Benchmarking Sub Forum?

[Fast_N_Curious]

I'd be happy to start a benchmarking thread or two, does the forum have a sub forum dedicated to this?

[WereCatf]

5 minutes ago, Storm-Chaser said:

I'd be happy to start a benchmarking thread or two, does the forum have a sub forum dedicated to this?

What would an entire new subforum provide that isn't already covered by the existing ones and the various benchmarking - threads that exist?

[Spotty]

There's some pinned threads in the CPU, Motherboards, and Memory forum and Graphics Cards forum that are for discussing overclocking and benchmarking results. Is this the sort of discussions you are looking for?

 

[pythonmegapixel]

Wouldn't it be better if (as currently happens) benchmark discussion just went in the forum for the piece of hardware you are benchmarking?

Surely if you're looking for a new CPU, visiting just the CPU forum is better than having to visit both the CPU forum and the benchmarking forum?

[Fast_N_Curious]

3 hours ago, WereCatf said:

What would an entire new subforum provide that isn't already covered by the existing ones and the various benchmarking - threads that exist?

Yeah I just wanted to bring it up to see what you all thought, I get your point. TechPowerUp, for example, has a great benchmark dedicated sub forum for professionals and hobbyists alike. Just offers more content directed towards the people dedicated to benchmarking, and it has proven a valuable resource for them. Just seeing if that interests you guys is all. I totally see it may be not required if it's just done per specific forum, from time to time. 

 

But from my point of view it simply makes for more good content for the forum overall, especially a computer - tech based forum. In other words, its like having a dynamometer attached to your automotive shop. Makes everything a little more interesting. 

[WereCatf]

11 minutes ago, Storm-Chaser said:

But from my point of view it simply makes for more good content for the forum overall, especially a computer - tech based forum. In other words, its like having a dynamometer attached to your automotive shop. Makes everything a little more interesting.

But "it makes the forums more interesting" doesn't actually answer the question. I wanted to know more specifically what do you have in mind that isn't served by the existing stuff. I don't object to such subforum (not that I have the authority here to deny such anyways! The mods don't exactly love me and my foul mouth! ) , but a wholly roundabout "I just want it" isn't really an argument for creating one.

[Fast_N_Curious]

38 minutes ago, WereCatf said:

But "it makes the forums more interesting" doesn't actually answer the question. I wanted to know more specifically what do you have in mind that isn't served by the existing stuff. I don't object to such subforum (not that I have the authority here to deny such anyways! The mods don't exactly love me and my foul mouth! ) , but a wholly roundabout "I just want it" isn't really an argument for creating one.

Okay, forgive me here. But I seriously cannot tell, are you trolling me or something? We just reasoned that there are no specific forums dedicated to benchmarking. I'm simply inquiring about a benchmarking sub forum. I had an idea for a benchmarking competition so I decided to ask about it... the content can be brought to bear, I can assure you of that. 

 

EDIT: Do you want exact examples of what I might bring to the benchmarking forum, is that your question? Because I can legitimately answer that as well. Trust me my motives here are all good, I have nothing to hide.

[pythonmegapixel]

4 minutes ago, Storm-Chaser said:

Okay, forgive me here. But I seriously cannot tell, are you trolling me or something? We just reasoned that there are no specific forums dedicated to benchmarking. I'm simply inquiring about a benchmarking sub forum. I had an idea for a benchmarking competition so I decided to ask about it... the content can be brought to bear, I can assure you of that. 

 

EDIT: Do you want exact examples of what I might bring to the benchmarking forum, is that your question? Because I can legitimately answer that as well. Trust me my motives here are all good, I have nothing to hide.

The question is why can your benchmarking content not go in one of the hardware forums (e.g. the CPU or Graphics Card forums)? Or if they're gaming related benchmarks, why not in PC Gaming?

[WereCatf]

5 minutes ago, Storm-Chaser said:

Okay, forgive me here. But I seriously cannot tell, are you trolling me or something?

