Heaven Society - Week 12 (Baccano!)

[Charger]

You really should man.

I have watched baccano within the last year or two

[TheProfosist]

I have watched baccano within the last year or two

Oh too soon then, well at least for me.

[Charger]

Oh too soon then, well at least for me.

I wouldn't mind watching it again but I'm watching code geass again which is nice since i only 20% remember it from a few years ago as i watch it lol

[Fred Castellum]

I think Isaac and Miria's voices are a perfect fit.

Absolutely, I love those two lol.

[Fred Castellum]

Awww Yussss

 

[TheProfosist]

Awww Yussss

Yep, thats part of the beginning of the story.

I alreay found a part in the first ep where aniplex didnt deinterlace properly. <.<

[Fred Castellum]

*sigh* Just finished ep 16 again. Such a beautiful series... all wrapped up perfectly.... 

Durarara!! S2 to look forward too

[frustratedrocka]

Funny Isaac related story: The guy that his voice actor talks about

is a good friend of mine.

[Fred Castellum]

Funny Isaac related story: The guy that his voice actor talks about

is a good friend of mine.

THAT IS GOLDDDDDD HAHAHHAHAHA Aww yussss I wish I could like this twice. 

[frustratedrocka]

The friend in question is honestly the closest I've ever seen to the real life Ferris Bueller.

[RainColt]

To be honest I JUST started to watch it ... So I'm a bit late ...

 

But I have to say --> "WHAT AN OPENING!"

 

Reminds me of the Cowboy Bepop style which I am a fan of 

 

Back to watching ...

Honestly, I wasn't blown away by Bebop but I get what you mean and Imma make some enemies saying this but this is sort of bebop-esc feel with the one thing that really kept me from falling for it. 90's anime has certain aspects that really show there age and it's a bit jarring for me but this had a very consistent tone and I really liked it.

I'm not trying to say Bebop is bad, it's good, just not for me.

[TheProfosist]

Honestly, I wasn't blown away by Bebop but I get what you mean and Imma make some enemies saying this but this is sort of bebop-esc feel with the one thing that really kept me from falling for it. 90's anime has certain aspects that really show there age and it's a bit jarring for me but this had a very consistent tone and I really liked it.

I'm not trying to say Bebop is bad, it's good, just not for me.

Care to delve into and discuss those aspects because im up for it. For me its the same for the majority of post ~2007 anime when there was a real big shift. Also what anime are for you then?

I imagine this sort of thing actually deals with which anime win in the polls. I believe @Charger actually figured out some of our statistics.

This once again reminds me I need to dig up Bebop again and watch it through fully as its been even longer tha GITS. I wonder how much the original us release of bebop is worth now a days, not that I have one.

[RainColt]

Care to delve into and discuss those aspects because im up for it. For me its the same for the majority of post ~2007 anime when there was a real big shift. Also what anime are for you then?

I imagine this sort of thing actually deals with which anime win in the polls. I believe @Charger actually figured out some of our statistics.

This once again reminds me I need to dig up Bebop again and watch it through fully as its been even longer tha GITS. I wonder how much the original us release of bebop is worth now a days, not that I have one.

Getting past the style of animation which is very shallow but I admit can and has affected my opinion of a series, I don't like the straight lined sharp shadowed animation of the 90's, I find it repelling, but that aside there are themes in 90's movies and anime that are taken seriously and are absolutely a product of it's time, the episode that this stood out to me most was heavy metal queen, which the duologue about metal music and how resonating it is to her is just so distracting, this character takes me out and reminds me that im watching something from the 90's and nobody cares about metal anymore (it is significantly less prominent than it was in the 90's- early 2000) nobody would right this character anymore because metal is no longer important, It has aged and for the most part fairly well, but it show enough to be distracting. This is not a timeless series like...ok, i can't think of an anime from the 90's that would hold up perfectly but like "The Princess bride" that movie is timeless, because it's a great movie and never once does it date itself with cultural references and themes, the only thing that would give away its age is the quality of film and the resolution they have. Even the actors in the film are timeless because they never went on to become recognizable faces.

