Trying to strip Windows 11.

[Gat Pelsinger]

No matter on what system with whatever Windows version, I always deboat and optimize it with all the knowledge I have gathered over years to make Windows usable. What is your memory usage? Over 3-4 gigs? eww. And what is that? Over 200 processes? You disappoint me. I can get those numbers down to 1.2 GB of memory and under 60 processes. "oH, yOu ArE jUsT rEmOvImG fUnCtIoNaLiTy ThOuGh", well YES but I can do all the stuff that you can just better and faster.

 

This time though, I went a little hardcore, and went customizing my Windows ISO through NTLite. I chose Windows 11 and not 10, because I wanted to see if the extra features are worth it and if 11 can also be stripped as much as 10.

 

I did that thing again where I just unpacked the ISO to a completely unformatted partition on my main drive and not use an USB, but I had problems in the installation that it would ask me about the drivers, even though I specifically had integrated drivers into the Windows PE image of my ISO, in order to expect it to boot with the drivers, but it clearly did not. I then went back and redone the customization without touching the WinPE image, but I got the same error. I just gave up and used a neat flashing program and flashed the ISO onto a pen drive and it worked just fine . It also picked up my drivers that I integrated when initializing the OOBE, which was neat.

 

But, when the OOBE appears and I chose to get enter the name for the local account, I can't type anything. Even on screen keyboard can't type anything into the OOBE prompt, but, it can type in the command prompt just fine, but my keyboard still doesn't work in anything. I thought it was because I chose a different keyboard layout in the OOBE, but using the default UK layout also didn't solve the issue. I do remember that I had chosen a different like keyboard or currency or whatever that is at the start of the Windows installer in WinPE, so maybe that could be causing the issue? I don't even know if that setting carries on till here. Also, in the Windows installer, my keyboard layout was still incorrect, and few key presses were typing different things.

 

All this is of course because I was stripping down the ISO. If it is really just because I removed something important, what setting in NTLite should I be looking at? I remember removing a lot of fonts and language packages. I do have my NTLite ISO config file if that is any helpful. Or maybe I hope that this is fixable in the installed system.

 

 

And oh, I forgot to ask this but, how can I actually boot WinPE with drivers? I know drivers in the Windows Installer are not important, but I would like to do it just for the formality. I had integrated my drivers into the Windows PE image in NTLite, but that didn't work. Or maybe I just messed up.

[Blue4130]

6 minutes ago, Gat Pelsinger said:

. "oH, yOu ArE jUsT rEmOvImG fUnCtIoNaLiTy ThOuGh", well YES but I can do all the stuff that you can just better and faster.

 

 

Brags about being better and faster...

 

Followed by a rant about windows not working.

[da na]

Do not take this as criticism of you as a person, but of your approach to operating systems.

 

After failing to compile your own Linux kernel from scratch, you turn to Windows and, instead of using the installer ISO as god intended, remove DLLs, drivers, and programs from the installer image. 

There is a good reason most of those are there. Sure, some might not be needed, but some absolutely are.

 

Perhaps it would suit you best to first install the operating system, then worry about removing components you deem unnecessary? 

[GuiltySpark_]

I'm glad some people find the time to do all that. I just buy good hardware and use the computer, it works just fine.

[BoomerDutch]

Just install windows normally, then use language world to get rid of all those apps.

 

Use Powershell scripts like chris titus tech winutil on github.

 

He created tweaks and patches and fixes and also strips parts of windows as well.

 

Warning though if you strip too much then you'll encounter issues.

 

If you want go hardcore then sure i would've suggested to learn about powershell. The most powerful tool of windows.

[MadAnt250]

Ew, gross! Windows 11.

 

Real chads use Windows XP Professional. 

[Gat Pelsinger]

12 hours ago, Blue4130 said:

Brags about being better and faster...

 

Followed by a rant about windows not working.

better and faster when comparing only with Windows. Linux is still superior of course, but I seem to still have a need for Windows.

[Gat Pelsinger]

12 hours ago, da na said:

After failing to compile your own Linux kernel from scratch,

I do know how to compile my own Kernel and did it several times. What are you talking about? I just had problems installing an older kernel on Arch.

[Gat Pelsinger]

 

@BoomerDutch Yes, I know everything about what you said, and also for @da na, I could debloat it after install, but again, I was just wanting to go a bit hardcore, and that would also save a lot of drive space actually. I will try to fix the problem, but if not, I will install Windows normally. I just wanted to know if somebody had the solution to my problem.

[Gat Pelsinger]

12 hours ago, GuiltySpark_ said:

I'm glad some people find the time to do all that. I just buy good hardware and use the computer, it works just fine.

Ah yes. There is always that rich guy who laughs at other people having problems while he doesn't have any on his billion dollar PC.

