Framework Laptop 12th Gen Intel/Ryzen???

[JesseTheHennessy]

So I decided that I would get a Framework laptop for school but one issue, it’s not a dealbreaker but more of, when could this possibly happen? I’m ready to buy a Framework laptop but I know Intel 12th gen series is out and I’m not sure how long it could take the Framework team to have 12th gen main boards as an option or even Ryzen (Intel because of the product cycle, and Ryzen because they’re kicking ass in the laptop CPU department). All this may just be hoopla and may not happen but I was wondering to get opinions

 

Thanks in Advance,

JTH

[Imbadatnames]

Don’t get a framework. They’ll be folding soon and Linus has said it’s wasn’t “all that was promised”

[JesseTheHennessy]

30 minutes ago, Imbadatnames said:

Don’t get a framework. They’ll be folding soon and Linus has said it’s wasn’t “all that was promised”

Damn, I didn’t see this, was there a video I missed?

[Imbadatnames]

26 minutes ago, JesseTheHennessy said:

Damn, I didn’t see this, was there a video I missed?

Was on one of the wan shows a while back, said he might do a video about it, obviously didn’t or hasn’t yet. Dunno though there’s a lot of stuff on the website that’s been “coming soon” for a while.

 

EDIT: I now can’t even get onto their store for “parts”. Every link to a part in their guides or searching the parts store on Google redirects to the preorder page. The page used to be accessible as I’ve been on it. 

[Blademaster91]

The framework site works fine for me, I can see their marketplace for parts, and Framework seems to be a smaller company so it takes longer for them to get things into production. I've noticed a lot of people want a Ryzen version of the Framework, I think it would be great as Ryzen cpu's have an efficiency advantage over Intel 11th gen on mobile, and I'd like if they made a 15.6" version with a 16:9 1080p display.

[JesseTheHennessy]

20 hours ago, Blademaster91 said:

The framework site works fine for me, I can see their marketplace for parts, and Framework seems to be a smaller company so it takes longer for them to get things into production. I've noticed a lot of people want a Ryzen version of the Framework, I think it would be great as Ryzen cpu's have an efficiency advantage over Intel 11th gen on mobile, and I'd like if they made a 15.6" version with a 16:9 1080p display.

Yeah, I figured, they’re a board partner for Intel now so I figured rolling out 12th gen would be a bit of a priority but who knows

[jankdc]

Here is the link to where Linus gives a mini update on Framework: Framework Mini Update

[JesseTheHennessy]

33 minutes ago, jankdc said:

Here is the link to where Linus gives a mini update on Framework: Framework Mini Update

Dang, okay, sad, wanna see what he has to say about it and what laptop I should get instead, thanks for the reply

[jankdc]

2 hours ago, JesseTheHennessy said:

Dang, okay, sad, wanna see what he has to say about it and what laptop I should get instead, thanks for the reply

It's probably what we know about it. Battery life, speakers, weird bios issues. The question is what do you need in a laptop? 

[NightHawkvc25a]

On 4/16/2022 at 6:59 AM, JesseTheHennessy said:

Dang, okay, sad, wanna see what he has to say about it and what laptop I should get instead, thanks for the reply

I was in a very similar situation about 6 months ago and really wanted to give Framework a try, but ultimately settled on the HP Pavilion Aero 13, which Alex reviewed around October.  If you're open to possible alternatives, it might be something to consider. 

 

My top priority was weight, which is where the Aero really shines being listed as 2.2 lbs (around 1 kg) whereas the Framework laptop is listed as 2.87 lbs (or 1.3 kg). My preference at the time was also toward the latest gen Ryzen, which the Aero sports and cools comfortably (way quieter than my previous Dell Inspiron 13 convertible that has a Ryzen 2500U).