[TheProfosist]

Getting past the style of animation which is very shallow but I admit can and has affected my opinion of a series, I don't like the straight lined sharp shadowed animation of the 90's, I find it repelling, but that aside there are themes in 90's movies and anime that are taken seriously and are absolutely a product of it's time, the episode that this stood out to me most was heavy metal queen, which the duologue about metal music and how resonating it is to her is just so distracting, this character takes me out and reminds me that im watching something from the 90's and nobody cares about metal anymore (it is significantly less prominent than it was in the 90's- early 2000) nobody would right this character anymore because metal is no longer important, It has aged and for the most part fairly well, but it show enough to be distracting. This is not a timeless series like...ok, i can't think of an anime from the 90's that would hold up perfectly but like "The Princess bride" that movie is timeless, because it's a great movie and never once does it date itself with cultural references and themes, the only thing that would give away its age is the quality of film and the resolution they have. Even the actors in the film are timeless because they never went on to become recognizable faces.

So ill try to break this down as originally I had this typed as one big block of text that even I was having trouble following.

So your basically not a fan of non digitally animated series? If that the case I dont know what to say because I prefer it much of today's stuff seems copy and paste far more than it ever was. I also can really appreciate what they all had to do to accomplish what they did. And I guess I need a better explanation of what you mean by the animation being shallow. The only think I can think of is possibly the lack of extremely exaggerated emotions that are now commonplace.

It could be the visual style you dont like as there as been a huge switch when digital became mainstream and HD entered the scene. This is actually the main reason the Evangelion movies are being redone. They wanted another whole generation to see it but re-imagined a bit for them for a reason I mention below.

Anime like anything is made during a time period. This rubs off on it just like any other art form including music. A good example is FLCL which is strewn full of then current pop culture references, which I am still finding and learning about to this day. Referencing something current does not disqualify something from being a classic, actually at times stuff like that can work in its favor. This is why you cant find an anime that would hold up perfectly to your standards.

If you mention a couple other things that you think no longer apply I maybe can go more into this. You actually dont give many examples and there just seems to be a whole overarching theme of basically "its old so I dont like it". Your argument doesnt really apply because you could substitute any genre for "heavy metal" and it would in essence work. This means that people can still relatively easily relate to it. Also apparently you didnt notice this but every episode is based on a certain genre of music. The titles themselves give this away imidiately if you manage to not notice this well watching. you said meal was not longer popular but Visual Kei and its derivatives are still going strong in Japan.

Something I just thought about. When interacting with something old do you not keep the time it was created in mind? This came to mind when comparing classic anime to books. Another anime that is recent, Kids on the Slope, had the soundtrack done and was directed by the same corresponding people as in Bebop, Yoko Kano and Shinichiro Watanabe). This was actually their first time working together since bebop. They managed to make something amazingly wonderful again. That isnt the point though. The point is that by your definition its disqualified from being a classic. It is based in 1966 at a time period when jazz was quite popular in japan. It is an amazing anime in every way. The animation, story, and music all suit each other perfectly. In the one fight scene you even get the same feel and style with the animation when Spike fights in bebop, which is a clear mark in my eyes of who was involved.

One anime that is significantly older that I think still holds it own with the best is Macross. It only came out a few years after Gundam but crushed it (in my opinion). I would also have to argue that being timeless, in the way that your describing at least, isnt necessarily a good thing.

I guess now after all of this it would be interesting to know which genre's you like and which anime you hold in high regards. And ill finish this by saying that there are very few anime that have the same feel as Bebop and that alone is something that makes it special. Also your missing out on a whole bunch of great anime if you cant stand anime from this time period.

EDIT: Thought id mention I dug up some ogm's from 2007 to refresh my self since I couldnt find my BD's.