 

Okay, it's just a joke, I am exaggerating, but still. The solution to slow performance is not just faster hardware which just brute forces the heap of unnecessarily heavy or unoptimized code. Sadly though, it's Microsoft, and we can't do much except debloat Windows or switch to Linux (best option). 

 

And if you are like, "Nah, Microsoft's doing stuff fine", the new Notepad in Windows 11 takes like 20-70 MB of memory when idle, while the earlier Notepad takes like 1.6 MB, and all they added was tabs, that to having that memory usage with only 1 opened, remembering the last opened file, which is sometimes annoying, and a using a new UI library, which can eat my a$$. For context, Notepad++, takes like 8.6 MB of memory when idle, while having a million more functions than Notepad.

 

Even if I did have a fast PC, with all my technical knowledge, I would still be sensitive enough that it would bother me that I haven't optimized this PC and it can be even faster.

[windozedev]

Could be that your OOBE input issue is something other than a missing driver, like an input service. You can skip oobe all together with an unattended installation.

If there's a way to quickly test the various configurations with boot redundancy, that could be helpful. Or even rolling back to the previous windows configuration if something went awry. That might make stripping windows down and troubleshooting your issue less time consuming. I don't have the time to figure it out, good luck.

[Gat Pelsinger]

10 hours ago, windozedev said:

Could be that your OOBE input issue is something other than a missing driver, like an input service. You can skip oobe all together with an unattended installation.

If there's a way to quickly test the various configurations with boot redundancy, that could be helpful. Or even rolling back to the previous windows configuration if something went awry. That might make stripping windows down and troubleshooting your issue less time consuming. I don't have the time to figure it out, good luck.

Actually my keyboard does work, my command prompt was just out of focus . But any type of input in the OOBE doesn't work. I will still try to find what setting I turned off that made this issue, but if I really am stripping Windows, then might as well remove OOBE itself.

[wasab]

On 6/12/2024 at 5:48 PM, MadAnt250 said:

Ew, gross! Windows 11.

 

Real chads use Windows XP Professional. 

windows xp does use way less ram, perfect for op

[Gat Pelsinger]

7 minutes ago, wasab said:

windows xp does use way less ram, perfect for op

its also way less usable, unperfect for me.

[Alan G]

On 6/13/2024 at 8:02 AM, Gat Pelsinger said:

 

Okay, it's just a joke, I am exaggerating, but still. The solution to slow performance is not just faster hardware which just brute forces the heap of unnecessarily heavy or unoptimized code. Sadly though, it's Microsoft, and we can't do much except debloat Windows or switch to Linux (best option). 

 

What are you defining as "slow performance?"  Is it a specific app/program or just Windows itself.  Part of the issue is that developers have no need to optimize programs as they did at the dawn of the PC era when memory was limited and CPUs generally slow.  I go back to this age and before, learning programing via Fortran on a mainframe and later having a DEC PDP-11 when I was doing a post-doc in the mid-1970s.   Programming back then was a combination of Basic and Assembler to achieve best performance.

 

I still dabble in programming but most of my work is with Office apps (lots of financial analysis with Excel) and Adobe Lightroom (don't need Photoshop much these days).  I don't see any bottlenecks in anything that I do and I just have plain old Windows 11 (upgraded from 10 directly with no issues).  Perhaps you have specific needs that I don't understand from your posts but consider the time and effort that you are putting into making Windows "faster."  Is it worth it?  This is an honest question and I'm not trying to troll you at all.

[Gat Pelsinger]

9 hours ago, Alan G said:

Is it worth it? 

YES. I should already state that I am too sensitive to performance, and absolutely hate any bloat or anything unnecessary additional work my computer does without my saying. Yes, I might have under spec hardware, but I don't see my CPU boosting at 4 GHz. Rather 4 billion cycles per second. On 4 cores, that is like 16 billion cycles per second, and that too with 8 billion bytes of memory. The real reason is, I am still very young, and as a knowledgeable tech enthusiast, a gaming PC is my first priority when I start to earn, but the time is yet to come.

 

I am putting way to much time in hardcore debloating Windows. I should probably seek help...

[wasab]

1 hour ago, Gat Pelsinger said:

YES. I should already state that I am too sensitive to performance, and absolutely hate any bloat or anything unnecessary additional work my computer does without my saying. Yes, I might have under spec hardware, but I don't see my CPU boosting at 4 GHz

So why not downclock your cpu to 1ghz or something? this reduces "work" your cpu does by multiples vs whatever "bloat" you are removing. You can also only run one program at a time in just a text terminal instead of a multitasking windowing gui like the olden days back in the 1980s. The more user experiences you sacrifice, the less your hardware will have to "work". Although I honestly don't understand the point of you doing this. We make hardware and software more capable so they can work better to make our lives easier, you are doing the opposite, making your life harder so your none biological hardware/machines can "work less". I am seriously puzzled. BTW, a majority of instructions your cpus run is actually NOPs which means do nothing. these instructions execute all the time and consume CPU cycles regardless what you do. your CPU is always doing something even if you do absolutely nothing. 