 

The only major downside is the Realtek WiFi card located next to the cooler, which I plan to replace with an Intel AX210 from the Framework Marketplace  

 

https://frame.work/products/intel-wi-fi-6e-ax210-no-vpro

 

HP Pavilion Aero 13 brief disassembly: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZT60JY_rPI

 

I'm hoping my next laptop would be Framework though, if they survive.

[hingler36]

Is there any other press out there about Framework folding? If the only clue is Linus saying that he has things he likes and dislikes about the laptop, I don't really think that's an indicator that they're in trouble. He has things he likes and dislikes about literally every laptop he's ever touched, and it makes sense that this one shouldn't be any exception. I've been using mine for a few months, and there are things I dislike about it too. But, they shipped a ton of laptops and they continue to do so. Not sure what indication we have that they'll fold.

[Hexendecimal]

On 4/14/2022 at 10:15 AM, Imbadatnames said:

Don’t get a framework. They’ll be folding soon and Linus has said it’s wasn’t “all that was promised”

What's with the blackpilled bedwetting? You're making extraordinary claims with no evidence. Somebody else posted a link to the segment of the WAN show where Linus gives an update about Framework, and it's a complete nothing-burger. If there was a leak that things weren't going well for Framework, we all would've heard about it by now.

[Imbadatnames]

29 minutes ago, Hexendecimal said:

What's with the blackpilled bedwetting? You're making extraordinary claims with no evidence. Somebody else posted a link to the segment of the WAN show where Linus gives an update about Framework, and it's a complete nothing-burger. If there was a leak that things weren't going well for Framework, we all would've heard about it by now.

European parts store is no longer available and even in the US a lot of stuff is “coming soon” i.e. never 
 

On top that the laptops just aren’t very good and are far worse for the environment than a laptop with everything soldered down. For the price they are abysmal 

[biome]

1 hour ago, Imbadatnames said:

European parts store is no longer available and even in the US a lot of stuff is “coming soon” i.e. never 

Or it just means that they're restocking parts. With global supply chains the way they are right now I don't think this is that unexpected especially with a new(ish) company presumably operating on a tight budget.

 

1 hour ago, Imbadatnames said:

On top that the laptops just aren’t very good

This seems to go against overall user sentiment and pretty much every long term review of the laptops.

1 hour ago, Imbadatnames said:

far worse for the environment than a laptop with everything soldered down.

Again a statement without any evidence. Need to provide a source or some evidence to support your point.

 

Lastly, they're still hiring new staff (link) which would be very peculiar for a struggling company to be doing. You can check on archive.org that these job listing are also being updated quite regularly - likely indicating the advertised roles being filled and new roles being advertised.

 

Everything put together there is no real outward facing proof that Framework is failing. Yes, the laptop is not the best value and not the most performant, but a well-research buyer should know that. The value in Framework laptops is their repairability and perhaps more importantly, in the philosophy of the company making them.

[Hexendecimal]

1 hour ago, Imbadatnames said:

European parts store is no longer available and even in the US a lot of stuff is “coming soon” i.e. never 
 

On top that the laptops just aren’t very good and are far worse for the environment than a laptop with everything soldered down. For the price they are abysmal 

My biggest issue with your post is. You made a claim about the fate of Framework, didn't link to any sources, and its the first reply in this thread. Framework is a startup releasing their first product, there's gonna be some growing pains.

[Imbadatnames]

53 minutes ago, Hexendecimal said:

My biggest issue with your post is. You made a claim about the fate of Framework, didn't link to any sources, and its the first reply in this thread. Framework is a startup releasing their first product, there's gonna be some growing pains.

Look at the store page? It’s not that hard 

[Imbadatnames]

1 hour ago, biome said:

Or it just means that they're restocking parts. With global supply chains the way they are right now I don't think this is that unexpected especially with a new(ish) company presumably operating on a tight budget.

Not really, according to their website stock is held in Asia and shipped out to markets on order. They are also selling units to the EU just not the marketplace which seems a tad redundant. 