[RainColt]

So ill try to break this down as originally I had this typed as one big block of text that even I was having trouble following.

So your basically not a fan of non digitally animated series? If that the case I dont know what to say because I prefer it much of today's stuff seems copy and paste far more than it ever was. I also can really appreciate what they all had to do to accomplish what they did. And I guess I need a better explanation of what you mean by the animation being shallow. The only think I can think of is possibly the lack of extremely exaggerated emotions that are now commonplace.

It could be the visual style you dont like as there as been a huge switch when digital became mainstream and HD entered the scene. This is actually the main reason the Evangelion movies are being redone. They wanted another whole generation to see it but re-imagined a bit for them for a reason I mention below.

Anime like anything is made during a time period. This rubs off on it just like any other art form including music. A good example is FLCL which is strewn full of then current pop culture references, which I am still finding and learning about to this day. Referencing something current does not disqualify something from being a classic, actually at times stuff like that can work in its favor. This is why you cant find an anime that would hold up perfectly to your standards.

If you mention a couple other things that you think no longer apply I maybe can go more into this. You actually dont give many examples and there just seems to be a whole overarching theme of basically "its old so I dont like it". Your argument doesnt really apply because you could substitute any genre for "heavy metal" and it would in essence work. This means that people can still relatively easily relate to it. Also apparently you didnt notice this but every episode is based on a certain genre of music. The titles themselves give this away imidiately if you manage to not notice this well watching. you said meal was not longer popular but Visual Kei and its derivatives are still going strong in Japan.

Something I just thought about. When interacting with something old do you not keep the time it was created in mind? This came to mind when comparing classic anime to books. Another anime that is recent, Kids on the Slope, had the soundtrack done and was directed by the same corresponding people as in Bebop, Yoko Kano and Shinichiro Watanabe). This was actually their first time working together since bebop. They managed to make something amazingly wonderful again. That isnt the point though. The point is that by your definition its disqualified from being a classic. It is based in 1966 at a time period when jazz was quite popular in japan. It is an amazing anime in every way. The animation, story, and music all suit each other perfectly. In the one fight scene you even get the same feel and style with the animation when Spike fights in bebop, which is a clear mark in my eyes of who was involved.

One anime that is significantly older that I think still holds it own with the best is Macross. It only came out a few years after Gundam but crushed it (in my opinion). I would also have to argue that being timeless, in the way that your describing at least, isnt necessarily a good thing.

I guess now after all of this it would be interesting to know which genre's you like and which anime you hold in high regards. And ill finish this by saying that there are very few anime that have the same feel as Bebop and that alone is something that makes it special. Also your missing out on a whole bunch of great anime if you cant stand anime from this time period.

EDIT: Thought id mention I dug up some ogm's from 2007 to refresh my self since I couldnt find my BD's.

Bebops animation didn't bother me it was one of the things that I think still stands up. What i meant in my poorly punctuated sentence was that my disregarding a series based on its animation is shallow of me and I can admit that but that doesn't change what I find visually appealing for example my friends tried to get me to play final fantasy in 2001 when FF9 was the most recent and I chose not to because FF9 is visually appalling, my friend likes it but i will never play it because I hate looking at it, that of coarse is the extreme example of something that visually repulsed me but with 90's animation it is a higher barrier to entree than moddern digital animation but not profusely difficult to look beyond.

Now understand that I am technically a 90's kid but lived really sheltered from pop-culture of the 90's, just because I did have any of it and I didn't care, so I have no nostalgia for the 90's but I do know that metal doesn't have the same influence it did in the 90's, you had metal songs on the top 100's in the 90's today you absolutely don't, or at least not in america, which is why the episode heavy metal queen stands out so prominently as being 90's the episode itself has not aged well simply by how they address the subject of metal, however short it is they treat it much differently than they would today and I find it jarring and a conspicuous reminder that I am watching something clearly made in the 90's, I don't like to be able to date the year the content im watching came out based on the content in it, I don't like to be reminded that "oh yeah this was made in the late 90's" When I watch StarWars i'm not thinking "oh yeah this was made in the 70's" in fact I had to google that and i'm actually kind of shocked that it was that long ago, because nothing in it has strong themes that I would relate to the 70s.

