Which Devil's Canyon?

[Faa]

Families would be I3-5-7. Generations are Haswell and Devil's Canyon. Each Devil's Canyon chip line (4790k, 4690k, G3258) has a different VR. All you have to do is look at pictures of the undersides of both chips and count capacitors, and, in general, how thick they are to measure relative stability.

 

For instance: http://media.bestofmicro.com/3/D/439465/original/end.jpg

On the left: 4790k, on the right, 4690k. Even though the image is blurry (thank the people at Tom's Hardware) you can easily see how much more advanced the energy controller is on the 4790k, and it shows in the overclocking.

Do you really think we can't find your lies out?

You found that picture from here: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4790k-devils-canyon-overclock-performance,3845-10.html

Whole review is about the 4770k vs 4790k http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4790k-devils-canyon-overclock-performance,3845.html

Source: http://www.vortez.net/articles_pages/intel_haswell_core_i5_4670k_core_i7_4770k_review,3.html

This dude is clearly a fucking troll

[bbqsauce]

@Faa

yes he is. he claims we are the trolls but he is the one trolling. ignore him.

[patrickjp93]

Do you really think we can't find your lies out?

You found that picture from here: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4790k-devils-canyon-overclock-performance,3845-10.html

Whole review is about the 4770k vs 4790k http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4790k-devils-canyon-overclock-performance,3845.html

Source: http://www.vortez.net/articles_pages/intel_haswell_core_i5_4670k_core_i7_4770k_review,3.html

This dude is clearly a fucking troll

And those would be the 4670k and 4770k not the 4690k and 4790k, and by the way did you read the caption under the picture from tom's hardware? The two chips in the picture I provided are 4690k and 4790k. You've been beaten by me twice.

 

And before you come back attempting to pawn that off as the G3258 on the right: http://us.hardware.info/productinfo/220850/intel-pentium-g3258-anniversary-edition#tab:photos

 

When I'm wrong, I admit it. I like being wrong, because I learn when someone proves it. If you have to be right to be happy, you must be one miserable person.

[Faa]

And those would be the 4670k and 4770k not the 4690k and 4790k, and by the way did you read the caption under the picture from tom's hardware. The two chips in the picture I provided are 4690k and 4790k. You've been beaten by me twice.

 

Source: http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2014/06/19/intel-core-i7-4790k-devil-s-canyon-review/1

 

 

You've been beaten by me twice.

http://www.iqtest.com/

[ProKoN]

the VR's are located under the IHS . not on the bottom of the cpu

[TheProfosist]

Pentium!

[patrickjp93]

the VR's are located under the IHS . not on the bottom of the cpu

Partly true. You find capacitors, connections, and VRs both under the IHS and on the bottom of the chip unless you'd like to find a technical document which says otherwise.

[patrickjp93]

 

 

Source: http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2014/06/19/intel-core-i7-4790k-devil-s-canyon-review/1

 

 

http://www.iqtest.com/

 

Good you found a stick little doggy. Now, look at the picture on the left. Note the more numerous but admittedly smaller capacitors in the lower 3/4 of the array. The 4790k has a better power regulation system than the 4770k(previous generation) and the 4690k (mainly because the 4690k doesn't employ hyperthreading and have 2x logic resources per core). By the way, your spatial reasoning skills need a little work. There are fewer capacitors on the bottom of the 4690k if you count instead of assuming you see a carbon copy.

 

How many times are you willing to go around in a circle?

[ProKoN]

Partly true. You find capacitors, connections, and VRs both under the IHS and on the bottom of the chip unless you'd like to find a technical document which says otherwise.

 

well haswell is the only intel cpu with VRs. I have delided 4 haswell chips. all you find under there are VR caps and cpu die. all 4 count the same number of VR's under the lid. Ivybridge does not have any VR's under the lid.

 

sorry no  official technical info is available for the public so I cant produce such info.

 

Im very skeptical there have been any physical changes to the package.

[Lays]

well haswell is the only intel cpu with VRs. I have delided 4 haswell chips. all you find under there are VR caps and cpu die. all 4 count the same number of VR's under the lid. Ivybridge does not have any VR's under the lid.

