Ram bottleneck question

[TuRB0DN]

Hi guys! I have 3x2gb patriot 1333mhz ram and 1 chinese noname 1333 2gb stick. The question is next: Can this ram bottleneck my system?

CPU: I7 3770k oc'ed to 4.1 ghz

Motherboard: gigabyte z77x ud3h

Ram: Patriot 1333mhz

SSD/HDD: Hdd only Toshiba 1TB 7200RPM Sata3

GPU: Gigabyte g1 1070ti

PSU: 750Watt Chieftec Force

Chassis: Cooler Master ATX

OS: Windows 10 Pro 64bit

my avg fps in games like fortnite/overwatch/pubg is much lower than avg fps on youtube tests with same gpu/cpu like mine. Also i have huge fps drops in fights.

Also, I found this video saying that overwatch is ram-speed dependent game: https://youtu.be/7rw6nV75qfE

[AndrewMKlasen]

That is a kinda old system, I'd say get a new rig personally, but in all seriousness, the RAM could bottleneck because of the 1333mhz speed.

[BootyDustBandit]

4 hours ago, TuRB0DN said:

Hi guys! I have 3x2gb patriot 1333mhz ram and 1 chinese noname 1333 2gb stick. The question is next: Can this ram bottleneck my system?

CPU: I7 3770k oc'ed to 4.1 ghz

Motherboard: gigabyte z77x ud3h

Ram: Patriot 1333mhz

SSD/HDD: Hdd only Toshiba 1TB 7200RPM Sata3

GPU: Gigabyte g1 1070ti

PSU: 750Watt Chieftec Force

Chassis: Cooler Master ATX

OS: Windows 10 Pro 64bit

my avg fps in games like fortnite/overwatch/pubg is much lower than avg fps on youtube tests with same gpu/cpu like mine. Also i have huge fps drops in fights.

Also, I found this video saying that overwatch is ram-speed dependent game: https://youtu.be/7rw6nV75qfE

yeah that ram speed is not going to bottleneck your rig but your CPU will (though faster speed memory may result in higher speeds it isn't significant) your CPU is actually going to bottleneck your GPU, decreasing its performance by about 12%
your CPU is actually the best bet for your system and the only real option to get rid of that bottleneck is a GPU downgrade or you could upgrade everything els in your PC
for a ram upgrade get something 2400+ if you are looking to go cheap but if you have the extra money I would go with 2666 which is your motherboard max speed for memory
if you do get a new rig then get memory at least 3000 or higher (though going past 3600 is a waste and theres not really any point)

[BootyDustBandit]

4 hours ago, TuRB0DN said:

Hi guys! I have 3x2gb patriot 1333mhz ram and 1 chinese noname 1333 2gb stick. The question is next: Can this ram bottleneck my system?

CPU: I7 3770k oc'ed to 4.1 ghz

Motherboard: gigabyte z77x ud3h

Ram: Patriot 1333mhz

SSD/HDD: Hdd only Toshiba 1TB 7200RPM Sata3

GPU: Gigabyte g1 1070ti

PSU: 750Watt Chieftec Force

Chassis: Cooler Master ATX

OS: Windows 10 Pro 64bit

my avg fps in games like fortnite/overwatch/pubg is much lower than avg fps on youtube tests with same gpu/cpu like mine. Also i have huge fps drops in fights.

Also, I found this video saying that overwatch is ram-speed dependent game: https://youtu.be/7rw6nV75qfE

if you opt to get a new rig maybe something like this would work

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

Type	Item	Price
CPU	AMD - FX-9590 4.7GHz 8-Core OEM/Tray Processor	$99.99 @ Newegg
CPU Cooler	Deepcool - CAPTAIN360EX 229.6 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler	$109.99 @ Amazon
Motherboard	ASRock - 970A-G/3.1 ATX AM3+/AM3 Motherboard	$129.99 @ Amazon
Memory	G.Skill - Sniper Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR3-2400 Memory	$199.99 @ Newegg
Storage	Corsair - MP300 120GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive	$34.99 @ Amazon
Storage	Seagate - Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive	$58.89 @ OutletPC
Video Card	MSI - Radeon RX 580 8GB ARMOR MK2 OC Video Card	$219.99 @ Newegg
Case	DIYPC - IllusionII-BR ATX Mid Tower Case	$49.97 @ Newegg Business
Power Supply	SeaSonic - FOCUS Plus Gold 850W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply	$108.62 @ Amazon
	Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts
	Total (before mail-in rebates)	$1032.42
	Mail-in rebates	-$20.00
	Total	$1012.42
	Generated by PCPartPicker 2018-11-05 14:06 EST-0500

 

[AngryBeaver]

5 hours ago, TuRB0DN said:

Hi guys! I have 3x2gb patriot 1333mhz ram and 1 chinese noname 1333 2gb stick. The question is next: Can this ram bottleneck my system?

