Intel or AMD - which one is superior?

[GoldenLag]

4 minutes ago, mautokar said:

AMD cooler is ok, but I heard it is loud

Its noisy, but not obnouxius. Nor especially loud.

 

 

Stealth being the loudest one, tho the rest pretty decent. 

[mautokar]

For Intel I was thinking about Gigabyte Z390 AORUS PRO WIFI and for AMD MSI MPG X570 GAMING PRO CARBON WIFI or MSI MPG X570 GAMING EDGE WIFI. The second MSI motherboard has similar price to the Z390 one. I was thinking about those MB, because I want WiFi included (choosing motherboard is topic for another discussion).

 

It is funny, because it actually shows that people don't want Intel even if it is on the similar price to AMD 3700X. I'm wondering if Intel adjust the prices on standard market  

[GoldenLag]

1 minute ago, Constantin said:

Yes, but i am very satisfied at 4.943.1Mhz.

 

In othersm words. Perfectly coolable with the 9900k at the same speed.....

 

[Constantin]

1 hour ago, GoldenLag said:

In othersm words. Perfectly coolable with the 9900k at the same speed.....

 

Mate i assure you the 9900k is an extremely hot prosesor and a top end cooler is needed.

[GoldenLag]

Just now, Constantin said:

Mate i assure you the 9900k is an extremely hot prosesor and a top end cooler is needed.

The 9700k is equally hot if you didnt know..

[GoldenLag]

11 minutes ago, mautokar said:

AMD MSI MPG X570 GAMING PRO CARBON WIFI or MSI MPG X570 GAMING EDGE WIFI. The second MSI motherboard has similar price to the Z390 one

Roughly 300$?

 

Because at that pricepoint the Taichi is the best it seems.

 

At 250$ its really pick and choose

[mautokar]

@GoldenLag at least in my country ASRock Taichi x570 is more expensive than all MBs I mentioned. I read also somewhere (maybe reddit) that people complain about fan on Taichi MB, because it is mounted right under GPU.

 

Taichi Z390 is also ~40$ more expensive than Gigabyte...

[GoldenLag]

1 minute ago, mautokar said:

@GoldenLag at least in my country ASRock Taichi x570 is more expensive than all MBs I mentioned. I read also somewhere (maybe reddit) that people complain about fan on Taichi MB, because it is mounted right under GPU.

 

Taichi Z390 is also ~40$ more expensive than Gigabyte...

Just get the msi x570

 

Keep in mind, just because the boards have the same names. Z390 and x57/ are not similar

[Constantin]

@GoldenLag

I just did a stress test.

4.943.1Mhz 

And this is the voltage.

[GoldenLag]

18 minutes ago, Constantin said:

@GoldenLag

I just did a stress test.

4.943.1Mhz 

And this is the voltage.

None of those numbers are alarming at all....

[Mister Woof]

22 minutes ago, Constantin said:

@GoldenLag

I just did a stress test.

4.943.1Mhz 

And this is the voltage.

Did you stress test it with Chrome or something?

[Constantin]

1 hour ago, Plutosaurus said:

Did you stress test it with Chrome or something?

One and half hours of Far Cry 5, Max settings 4K

[Mister Woof]

4 minutes ago, Constantin said:

One and half hours of Far Cry 5, Max settings 4K

 I'm not gonna be that guy that insists on 16 hours of P95, but maybe at least am hour of A64

[mautokar]

So it looks like I will take AMD platform  Hopefully it will work with good performance for many years. Thank you all for your input.

[Tom H]

Here are my thoughts:

 

First of all...

 

Most of the popular ryzen 3rd gen reviews did tests with 2080ti's at 1080p or even 720p. The methodology was to use lower resolutions and 2080ti's so they would not gpu limit their tests.

 

SO...with a 2080ti, and 1080p or 720p resolutions, you can conclude that the intel holds a 5-10% lead at gaming, and amd destroys intel at everything else. This doesn't mean that ryzen 3000 is slow, in fact, they have made up and closed the gap with intel. If they used a more realistic mid range video card that 90% of people are using that 5-10% intel lead shrinks to 2-4%.