Um, no. The question I asked is perfectly legitimate: what would such a subforum provide that isn't already served by the subforums and the benchmarking-threads that already exist? It's not that difficult a question.

[Fast_N_Curious]

5 minutes ago, pythonmegapixel said:

The question is why can your benchmarking content not go in one of the hardware forums (e.g. the CPU or Graphics Card forums)?

It could go in other places for sure, as you have surmised. I have nothing against that either, keep in mind. My reasoning is that you can get more viability from benchmarking from a dedicated sub forum as opposed to pixelated threads throughout the aggregate forum universe. I think it would serve enrichen the entire forum - (from a content perspective), so long as the content developers could bring said content to bear and then actually make it interesting for other people. 

[Fast_N_Curious]

22 minutes ago, WereCatf said:

Um, no. The question I asked is perfectly legitimate: what would such a subforum provide that isn't already served by the subforums and the benchmarking-threads that already exist? It's not that difficult a question.

Because it would be a forum attribute. It would serve to enhance the diversity of the forum as well. Giving another tangible layer of content to your members. Like adding a dynameter to your automotive shop is the analogy I used earlier. Benchmarking also brings a competitive edge to the fore, which can further enhance member interest and attention and attraction. Again, so long as the interest can be generated and the content made worthwhile. That is an appropriate question, most definitely. You don't want said forum to whither up and die before it ever gets on its feet. 

[LogicalDrm]

1 hour ago, Storm-Chaser said:

It could go in other places for sure, as you have surmised. I have nothing against that either, keep in mind. My reasoning is that you can get more viability from benchmarking from a dedicated sub forum as opposed to pixelated threads throughout the aggregate forum universe. I think it would serve enrichen the entire forum - (from a content perspective), so long as the content developers could bring said content to bear and then actually make it interesting for other people. 

You are coming to this with mindset "if there's something, everything will benefit". But the problem is that just having subforum doesn't mean there will be content. Or that people even find it.

 

We look at things from the other direction. Is there enough threads already that it would be better to group them as new subforum. The last bigger update on forum had some changes to subforums. Biggest ones were to combine air cooling and AIO water coolers to "Cooling" and leave rest as its own sub. It mainly works, with some <10 threads needing to be moved weekly. The other was to separate PSUs from Cases. The previous changes include separation of Windows and other OS's, separation of laptops and phones etc. These are all something which have 10+ active threads daily.

 

If there were new subforums, VR content would probably be the one getting its own subforum. But its still somewhat niche.

 

On benchmarking, are there really more to discuss that wouldn't fit into our current subforums or would benefit from having its own? You are giving big words, but no examples.

[Fast_N_Curious]

1 hour ago, LogicalDrm said:

You are coming to this with mindset "if there's something, everything will benefit". But the problem is that just having subforum doesn't mean there will be content. Or that people even find it.

 

We look at things from the other direction. Is there enough threads already that it would be better to group them as new subforum. The last bigger update on forum had some changes to subforums. Biggest ones were to combine air cooling and AIO water coolers to "Cooling" and leave rest as its own sub. It mainly works, with some <10 threads needing to be moved weekly. The other was to separate PSUs from Cases. The previous changes include separation of Windows and other OS's, separation of laptops and phones etc. These are all something which have 10+ active threads daily.

 

If there were new subforums, VR content would probably be the one getting its own subforum. But its still somewhat niche.

 

On benchmarking, are there really more to discuss that wouldn't fit into our current subforums or would benefit from having its own? You are giving big words, but no examples.