 

sorry no  official technical info is available for the public so I cant produce such info.

 

Im very skeptical there have been any physical changes to the package.

 

 

He is partly right, but it says there's more caps underneathe on Devil's canyon which would mean the bottom of the 4790k and 4690k are the same.

 

[ProKoN]

keep in mind how intel produces their cpu line.

 

intel bins packages they do not physically produce different packages for their varying skus.

 

in theory all 1150 chips are the same physically  with features disabled as you go down the product stack.

 

the top chips are always binned as xeon's

 

next is i7, i5, i3, pentium, celeron.

[Lays]

keep in mind how intel produces their cpu line.

 

intel bins packages they do not physically produce different packages for their varying skus.

 

in theory all 1150 chips are the same physically  with features disabled as you go down the product stack.

 

the top chips are always binned as xeon's

 

next is i7, i5, i3, pentium, celeron.

 

 

well... in the official intel ad, it clearly states there is more capacitors attached to the bottom of the CPU, which would mean they did physically produce a different package. Especially since the ad also states "Enhanced packaging" 

[ProKoN]

well... in the official intel ad, it clearly states there is more capacitors attached to the bottom of the CPU, which would mean they did physically produce a different package. Especially since the ad also states "Enhanced packaging" 

 

this change may very well apply to all haswell refresh chips not just DC

[TheProfosist]

this change may very well apply to all haswell refresh chips not just DC

That would be a bit illogical.

[patrickjp93]

well haswell is the only intel cpu with VRs. I have delided 4 haswell chips. all you find under there are VR caps and cpu die. all 4 count the same number of VR's under the lid. Ivybridge does not have any VR's under the lid.

 

sorry no  official technical info is available for the public so I cant produce such info.

 

Im very skeptical there have been any physical changes to the package.

Have you delidded the DC generation chips? I didn't find a need to because the temps were so good, but I have seen the underside of both 4690k and 4790k, and the capacitor count is very different.

[ProKoN]

Have you delidded the DC generation chips? I didn't find a need to because the temps were so good, but I have seen the underside of both 4690k and 4790k, and the capacitor count is very different.

 

DC is not available in Canada yet.  No I havent. I plan on getting a 4690k when my local vendor has stock. I prolly wont delid if the temps are good. but you never know.

[patrickjp93]

DC is not available in Canada yet.  No I havent. I plan on getting a 4690k when my local vendor has stock. I prolly wont delid if the temps are good. but you never know.

You sure you want the significantly lower clock rate AND core count? I know the price difference is pretty big, but $100 now can save you an extra year or two before having to replace everything. Plus, Newegg ships in Canada doesn't it?

[saddadbadhad]

Get the extra storage as you know you will need it at some point.  You can render on any chip it just takes longer.  Do you really care how fast the chip does something you don't do and may not do? Buy for your needs, if your needs really do change and you have a genuine problem then you can upgrade.

[ProKoN]

You sure you want the significantly lower clock rate AND core count? I know the price difference is pretty big, but $100 now can save you an extra year or two before having to replace everything. Plus, Newegg ships in Canada doesn't it?

 

this chip will be for benching and science. pre-ordered the g3258 for the same reason. DC will be available on newegg.ca as of july 1st\14. im waiting for my local vendor to get stock so i can get the lowest possible price.

 

http://www.memoryexpress.com/Search/Products?Search=4690k

[Faa]

Good you found a stick little doggy. Now, look at the picture on the left. Note the more numerous but admittedly smaller capacitors in the lower 3/4 of the array. There are fewer capacitors on the bottom of the 4690k if you count instead of assuming you see a carbon copy.

First of all get your eyes checked.

You said the 4790k has more "caps" than the 4690k. 

 

 

There are 1.5 times as many stabilizing capacitors on the 4790k vs the 4690k. 

 

 

The 4790k has a better power regulation system than the 4770k(previous generation) and the 4690k (mainly because the 4690k doesn't employ hyperthreading and have 2x logic resources per core). By the way, your spatial reasoning skills need a little work. 

