

[heikkikon]

@Arkhen @Foxxer I didn't think talk about watercooling pumps could get so heated.

 

I'm thinking I'll go with clear coolant for most of the time and I'll add red dye for photos and LAN events and clean the loop afterwards since I have to take all my peripherals apart anyway.

[spwath]

@Arkhen @Foxxer I didn't think talk about watercooling pumps could get so heated.

I'm thinking I'll go with clear coolant for most of the time and I'll add red dye for photos and LAN events and clean the loop afterwards since I have to take all my peripherals apart anyway.

Sounds good, I have distilled water, no problems.

I spilled some in my PC, and it's fine.

I don't think any got on my components tho.

I have a d5, it's quiet at 2, haven't tried 1

[Foxxer]

-snip-

 

Oh okay, I thought it would be worst, well, the micro bubbles would be there for

atleast a week believe it or not, specially when its a coolant that is foaming. 

 

That's whats nice with the variable speed, you play with it and it keeps burping out.

Took me around 2 hours while checking for leaks "24 hour test". 

[Leonard]

So it's my first time watercooling, and as I did with my PC build, I started planning early. I've already been looking at the parts for a month and I'm aiming July-September for actually building the loop.  :rolleyes:

 

Currently running 4x retail SP120's + 1 Fractal Design Silent R2 in my PC, but I'll be replacing the Corsair ones with Noctua's NF-F12 IndustrialPPC's and putting one SP120 in place of the Silent R2 as well as replacing my case with the Define R5.

 

My reasons for watercooling were:

1. Getting some OC headroom. My 4670k hovers around 60-70°C while gaming, and I've yet to overclock it.

2. Getting rid of noise. Even though all my friends say my PC is pretty quiet, it's still not quiet enough for me. The CPU and GPU fans spin up when gaming and my case isn't optimized for silence either.

3. I want to show off my rig - in LAN parties as well as to friends visiting.

4. I want to get a better score in firestrike >.> Link

 

[spoiler=Reference material]

Source

Source

 

Questions:

1. Does it matter if the water flows from my GPU to my CPU? Is this going to affect temps much?

2. Do I need any specialized tools for cutting the tubing or will scissors do the job fine? Maybe small garden cutters?

3. Am I better off getting the EK pump-res combo or should I get a separate pump and res?

4. I'm limited in my choice of coolant. EK-Ekoolant EVO or Mayhems X1?

5. How the heck do I use spoilers on the forum?

6. Pre-mixed clear coolant VS distilled water? If distilled water, what else do I need to keep my loop clean and prevent corrosion?

7. DDC or D5? Which one is quieter? (2x 240 45mm rads)

 

NOTES:

1. Current estimated cycle for draining and cleaning the loop is 3 months or less.

2. Tubing and fittings are 16/10mm = 3/8" ID, 5/8"­­ OD

Case:

1x Fractal Design Define R5 Black Window Product page

 

Tubing:

2x PrimoChill 16/10 PrimoFlex Advanced LRT tubing - clear Product page

 

Coolant (this or distilled water):

2x Mayhems Pre-Mix X1 1000ml Clear Product page

1x Mayhems Dye Deep Red 15ml Product page

 

Rads:

2x AlphaCool NexXxoS XT45 Full Copper 240mm Product page

 

Fans (one for back exhaust):

5x Noctua NF-F12 industrialPPC-2000 PWM Product page

 

Pump Choices:

DDC:

1x EK-XRES 140 DDC 3.2 PWM (incl. pump) Product page

1x EK-UNI Holder DDC V2 Product page

1x EK-DDC Heatsink Housing - Black Product page

D5:

1x EK-D5 PWM Motor (12V DC PWM Pump Motor) Product page

1x EK-D5 Cover Kit (Black) Acetal Product page

 

Reservoir (if D5):

1x EK-XRES 140 D5 - Acetal (Original CSQ) Product page

 

GPU Block + Backplate:

1x EK-FC980 GTX - Acetal Product page

or

1x EVGA Hydro Copper Waterblock for GTX 980 Product page

1x EK-FC980 GTX Backplate - Black Product page

 

CPU Block:

1x EK-Supremacy EVO - Nickel (Original CSQ) Product page

or

1x EK-Supremacy EVO - Acetal+Nickel (Original CSQ) Product page

 

Fittings:

10x EK 16/10 Compression fittings - Black Product page

??x EK Angled 90° G1/4 - G1/4 - Black Product page

1x Koolance QD3 Male Quick Disconnect 16/10 Black Product Page

1x Koolance QD3 Female Quick Disconnect 16/10 Black Product Page

 

For cleaning the loop:

Enough Distilled water

Enough cleaning concentrate

 

Estimated cost: 700 - 800 €

 

Thanks for your input!

 

First topic started by me! Yay!

 

EDIT: Updated parts list with links to product pages.

No matter what coolant you use, there will be corrosion, it might be minimal depending on how well you treat/care for your loop but it will happen over time. Distilled water with either kill coils/bullets or PT Nuke is quiet sufficient. Most colored coolants will stain or cause build up especially in the pump but it can be cleaned, so the choice is really for you to make.

 

D5 is better all round.

 

I would use one 360mm/420mm radiator in the top and i would use the Black Ice Nemesis GTX which is created for low air flow but high static pressure fans thus giving you less noise which is not to say the alphacool is bad.

[heikkikon]

No matter what coolant you use, there will be corrosion, it might be minimal depending on how well you treat/care for your loop but it will happen over time. Distilled water with either kill coils/bullets or PT Nuke is quiet sufficient. Most colored coolants will stain or cause build up especially in the pump but it can be cleaned, so the choice is really for you to make.

 

D5 is better all round.

 

I would use one 360mm/420mm radiator in the top and i would use the Black Ice Nemesis GTX which is created for low air flow but high static pressure fans thus giving you less noise which is not to say the alphacool is bad.

 

Thanks. As I mentioned in my post above, I'll go with clear coolant for overyday use, with red dye for showing the system off at LAN events and for photos.

 

I'm leaning towards the D5 already. Although DDC pumps look a bit better, the main focus of this is to make everything quiet and so far D5 seems to be the way to go.

 

I'm still considering if I should go with a triple rad in the top. The Define R5 is limited to a 30mm thick rad if you're going with 140/280/420 radiator (reference below). I guess that doesn't matter much compared to a 45mm thick 360 radiator. It's an option, and would probably lead to me getting a bigger reservoir as well.

 

I just like the look of Alphacool rads. And they're european so I could potentially order directly from them, just like EK. Finnish retailers like to rip people off with very high import fees.

 

Already got 3 NF-F12 industrialPPC fans for 60€ total (á 25€ retail). Very exciting!  Sure, they might not be the most quiet fans out of the box, but they look great and who says I can't use any low-noise adapters >.>

 

Compatibility chart