Well, I can give you examples from another tech forum I attend regularly to provide some context for content. These are just some recent threads taken from a direct snip to prove a dedicated benchmarking sub forum can be viable and make for an enjoyable, competitive experience. I didn't build this forum nor am I single handedly taking credit for it's success. You are asking for examples so I am responding in kind. I understand your hesitancy, the need to think it through and that your perspective is entirely your own, coming at this from the opposite side of the coin as administrators of the forum. I can only advocate the potential benefits as an outsider, I get that. Not saying I could be garnering these kinds of results here, but I could certainly give it a go in my spare time, and I would be willing to dedicate some of that time to helping out if you and your people should ever chose to deploy a benchmarking sub forum. Bottom line, I would be happy to contribute if you should ever decide to move forward with this endeavor. No pressure, no demands, on your own purview, if you ever want to go down that path.

 

 

And leaderboard example layout you might find within, with forum information / members blocked out for obvious reasons.

 

 

 

 

 

[Spotty]

Suggestions for the forum are always welcome.

New forums are typically added on a needs basis. If you have too many subforums it can actually lead to less people posting in those categories, and because topics become fragmented there are less people responding to topics, meaning less discussion and eventually less people posting.

 

Looking at the existing benchmarking pinned topics in CPUs and Graphics Cards forums, the majority of the discussion there is simply people posting a screenshot of their results saying "Here's my results". I'm not sure if an entire forum dedicated to people just posting screenshots of their benchmark results would encourage much discussion amongst the community. There are already pinned posts in the relevant forums for people to share their CPU/GPU benchmarking results which should meet those needs.

Taking examples from your screenshot above, if you wanted to start a discussion on memory overclocking & benchmarking you could do so in the CPU Motherboards and Memory forum.

 

What would be specific to a Benchmarking forum that would not fit in or overlap with the existing forums such as CPUs Motherboards and Memory, Graphics Cards, PC Gaming, or Programs Apps and Websites forums.

Edited December 31, 2020 by Spotty

[LogicalDrm]

21 minutes ago, Storm-Chaser said:

Well, I can give you examples from another tech forum I attend regularly to provide some context for content. These are just some recent threads taken from a direct snip to prove a dedicated benchmarking sub forum can be viable and make for an enjoyable, competitive experience. I didn't build this forum nor am I single handedly taking credit for it's success. You are asking for examples so I am responding in kind. I understand your hesitancy, the need to think it through and that your perspective is entirely your own, coming at this from the opposite side of the coin as administrators of the forum. I can only advocate the potential benefits as an outsider, I get that. Not saying I could be garnering these kinds of results here, but I could certainly give it a go in my spare time, and I would be willing to dedicate some of that time to helping out if you and your people should ever chose to deploy a benchmarking sub forum. Bottom line, I would be happy to contribute if you should ever decide to move forward with this endeavor. No pressure, no demands, on your own purview, if you ever want to go down that path.

All of those threads would fit fine under existing subforums. And if the activity is about that range, its way too little for getting own subforum. Here (old stats from about year ago) least activity are in Member Review and Guides sections. Even the most niche subforums get more activity than the TechPowerUp subforum.

[Fast_N_Curious]

3 hours ago, Spotty said:

Suggestions for the forum are always welcome.

New forums are typically added on a needs basis. If you have too many subforums it can actually lead to less people posting in those categories, and because topics become fragmented there are less people responding to topics, meaning less discussion and eventually less people posting.

 

Looking at the existing benchmarking pinned topics in CPUs and Graphics Cards forums, the majority of the discussion there is simply people posting a screenshot of their results saying "Here's my results". I'm not sure if an entire forum dedicated to people just posting screenshots of their benchmark results would encourage much discussion amongst the community. There are already pinned posts in the relevant forums for people to share their CPU/GPU benchmarking results which should meet those needs.

Taking examples from your screenshot above, if you wanted to start a discussion on memory overclocking & benchmarking you could do so in the CPU Motherboards and Memory forum.

 

What would be specific to a Benchmarking forum that would not fit in or overlap with the existing forums such as CPUs Motherboards and Memory, Graphics Cards, PC Gaming, or Programs Apps and Websites forums.