 

The reality is, no one in their right minds will spend the money on 2080ti's and game at 720p. It just doesn't make sense. Its more likely that if you are going to spend $1400 on a vid card, you are probably going to game at 1440p or higher. If you look at the 1440p and 4k benchmarks, intel and amd are virtually tied

 

I think for most people, the ryzen 3600 is all they really need. I bought my wife a 3600x on a B450 pro carbon motherboard and it absolutely kicks butt. I was so impressed with the performance that I bought a 3700x  for myself. The last time I bought amd was an althon 64, that was more than 10 years ago. Since then i've only bought intel but ryzen 3000 has closed the gap to the point that the additional cost of buying intel doesnt make sense anymore.

 

the next gen playstation 5 will have 8c/16t amd ryzen cpus, with higher end navi graphics. You don't think games will start to be optimized more for cores?? it is inevitable

 

We are in a core war now. Spend more for cores not singlethreaded speed

[mautokar]

@Tom H I'm aware of lower difference in higher resolution and cheaper card (I'll buy 2070 Super). Specification of current and new consoles will be similar and I hope future games will be more optimised for AMD platform. However Sony has its own low level SDK and PC are using (mostly) DirectX (I'm not sure how it looks on XBox). It means that optimisation are probably different between platforms and on PC market Intel still holds majority (around 80% looking at the Steam report).

 

Many cores will probably benefit in future, however either Intel i9 9900k and AMD Ryzen 3700X have the same number of cores/threads ;)

 

Out of curiosity @Tom H you are using Ryzen 3600 on B450 motherboard. Did you encounter any issues with this build? Also you are buying 3700X, what MB did you choose?

[MadmanRB]

16 hours ago, Fakmykak said:

A 9900K is better than a 3700x in gaming. And just as good in professional work loads. If both were same price, I would 100% get the 9900k.

 

 There are a lot of videos online of people being paid by AMD, to downclock a 9900K to 4GHz while comparing it with the new Ryzen3000 chips. Essentially spreading lies.

 

Look at the graphs in the video. They downclocked the 9900K to 4GHz to make ryzen look better. Anyone who does not know better will believe it. Quite unfortunate....

 

Just like intel paid you to make a rather oblivious comment.

 

Come on man, cant take the notion that AMD is actually competition now?

What blew $500 into a core i9 only to find out that AMD actually has something that can compete with it for less cash?

[Guest]

16 hours ago, mautokar said:

For Intel I was thinking about Gigabyte Z390 AORUS PRO WIFI and for AMD MSI MPG X570 GAMING PRO CARBON WIFI or MSI MPG X570 GAMING EDGE WIFI. The second MSI motherboard has similar price to the Z390 one. I was thinking about those MB, because I want WiFi included (choosing motherboard is topic for another discussion).

 

It is funny, because it actually shows that people don't want Intel even if it is on the similar price to AMD 3700X. I'm wondering if Intel adjust the prices on standard market  

Why not go X470? It will be a while before any GPU will flood the PCI bus and I cannot see most people needing the other features X570 provides. So a substantial saving can be made by going X470 with very little lost in terms of performance.

[mautokar]

@Phill104 I was thinking about x470, but two things:

• I want WiFi module included in MB - x470 with such module have similar price (Gigabyte X470 AORUS GAMING 5 WIFI or Gigabyte X470 AORUS GAMING 7 WIFI - both are ~10-20$ cheaper than MSI x570 I mentioned earlier)
• this build is for years - I expect at least on more CPU generation (Zen 2+) - hopefully older MBs will also support new CPUs, but there is also PCIe 4.0 support which may be actually useful in 3 years (?)

From my perspective price difference isn't big. I know some x470 MBs have support for PCIe 4.0, but they are usually budget options (not mine) and I heard that AMD wants to block it for all non x570 chipsets...

Of course x470 has advantage of not having this "stupid" little fan and in general has smaller TDP. Also even now GPUs are only starting to use PCIe 3.0 speed limit, but things may change in future.

 

So I chose x570 because of small difference in price and possible better support in future.

[Guest]

I can understand that. Personally I am not sure that even in three years time PCI 4.0 will be of much advantage to most. Current GPUs, even with twin cards etc still do not bottleneck on the bus. Storage is probably the biggest place we will see speed increases. For me the current PCI M.2 drives are fast enough for most things especially as a lot of my storage is on  an external NAS and limited by that. 