CPU: I7 3770k oc'ed to 4.1 ghz

Motherboard: gigabyte z77x ud3h

Ram: Patriot 1333mhz

SSD/HDD: Hdd only Toshiba 1TB 7200RPM Sata3

GPU: Gigabyte g1 1070ti

PSU: 750Watt Chieftec Force

Chassis: Cooler Master ATX

OS: Windows 10 Pro 64bit

my avg fps in games like fortnite/overwatch/pubg is much lower than avg fps on youtube tests with same gpu/cpu like mine. Also i have huge fps drops in fights.

Also, I found this video saying that overwatch is ram-speed dependent game: https://youtu.be/7rw6nV75qfE

Ok let me touch on this a little. While your ram is by no means fast... since you are on a intel system your system doesn't depend as much on it to function correctly. So it might hurt your performance in games a tad, but they have proven over and over that on intel systems ram speed makes for very minimal gains when it comes to fps... so you might be losing 1-5% fps AT MOST in some games... which isn't much.

 

Second the people knocking your CPU also need to do some research. I have a system in my lab using a 2600k and a 980ti (1070 level performance) and it use to be clocked at 4.8ghz, but is now at 4.5ghz because the kids using it don't actually need anything more. That being said it does NOT bottleneck that card compared to a 8700k or 7700k... the only difference I have in fps is due to the 2600k not supporting pci-e 3.0.

 

Now your 3770k DOES support pci-e 3.0 and can also be overclocked to 4.5 if you have a decent cooler. So if you toss a little more overclock on it you should be more than fine when it comes to gaming. I mean have you noticed it bottlenecking in games? You would see something like 100% cpu usage and 70% gpu usage. If your gpu is running at close to 100% usage it isn't being bottlenecked... and if it isn't running at 100% and you have vsync on for example then chances are it still isn't a bottleneck you are just hitting your refresh rate limit.

 

So I would disregard all of these suggestion to build a new system. Also, if you want to do the research chances are you can overclock your ram to 1600 (which use to be one of the more popular speeds for the longest time) I have't seen many ram sticks that can't be bumped up one speed with an OC and still be stable. Doesn't mean you need to, but generally it doesn't require anything other than changing the speed from 1333 to 1600 no voltage or timing setting changes are normally needed... if it doesn't boot or you start getting BSOD... then revert it and call it a day.

[AngryBeaver]

Also I will add this here.

 

So 1333 vs 2400 was less than 1 fps most of the time. 800mhz was 5fps less in one test... so in the end there is negligible difference.

 

[TuRB0DN]

3 hours ago, AngryBeaver said:

Ok let me touch on this a little. While your ram is by no means fast... since you are on a intel system your system doesn't depend as much on it to function correctly. So it might hurt your performance in games a tad, but they have proven over and over that on intel systems ram speed makes for very minimal gains when it comes to fps... so you might be losing 1-5% fps AT MOST in some games... which isn't much.

 

Second the people knocking your CPU also need to do some research. I have a system in my lab using a 2600k and a 980ti (1070 level performance) and it use to be clocked at 4.8ghz, but is now at 4.5ghz because the kids using it don't actually need anything more. That being said it does NOT bottleneck that card compared to a 8700k or 7700k... the only difference I have in fps is due to the 2600k not supporting pci-e 3.0.

 

Now your 3770k DOES support pci-e 3.0 and can also be overclocked to 4.5 if you have a decent cooler. So if you toss a little more overclock on it you should be more than fine when it comes to gaming. I mean have you noticed it bottlenecking in games? You would see something like 100% cpu usage and 70% gpu usage. If your gpu is running at close to 100% usage it isn't being bottlenecked... and if it isn't running at 100% and you have vsync on for example then chances are it still isn't a bottleneck you are just hitting your refresh rate limit.

 

So I would disregard all of these suggestion to build a new system. Also, if you want to do the research chances are you can overclock your ram to 1600 (which use to be one of the more popular speeds for the longest time) I have't seen many ram sticks that can't be bumped up one speed with an OC and still be stable. Doesn't mean you need to, but generally it doesn't require anything other than changing the speed from 1333 to 1600 no voltage or timing setting changes are normally needed... if it doesn't boot or you start getting BSOD... then revert it and call it a day.

1)Resource usage: I did a benchmark during 1 overwatch game with RivaTuner-Afterburner and my gpu/cpu usage wasn't even close to 100%, also my ram usage was around 5GB's/8 https://drive.google.com/file/d/1g_fWCQXtvGN2uN4wWzi2uOtVjrbcm-SQ/view?usp=sharing

2)I tried to OC this RAM to 1600.It passed AIDA 30 min stress test only at 1.65V but later in some games I had game crashes because of RAM OC, this might be also because I have 3 PATRIOT sticks and 1 GoodRAM stick, they have simillar frequency, but different timings:
1x2GB GoodRAM GR1333D364L9/2G, Timings: 9-9-9-24
3x2GB Patriot Memory PSD36G1333K, Timings: 9-9-9-28

[CarlBar]

3 hours ago, AngryBeaver said:

Also I will add this here.