[Gat Pelsinger]

@wasab

 

You think something bizarre of me.

 

The less software load you put on your hardware, the more room you create for additional work, or the same work to be done faster. I run my CPU at full boost, but that doesn't even have to do anything with this.

 

If you still don't understand why I am really doing this, then just picture this. You are still just a student, with just a not so powerful PC that your parents happen to give. You can't ask anything for better (actually you can but they demand MARKS), and so you are stuck with whatever you have. You used your PC fine all this time, but then you suddenly got much knowledgeable about tech and software. Now you know how much piece of garbage Windows and Microsoft is, and how much your PC could be faster if you debloat and optimize it. You put hours into learning and debloat it, and at then end you have quite a but faster system.

 

"Nah, that still ain't so practical though". My debloated installs booted much quicker, and feel much snappier, and I can open a lot of programs and even do android game emulation, which takes a lot of memory, and probably wouldn't be possible without a debloated system. And all that for what? Having not able to see your stocks status on your taskbar (widgets)? Being able to search in the search bar without taking the tremendous effort to open up your browser? Having that driver installed that you will never use in your lifetime?

 

It's really not just me. Some really good people like Chris Titus (YT) are also onto this. They too like debloated systems regardless the hardware.

[wasab]

2 hours ago, Gat Pelsinger said:

@wasab

The less software load you put on your hardware, the more room you create for additional work, or the same work to be done faster. I run my CPU at full boost, but that doesn't even have to do anything with this.

you are far more likely gonna introduce instability than you are to speed up the system. if you worry about this, try disabling stuffs you see in the windows startup manager, start with the highest impact items first then look into windows task manager to see what has the most cpu load. don't remove anything that is shipped by a vanilla install of windows. chances are they are there because they are essential. you can certainly debloat all the OEM softwares they ship with the computer tho. 

[Gat Pelsinger]

1 hour ago, wasab said:

try disabling stuffs you see in the windows startup manager,

Insert meme of when you defeat the level 100 boss and go back to level 1. I know a lot more than just disabling startup apps.

 

1 hour ago, wasab said:

don't remove anything that is shipped by a vanilla install of windows.

All this time this was how I was using Windows (with of course optimizations done on a normal install). But that was because I needed something that just works, and also because I had a lot of data and settings on it that I just couldn't carry over so easily and I was lazy, and also people other other than me used that machine so I wasn't free enough to do stuff on it. Now I am on a different machine where I am independent to do whatever I can, and I already use Ubuntu to get stuff done.

[anirudthelinuxwIzard]

@Gat Pelsinger why not use Linux? If you code in C you probably are proficient enough.

[windozedev]

5 hours ago, wasab said:

you are far more likely gonna introduce instability than you are to speed up the system.

You have no idea what you're talking about. Your opinion is worth about as much as a bloke who's never driven a vehicle, working under the hood of one.

Latency matters, and debloating can be a night and day difference depending on the hardware.

Manufacturers go through great lengths to increase UI responsiveness. Apparently Microsoft didn't get the memo.

[Gat Pelsinger]

2 hours ago, windozedev said:

You have no idea what you're talking about. Your opinion is worth about as much as a bloke who's never driven a vehicle, working under the hood of one.

Latency matters, and debloating can be a night and day difference depending on the hardware.

Manufacturers go through great lengths to increase UI responsiveness. Apparently Microsoft didn't get the memo.

Good to see, someone's with me. But don't be so harsh to others. They probably have good PCs that they never saw an issue, or never got exposed how big, complex, and bloated Windows is inside.

[BoomerDutch]

7 minutes ago, Gat Pelsinger said:

Good to see, someone's with me. But don't be so harsh to others. They probably have good PCs that they never saw an issue, or never got exposed how big, complex, and bloated Windows is inside.

Welcome to the world where everyone is an npc.

[wasab]

3 hours ago, windozedev said:

You have no idea what you're talking about. Your opinion is worth about as much as a bloke who's never driven a vehicle, working under the hood of one.

Latency matters, and debloating can be a night and day difference depending on the hardware.

Manufacturers go through great lengths to increase UI responsiveness. Apparently Microsoft didn't get the memo.

Why do you think I've never used a windows before? 2ndly, are you living in the early 2000s? This might be true back in the days, not so much anymore. Unless you are talking about Intel celeron and Intel atom machines. 

 

8 hours ago, Gat Pelsinger said:

I know a lot more than just disabling startup apps.

And make your operating system none bootable and none functional. 

 

A lot of windows debloating guide you see online are just snake oil like ram cleaner. They do more harm than good. I would just do a vanilla install of windows and call it a day.