Meh in every new sentence you sound more retarded. I5's and i7's are hardware wise exactly identical, HT on i5's are disabled through microcode and the cache is just dead/lasercut. All Intel cpu's are SMT so every cpu they make do have HT;  HT is achieved by doubling the instruction pipeline, lapic and registers and there's no way theyre lasercutting this so disabling HT through microcode is the obvious story behind this. 

 

How many times are you willing to go around in a circle?

 

Pfff I proved you wrong like fuck, yet you are refusing to stop arguing. It's just literally bullshit after bullshit. 

 

 

well... in the official intel ad, it clearly states there is more capacitors attached to the bottom of the CPU, which would mean they did physically produce a different package. Especially since the ad also states "Enhanced packaging" 

Yeah there is: http://nl.hardware.info/reviews/5418/2/intel-core-i7-4790k--i5-4690k-devils-canyon-review-haswell-voor-overklokkers!-4-ghz!

Caps are only a part of VR, they dont stabilize power or whatever people imagine. They just store energy thats all to it. Stability doesnt only come down to max power output, lots of other factors like ripple current which are mostly dealt with more pwm phases or apparently add a pwm chip to the die like Intel did.

It's just marketing what theyve done with the caps thing. With every new generation you see a different layout, nobody can check if its true so Intel can lie as much as they want. 

[patrickjp93]

 

First of all get your eyes checked.

You said the 4790k has more "caps" than the 4690k. 

 

 

 

 

 

Meh in every new sentence you sound more retarded. I5's and i7's are hardware wise exactly identical, HT on i5's are disabled through microcode and the cache is just dead/lasercut. All Intel cpu's are SMT so every cpu they make do have HT;  HT is achieved by doubling the instruction pipeline, lapic and registers and there's no way theyre lasercutting this so disabling HT through microcode is the obvious story behind this. 

 

 

Pfff I proved you wrong like fuck, yet you are refusing to stop arguing. It's just literally bullshit after bullshit. 

 

 

Yeah there is: http://nl.hardware.info/reviews/5418/2/intel-core-i7-4790k--i5-4690k-devils-canyon-review-haswell-voor-overklokkers!-4-ghz!

Caps are only a part of VR, they dont stabilize power or whatever people imagine. They just store energy thats all to it. Stability doesnt only come down to max power output, lots of other factors like ripple current which are mostly dealt with more pwm phases or apparently add a pwm chip to the die like Intel did.

It's just marketing what theyve done with the caps thing. With every new generation you see a different layout, nobody can check if its true so Intel can lie as much as they want. 

 

Don't stabilize power? Please take a course in digital signals. That is the crowning idiotic comment of the evening. Have you ever heard of impedance? There's an equation relating impedance, negative current, and capacitance you might want to look at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_impedance  

Someone either never took basic electrophysics or snored through Maxwell's equations. The more capacitors between a current clock (the frequency generator) and the end source, the more DC-like the current becomes, the more level it flows, and the more even the voltage which can be supplied. The more caps there are, the better the VR system, and the less noise in a signal at the source.

 

Would it kill you to admit defeat when you've lost, or at least admit there is someone equally if not more learned than you, even if they're new to your stomping grounds? I can't imagine you getting along well with people in a work environment.

[TheProfosist]

this chip will be for benching and science. pre-ordered the g3258 for the same reason. DC will be available on newegg.ca as of july 1st\14. im waiting for my local vendor to get stock so i can get the lowest possible price.

 

http://www.memoryexpress.com/Search/Products?Search=4690k

I preordred my 20th anniversary pentium too!

[Faa]

Don't stabilize power? Please take a course in digital signals.

I think I'm done here already; power isnt digital. Stop trolling.

[patrickjp93]

I think I'm done here already; power isnt digital. Stop trolling.

Omg it's a similar idea that works on the same physics! Capacitors do now what Inductors used to do (allowing for quick acceleration and voltage gains but not allowing for micro-oscillations to affect nano-scale circuitry).

 

God it's like talking to a ten-year-old who thinks he's invincible.

[ProKoN]

@

 

Its Wednesday . still anxious to see your 5.0+ ghz screenes. lets see some cinebench

 

or we will just leave it as a non-validated claim.