 

So 1333 vs 2400 was less than 1 fps most of the time. 800mhz was 5fps less in one test... so in the end there is negligible difference.

 

 

hat video, like LTT's other video on it is so ancient it's effectively usless. Standards have changed and until we get some RTX games to benchmark it's going to be the next best thing to impossible to say where the real line will be 6-9 months from now.

[AngryBeaver]

3 hours ago, CarlBar said:

 

hat video, like LTT's other video on it is so ancient it's effectively usless. Standards have changed and until we get some RTX games to benchmark it's going to be the next best thing to impossible to say where the real line will be 6-9 months from now.

Honestly, I don't see it being any different on intel systems unless they have a massive architecture change. Now on Ryzen it DOES matter, but that is because the interconnect system is very reliant on it.

 

Ram has never been a huge performance increase for real life usage... it was only really good for boosting your benchmark numbers.

[CarlBar]

7 hours ago, AngryBeaver said:

Honestly, I don't see it being any different on intel systems unless they have a massive architecture change. Now on Ryzen it DOES matter, but that is because the interconnect system is very reliant on it.

 

Ram has never been a huge performance increase for real life usage... it was only really good for boosting your benchmark numbers.

 

People have done slightly newer videos than the LTT one where they used slower than 2,66 ram, there was a definite drop-off on 8th gen processors. I'd expect 9th gen to face it even worse.

[AngryBeaver]

3 hours ago, CarlBar said:

 

People have done slightly newer videos than the LTT one where they used slower than 2,66 ram, there was a definite drop-off on 8th gen processors. I'd expect 9th gen to face it even worse.

Care to share these videos? If you are going to make a contradictory statement then at least post the proof.

 

Actually I just decided to look them up. First off these are DDR4 modules and OP is concerned about the speed of his DDR 3 and on chip where these videos are irrelevant.

 

Now that being said you are correct that on the 6+ core chips there does seem to be a slight advantage to faster ram. I am seeing between 5 and 10% difference going from 2133 to 3200. The biggest thing I noticed was that it did a good job in helping lowest fps numbers meaning you didn't see as big of a dip in performance for fps drops. Either way even at 10% performance it isn't a deal breaker. If I am running 120fps at 1080p with 3200, then dropping to 2133 and seeing 108 fps isn't going to kill my experience or make gaming impossible. So while it does have an actual performance advantage now with higher core counts and DDR4 ram... it still isn't going to be the most important or even one of the more important items for gaming or having good FPS numbers.

[CarlBar]

1 hour ago, AngryBeaver said:

Care to share these videos? If you are going to make a contradictory statement then at least post the proof.

 

Actually I just decided to look them up. First off these are DDR4 modules and OP is concerned about the speed of his DDR 3 and on chip where these videos are irrelevant.

 

Now that being said you are correct that on the 6+ core chips there does seem to be a slight advantage to faster ram. I am seeing between 5 and 10% difference going from 2133 to 3200. The biggest thing I noticed was that it did a good job in helping lowest fps numbers meaning you didn't see as big of a dip in performance for fps drops. Either way even at 10% performance it isn't a deal breaker. If I am running 120fps at 1080p with 3200, then dropping to 2133 and seeing 108 fps isn't going to kill my experience or make gaming impossible. So while it does have an actual performance advantage now with higher core counts and DDR4 ram... it still isn't going to be the most important or even one of the more important items for gaming or having good FPS numbers.

 

I posted my reply just after waking up and just before going out for the day,. just got back in, (and need a bath), but let me dig through my chrome history.

[Mick Naughty]

The amount would concern me more over the speed. You play any other games? That cpu keeping up with that card?

[TuRB0DN]

This video proves RAM bottleneck at low res systems

 

[CarlBar]

1 hour ago, TuRB0DN said:

This video proves RAM bottleneck at low res systems

 

 

Thanks for digging that up, it's a pretty severe underclock, but it shows there is an effect, and he wasn't exactly running flat out there, (there are newer games out now even if many of those are still used for benchmarking).

 

I think the interesting part was his CPU never really tapped out on him, which implies it's the GPU which is chocking on a lack of data intake.

[TuRB0DN]

2 hours ago, CarlBar said:

 

Thanks for digging that up, it's a pretty severe underclock, but it shows there is an effect, and he wasn't exactly running flat out there, (there are newer games out now even if many of those are still used for benchmarking).

 

I think the interesting part was his CPU never really tapped out on him, which implies it's the GPU which is chocking on a lack of data intake.