It's your forum and you run it as you see fit. And I'm certainly NOT here to bash you for not having one, or tell you what to do... just came to mind one day so I thought I would inquire about it, cant hurt. And yeah, going up in forum count is usually a bad idea.  It can be a delicate balance that's hard to strike. Personally, I agree, the less sub forums the better in nearly every case. That being said I am a bit surprised with your responses though. It's pretty well established that benchmarking goes hand and hand with computer hardware and many many computer forums have dedicated benchmarking forums because it's essentially performance extension of what we build. It's the expression of the soul, so to speak. 

 

I would just like to point out a major difference here. I would be capitalizing on the competitive nature of benchmarking as opposed to just listing benchmark screenshots/snips in some gargantuan monster thread. Or at least, that would be the hope (we've had pretty good success at the other forum with that). That way members can compete head to head in what ever challenges they want to go for and people will come back to make further improvements and OC tweaks and hopefully breed more competition whilst enjoying the thrills and spills that go along with overclocking. Add competition and that's my recipe for success!

[Fast_N_Curious]

4 hours ago, LogicalDrm said:

All of those threads would fit fine under existing subforums. And if the activity is about that range, its way too little for getting own subforum. Here (old stats from about year ago) least activity are in Member Review and Guides sections. Even the most niche subforums get more activity than the TechPowerUp subforum.

We have great viability with the benchmarking sub forum at TPU. It's not dead in the least, and that's enough traffic to sustain multiple benchmarks / competitions consistently for the past few years. It's also a great supplement to the rest of the forum. My confidence rests from knowing we have a good recipe for success! That's why I reached out because I think it could be really fun.

Techpowerup is actually a pretty busy forum for the most part, so if it worked there chances are it will work here... Most of my competition runs get at least 5K in hits and we have great staying power. Plenty of my competition threads from last year are actually still going on and still being updated. Sure, we have established those can fit in those other places and it can be made it work, I am just advocating for a sub forum instead because I believe the content would be that good.  

 

I don't want to beat a dead horse but I'm going back to the automotive analogy. Shops with dynamometers generally have a little more interesting things going on.

 

Again, I want to be clear, I am not trying to railroad anyone here. Simply making my humble appeal. But at the end of the day it doesn't bother me one way or the other if you go for it or not. Totally understand your position here, you guys own and run the forum so its your vision not mine and I'm okay with that as well. 

 

:cheers:

 

 

[LogicalDrm]

1 hour ago, Storm-Chaser said:

 

We are not shooting out ideas. Just pointing out how decisions are made here. You are free to create threads and content. And then we will see how community reacts and takes part in them. If it creates even more content, and we would notice it like we do other major aspects like VR for example, it might be implemented. But there really needs to be the content first, not subforum first.

 

The difference is that TPU is rather old forum (in your screenshot there's thread from 2009). The audience is different, and changes might not happen, or would receive more vocal push-back if they happen. For example, we had Small Form Factor subforum when this forum was created. During move to different forum software it was removed due lack of activity. That decision got push-back, and may have driven some members off forums as a result. To me this tells more about audience forums are mainly for. To this forums its very much general userbase with hints of every direction. So creating very specific subforums would receive very little activity due the fact that there aren't so many interested to begin with.

 

Looking at another rather young tech forum, which is also spun from Youtube audience, Level1 Techs. They have Benchmarking subforum for 1.5 years now. Its pretty much dead. Which imo speaks about the younger and more general audience youtubers gather. They do have active Overclocking subforum which might actually be the way you would want to go further with this suggestion. As you may have noticed, we have bundled similar topics together to keep activity up and browsing easy. So there might be case to be made for "Overclocking and Becnhmarking" subforum. After all, tweaking involved goes hand in hand with those subjects.