1 hour ago, biome said:

 

This seems to go against overall user sentiment and pretty much every long term review of the laptops.

Again a statement without any evidence. Need to provide a source or some evidence to support your point.

It’s not user sentiment it’s people who were sent units. Overall they’re getting passes for things they shouldn’t because “environment” even though the whole concept is terrible for the environment.  

1 hour ago, biome said:

 

Lastly, they're still hiring new staff (link) which would be very peculiar for a struggling company to be doing. You can check on archive.org that these job listing are also being updated quite regularly - likely indicating the advertised roles being filled and new roles being advertised.

Or are they roles from people joining and leaving on a fast turnaround. 

1 hour ago, biome said:

 

Everything put together there is no real outward facing proof that Framework is failing. Yes, the laptop is not the best value and not the most performant, but a well-research buyer should know that. The value in Framework laptops is their repairability and perhaps more importantly, in the philosophy of the company making them.

They don’t have any repairability though because you can’t buy the parts to repair them. 
 

The philosophy is BS and is counter intuitive 

[Hexendecimal]

30 minutes ago, Imbadatnames said:

Look at the store page? It’s not that hard 

Here's a link to the bottom cover store page: https://frame.work/products/bottom-cover-kit

 

They have a couple products "coming soon".

But anything else is ready to order.

 

Nobody posted anything resembling "evidence" until the 6th reply. And not a single link came from you. When asked for evidence,  you replied with the equivalent of "just Google it".

[Hexendecimal]

29 minutes ago, Imbadatnames said:

It’s not user sentiment it’s people who were sent units.

Again, any links to forum threads or YouTube videos reflecting this?

[biome]

3 hours ago, Imbadatnames said:

t’s not user sentiment it’s people who were sent units.

Is that not the same thing? I meant user sentiment as in what people who own the laptops think of their device. 

3 hours ago, Imbadatnames said:

Overall they’re getting passes for things they shouldn’t because “environment”

What do you mean by this? Also, things being accepted based on the strength of their philosophy/message is fairly common, just look at linux and the FOSS community for example. Many people are willing to use a more difficult or less performant tool if they believe in the message.

3 hours ago, Imbadatnames said:

even though the whole concept is terrible for the environment.  

Again you have provided zero evidence for this. I don't see how a device designed with longevity and serviceability in mind can be worse than one that actively discourages such things. I'd love to see a comparison of the Framework's environmental impact relative to its competitors (WITH SOURCES).

3 hours ago, Imbadatnames said:

Or are they roles from people joining and leaving on a fast turnaround. 

Again this is merely speculation. Though so is my original point so let's consider this point moot.

3 hours ago, Imbadatnames said:

They don’t have any repairability though because you can’t buy the parts to repair them. 

Not quite sure that you are talking about here. From their website it looks like most everything is in stock. Would love if you could point out things that framework does not readily have in stock.

3 hours ago, Imbadatnames said:

The philosophy is BS and is counter intuitive 

How? Seems pretty noble to me actually. Linus seemed to think so in his initial review too. He believed in it so much he invested his own money into the project. Again you've made a broad statement without offering any explanation/proof.

 

Stop throwing accusation and inflammatory statements if you don't have the evidence to back them up. I don't see anything public that Framework has done to warrant the irrational hate that you seem to harbour for them.

[Hexendecimal]

3 hours ago, biome said:

Stop throwing accusation and inflammatory statements if you don't have the evidence to back them up. I don't see anything public that Framework has done to warrant the irrational hate that you seem to harbour for them.

Thats what really pissed me off. Nobody was asking this jackhole for recipes until hingler36 jumped in.

[Imbadatnames]

21 hours ago, biome said:

Is that not the same thing? I meant user sentiment as in what people who own the laptops think of their device. 
 

There’s a marked difference between people sent a device for free and people who’ve actually bought one. They can also target people to send one out for favourable reviews. 