In this video we can see that performance varies depending on cpu generation and game, but difference between oc'ed 4770k and new gen. cpu's like 8700k not worth money spent to upgrade ram+cpu+mb.
I see a clear gpu bottleneck at this screenshot, not sure if 1070ti can step over this bottleneck. My opinion is next: I see no sense at playing around new gen cpu socket with 1070/1070ti. If you have other points of view reply me please.

And this video show that there is not much performance difference between stock old gen. cpu vs oc'ed (10-15fps gain).

[Mick Naughty]

I’d just wait to see how the system reacts to the games. 

My 4790k and 4770k have issues, I’m sure my 3770k would be in the same boat as it had plenty of problems with recent games. 

 

If it effects gameplay, it’s an issue. Regardless if people will call it a bottleneck or not. 

[AngryBeaver]

2 hours ago, TuRB0DN said:

In this video we can see that performance varies depending on cpu generation and game, but difference between oc'ed 4770k and new gen. cpu's like 8700k not worth money spent to upgrade ram+cpu+mb.
I see a clear gpu bottleneck at this screenshot, not sure if 1070ti can step over this bottleneck. My opinion is next: I see no sense at playing around new gen cpu socket with 1070/1070ti. If you have other points of view reply me please.

And this video show that there is not much performance difference between stock old gen. cpu vs oc'ed (10-15fps gain).

It would help if those graphs showed us the clock they were using for the OC. A 8700k is going to have a higher OC than a 4770k for sure. So that is going to reduce the fps in the comparison, second it there have been a few IPC improvements in that time which would probably account for another 8-12% increase. Then there is the added cores which will help a lot in games that are highly multi-threaded. This SS is from BF which DOES take advantage of those cores and is very CPU hungry. If you were wanting to show a more accurate comparison of generation power gaps then you should have used an 7700k or an 8350k.

 

Ok found what I wanted to know. The 4770k was at 4.8ghz with the OC and the 6 core 8700k was at 5.2k. If you look at the OTHER benchmarks though where they aren't as multithreaded for more than 4 cores... you will see the fps difference is less than a few percent. One I think it was 96fps vs 93 fps. So that isn't a huge concern.

 

I am by no means saying that there isn't an advantage to a newer cpu or that they aren't faster etc. I am saying that there is no reason for him to upgrade currently when his overclocked 3770k will do a good job for what he has.

[TuRB0DN]

20 minutes ago, AngryBeaver said:

It would help if those graphs showed us the clock they were using for the OC. A 8700k is going to have a higher OC than a 4770k for sure. So that is going to reduce the fps in the comparison, second it there have been a few IPC improvements in that time which would probably account for another 8-12% increase. Then there is the added cores which will help a lot in games that are highly multi-threaded. This SS is from BF which DOES take advantage of those cores and is very CPU hungry. If you were wanting to show a more accurate comparison of generation power gaps then you should have used an 7700k or an 8350k.

 

Ok found what I wanted to know. The 4770k was at 4.8ghz with the OC and the 6 core 8700k was at 5.2k. If you look at the OTHER benchmarks though where they aren't as multithreaded for more than 4 cores... you will see the fps difference is less than a few percent. One I think it was 96fps vs 93 fps. So that isn't a huge concern.

 

I am by no means saying that there isn't an advantage to a newer cpu or that they aren't faster etc. I am saying that there is no reason for him to upgrade currently when his overclocked 3770k will do a good job for what he has.

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2017-intel-kaby-lake-core-i7-7700k-review

3770k vs 7700k, 10-30 fps more, imo. worth only when building totally new pc.

[AngryBeaver]

Yay a forum error stole my huge post I just put 10-15 minutes into digging up videos and right explanations for... wonderful.

[TuRB0DN]

9 minutes ago, AngryBeaver said:

Yay a forum error stole my huge post I just put 10-15 minutes into digging up videos and right explanations for... wonderful.

Well, can you explain it in a few words?

[AngryBeaver]

19 minutes ago, TuRB0DN said:

Well, can you explain it in a few words?

I have 2 videos that were showing the difference between slow and fast ram in a good slue of games. For the most part it wasn't making much of a difference in most of the games, but a rare few did see a decent bump in performance.

 

I was basically wrapping it up saying the following conclusions.

 

If you already own a machine with slow ram, then the benefit of upgrading isn't really worth it. You might get gains that are minimal or even 20ish fps in some games, but unless you are having fps issues where your game experience is affected then there isn't a real need.

 

If you are using slow ram on Ryzen, then the benefit is worth it pretty much across the board in most cases. So in that scenario if you have the money to spend on it then it wouldn't be a bad thing to upgrade to faster ram (3000+).

 

If you are building a new system then it is basically a no brainer. Going from say 2400 to 3000 ram is only a few dollars right now with current market prices. So there is little to no reason to not go with faster ram in that scenario.