Also, it might just be because I don't really go for space cowboys and pirates, in spite of the fanfare it gets I couldn't watch Firefly because I though it was boring.

I am a huge fan of The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya, I really enjoy AnoHana and Beyond the Boundary

 

[frustratedrocka]

Care to delve into and discuss those aspects because im up for it. For me its the same for the majority of post ~2007 anime when there was a real big shift. Also what anime are for you then?

I imagine this sort of thing actually deals with which anime win in the polls. I believe @Charger actually figured out some of our statistics.

This once again reminds me I need to dig up Bebop again and watch it through fully as its been even longer tha GITS. I wonder how much the original us release of bebop is worth now a days, not that I have one.

Quite a decent chunk of change, although Funimation has acquired the license and will probably be releasing a more affordable DVD soonish.

[Fred Castellum]

This... this is the type of discussion I like to read. Thanks livening this place up~!

[Typho]

Personally I really like these kinds of plot "twists" you have near the final episodes.

I am really into this kind of stuff. Where they are introducing people, but at the start you don't know their "relations" to each other.

It's like a puzzle where someone puts pieces in every episode. Finally you start to realize things and BOOM there you have a full plot.

I had the same reaction to Durarara, although I liked it more than this one. Personally it's just this "so much blood" thing.

Btw the opening was nice   + I also liked the characters "personality" and the mafia theme. (Much more mafia type than the Katekyo Hitman Reborn!)

 

[TheProfosist]

Personally I really like these kinds of plot "twists" you have near the final episodes.

I am really into this kind of stuff. Where they are introducing people, but at the start you don't know their "relations" to each other.

It's like a puzzle where someone puts pieces in every episode. Finally you start to realize things and BOOM there you have a full plot.

I had the same reaction to Durarara, although I liked it more than this one. Personally it's just this "so much blood" thing.

Btw the opening was nice   + I also liked the characters "personality" and the mafia theme. (Much more mafia type than the Katekyo Hitman Reborn!)

 

You want mafia? Watch Gungrave though it is my recommendation you skip the first ep.

[Sky Daddy]

Really loved the blend of characters and mood of this anime. I loved a certain Isaac and Miria cameo in a certain anime.

[Typho]

Really loved the blend of characters and mood of this anime. I loved a certain Isaac and Miria cameo in a certain anime.

Hah, that reminds of me that trailer where Isaac and Miria are flipping a coin to choose which costume they should use while robbing a candy shop 

[TheProfosist]

@RainColt I still don't get why of all the things in bebop you pick the one metal episode as signifying its from the 90s. The whole rest of the anime is basically anything but metal. I'll provide a more in depth response to your post later.

[RainColt]

@RainColt I still don't get why of all the things in bebop you pick the one metal episode as signifying its from the 90s. The whole rest of the anime is basically anything but metal. I'll provide a more in depth response to your post later.

I keep going back to heavy metal queen because it's the one that made me roll my eyes at it and it's the entire episode that stuck out at me, I'm sure there are other episode that have parts in it that would pull me out of the episode but I don't really want to re-watch it just for other examples, it wouldn't be fair to watch the first 5 episodes again with the mind set that i have to scrutinize a look for 90's themes that stand out to me, so im not going to.

[Fred Castellum]

Up to epi 3 and finding it difficult to follow because it keep jumping between characters. In later epi's does it jump around as much ? 

It's like a puzzle but it all comes together in the end. It's worth sitting through the initial confusion  

[TheProfosist]

I just finished the main story (ep13?) its really good and I remember why i bought it.