 

To note that some of other subforums proposed include retro stuff, cybersecurity and enterprise gear. I don't browse in Servers and NAS sub so I don't know how much that includes enterprise grade discussion. The others get occasional thread, like once a month type. The posters suggesting these were told same as we told you. There needs to be content first, and you can be the one trying to ignite that. But those haven't really caught speed. Which imo also tells about the audience browsing here.

[Fast_N_Curious]

8 hours ago, LogicalDrm said:

We are not shooting out ideas. Just pointing out how decisions are made here. You are free to create threads and content. And then we will see how community reacts and takes part in them. If it creates even more content, and we would notice it like we do other major aspects like VR for example, it might be implemented. But there really needs to be the content first, not subforum first.

 

The difference is that TPU is rather old forum (in your screenshot there's thread from 2009). The audience is different, and changes might not happen, or would receive more vocal push-back if they happen. For example, we had Small Form Factor subforum when this forum was created. During move to different forum software it was removed due lack of activity. That decision got push-back, and may have driven some members off forums as a result. To me this tells more about audience forums are mainly for. To this forums its very much general userbase with hints of every direction. So creating very specific subforums would receive very little activity due the fact that there aren't so many interested to begin with.

 

Looking at another rather young tech forum, which is also spun from Youtube audience, Level1 Techs. They have Benchmarking subforum for 1.5 years now. Its pretty much dead. Which imo speaks about the younger and more general audience youtubers gather. They do have active Overclocking subforum which might actually be the way you would want to go further with this suggestion. As you may have noticed, we have bundled similar topics together to keep activity up and browsing easy. So there might be case to be made for "Overclocking and Becnhmarking" subforum. After all, tweaking involved goes hand in hand with those subjects.

 

To note that some of other subforums proposed include retro stuff, cybersecurity and enterprise gear. I don't browse in Servers and NAS sub so I don't know how much that includes enterprise grade discussion. The others get occasional thread, like once a month type. The posters suggesting these were told same as we told you. There needs to be content first, and you can be the one trying to ignite that. But those haven't really caught speed. Which imo also tells about the audience browsing here.

Okay very cool. I will give it a go per the recommendations above and see if we can get any interest. I guess if it takes hold at some point, everyone will know what to do. Thanks guys, I'll get something in the works in the next few days. 

[Fast_N_Curious]

21 hours ago, Spotty said:

What would be specific to a Benchmarking forum that would not fit in or overlap with the existing forums such as CPUs Motherboards and Memory, Graphics Cards, PC Gaming, or Programs Apps and Websites forums.

Sorry I missed this yesterday. I think it the best example I can provide would be a screenshot like this from a dedicated benchmarking sub-forum. These are the types of threads that are specific to the benchmarking content we want and so they get put here.

 

 

 

[WereCatf]

1 hour ago, Storm-Chaser said:

Sorry I missed this yesterday. I think it the best example I can provide would be a screenshot like this from a dedicated benchmarking sub-forum. These are the types of threads that are specific to the benchmarking content we want and so they get put here.

Personally, I'm not impressed or convinced. Half of those threads are just the "post your score" - type, which isn't important enough that it'd warrant even the thought of a whole new subforum and then there's a couple of competition - threads that have very little activity in them. 10 posts a month is hardly impressive.

[Fast_N_Curious]

4 hours ago, WereCatf said:

Personally, I'm not impressed or convinced. Half of those threads are just the "post your score" - type, which isn't important enough that it'd warrant even the thought of a whole new subforum and then there's a couple of competition - threads that have very little activity in them. 10 posts a month is hardly impressive.

FYI all of my benchmarks on that page are competitions. In fact I never do "post up your score" type threads at all. So I understand your point there. I just posted that snip because it's an example of the kind of content you will see in a dedicated benchmarking type forum. 

 

Very little activity is relative. Most of those threads will see about 1K in the first month which is pretty crucial and more than enough to spark further interest. A thread with 1K views on the first month on a computer related tech forum is actually pretty decent. 

 

But all that being said, if there is no interest it's not worth wasting everyone's time. Only time will tell.