21 hours ago, biome said:

What do you mean by this? Also, things being accepted based on the strength of their philosophy/message is fairly common, just look at linux and the FOSS community for example. Many people are willing to use a more difficult or less performant tool if they believe in the message.

Again you have provided zero evidence for this. I don't see how a device designed with longevity and serviceability in mind can be worse than one that actively discourages such things. I'd love to see a comparison of the Framework's environmental impact relative to its competitors (WITH SOURCES).

How about math? If I buy a laptop from a manufacturer with everything soldered down and get 5 years use out of it and then recycle/trade in/sell for a new laptop the amount of waste generated from that purchase is whatever came from the original production, which is mainly from the boards as most metal laptops are made of recycled materials, minus the net benefit of recycling if etc. In frameworks model you’re producing waste from production, waste from the modules that if we’re being favourable 10% will end up in a landfill then when you come to upgrade it,

if you can, you’re ordering a new PCB, at best recycling the old one because who’s going to buy a 5 year old board for a niche product and in the end are just generating a ton more waste than just recycling a whole laptop and getting a new one on top of producing excess amounts of modules that won’t all be sold. Overall a responsibly made and disposed of laptop is more environmentally friendly than frameworks model

21 hours ago, biome said:

Again this is merely speculation. Though so is my original point so let's consider this point moot.

Not quite sure that you are talking about here. From their website it looks like most everything is in stock. Would love if you could point out things that framework does not readily have in stock.

Battery, touchpad and 16/32 keyboard items. 

21 hours ago, biome said:

How? Seems pretty noble to me actually. Linus seemed to think so in his initial review too. He believed in it so much he invested his own money into the project. Again you've made a broad statement without offering any explanation/proof.

Linus has also stated it wasn’t all he thought it was

21 hours ago, biome said:

 

Stop throwing accusation and inflammatory statements if you don't have the evidence to back them up. I don't see anything public that Framework has done to warrant the irrational hate that you seem to harbour for them.

I mean we’ll see if you listen 

[Hexendecimal]

7 hours ago, Imbadatnames said:

There’s a marked difference between people sent a device for free and people who’ve actually bought one. They can also target people to send one out for favourable reviews. 

Citation needed.

 

7 hours ago, Imbadatnames said:

How about math? If I buy a laptop from a manufacturer with everything soldered down and get 5 years use out of it and then recycle/trade in/sell for a new laptop the amount of waste generated from that purchase is whatever came from the original production, which is mainly from the boards as most metal laptops are made of recycled materials, minus the net benefit of recycling if etc. In frameworks model you’re producing waste from production, waste from the modules that if we’re being favourable 10% will end up in a landfill then when you come to upgrade it,

if you can, you’re ordering a new PCB, at best recycling the old one because who’s going to buy a 5 year old board for a niche product and in the end are just generating a ton more waste than just recycling a whole laptop and getting a new one on top of producing excess amounts of modules that won’t all be sold. Overall a responsibly made and disposed of laptop is more environmentally friendly than frameworks model

Those parts still going to be available well after the laptops "useful" lifespan. There are laptops from the 90's that still have parts available. For instance: https://www.ebay.com/itm/121451514229?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=P50mQKJ-QkW&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=w2CMyNXETkS&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=SMS

 

7 hours ago, Imbadatnames said:

Linus has also stated it wasn’t all he thought it was.

If you're talking about that clip from the WAN Show, then that quote is apocryphal.

[AlexFletcher]

On 5/9/2022 at 5:44 PM, Imbadatnames said:

Linus has also stated it wasn’t all he thought it was

It sounded to me more like he was saying that being an investor wasn't what he imagined it would be. Of course there are things that aren't perfect about the laptops as it's a first generation product, the "Did I make a mistake" is a pretty standard clickbait type title these days. That doesn't mean that the company is folding.  

[ahuckphin]

Like with Fairphone, I wouldn't expect the frequency of updates from Framework to be as frequent as tier 1 manufactures (Dell, HP, etc)