 

As you say, TDP and that bloody fan are the biggest drawbacks of x570. I bet in a couple of years time we will see a lot of boards ditching that fan.

[lawliot]

It really just depends on your use case though. Do you mainly game or work projects that needs higher core count.

[Tom H]

7 hours ago, mautokar said:

@Tom H I'm aware of lower difference in higher resolution and cheaper card (I'll buy 2070 Super). Specification of current and new consoles will be similar and I hope future games will be more optimised for AMD platform. However Sony has its own low level SDK and PC are using (mostly) DirectX (I'm not sure how it looks on XBox). It means that optimisation are probably different between platforms and on PC market Intel still holds majority (around 80% looking at the Steam report).

 

Many cores will probably benefit in future, however either Intel i9 9900k and AMD Ryzen 3700X have the same number of cores/threads

 

Out of curiosity @Tom H you are using Ryzen 3600 on B450 motherboard. Did you encounter any issues with this build? Also you are buying 3700X, what MB did you choose?

9900k is a power hungry beast, especially if you overclock it, but it is undoubtedly the fastest gaming cpu on the planet. it is also much more expensive. I figured this round, I was going to give my money to AMD. Intel has been getting lazy without competition. They have essentially been selling the same tech since the core i7 7700k. Hopefully,ryzen 3rd gen lights a fire under their pants and gets them going. i'm sick of seeing 14nm +++++++++++++++++

 

I can't speak for other B450 boards but I went with the MSI B450 pro carbon ac because it has the bios flashback button which allows you to flash bios without cpu installed. Just plug in the power supply, copy the bios on a usb stick and push the button. All b450 boards will need a bios update to support the new ryzen.

 

The only issue I had was that I had to flash the bios twice. The first time, it appeared that the bios updated, I shut off the power, proceeded to build the rest of the computer and then it would not post. The one step that I'm seeing more and more in the forums is that people recommend to clear the cmos then flash again. I did that and it was successful on my second attempt. This was my experience with the 3600 build. The computer runs like a champ. Very good performance for the money. I chose the same motherboard for the 3700x. The VRMs are strong enough to handle it. Not all b450 boards have good vrms, but the MSI carbon ac was recommended by buildzoid and it is a premium b450 board. I could have gotten an entry level x570 for just a little more. But the entry x570s are quite barren in features. There are many that are having issues though so the safe play is to get the x570 if you don't want to mess around with the bios

[mautokar]

Ok, so I decided to buy AMD Ryzen 3700X (already in shipment), but I'm still not sure which motherboard model choose. As I wrote earlier the most important element in MB is WiFi module. I found 3 models with reasonable price:

 

MSI MPG X570 GAMING EDGE WIFI ~235$
+ cheapest
- weakest WiFi module (433 Mbps)
- WiFi antennas on the back of computer (it may affect signal strength)
- second m.2 slot is smaller (but I think 80mm is standard SSD nvme size, so it actually fits)
- second m.2 slot has only PCIe 3.0 for some reason

 

ASUS TUF GAMING X570-PLUS (Wi-Fi) ~260$
+ good WiFi module (~1.8 Gbps)
+ WiFi antenna on cable (can put it anywhere)
+/- price is ok
- MB fan may be under GPU - I wrote about problems with it on ASRock (Taichi) MBs; I'm afraid it may be similar here

 

MSI MPG X570 GAMING PRO CARBON WIFI ~305$
+ newest WiFI module (~2.2 Gbps)
+ WiFi antenna on cable (can put it anywhere)
- PCIe x1 slots are using version 3.0
- most expensive

 

To be honest I wanted to buy this most expensive one. But I'm not sure if it is worth it. The cheapest one should fit all my needs - I probably won't use multiGPU or any PCI extension device. I may buy second m.2 SSD in the future, but current one doesn't benefit from PCIe 4.0, so only one m.2 slot on this interface is not a problem.

 

I was only worrying about this WiFi module. Asus seems ok with that and has comparable externals, but I'm afraid of this MB fan right under GPU. Because of all these fears I wanted to buy MSI CARBON.

 

Unfortunately I didn't find info about power sections in these MBs (I read the manuals). I also didn't find any serious reviews of any of them. Do you have any general opinions about producers? Did you find something in specification that I missed and may be important in this "battle"? Maybe do you have some information about real performance of these MBs?