Quiet Supermicro compatible PWM fans?

[rYzYr]

I have a Supermicro X11SSH-LN4F housed in a Fractal Design Define Mini C. The cases comes with two Dynamic X2 G-12 3-pin fans. I removed the front fan. I’d now like to replace the rear fan with a compatible PWM fan but I’m concerned the FAN-0124L4 may be too loud Are there other more quiet 120mm options?

[Jurrunio]

Corsair ML120s are quiet (even at max speed it's bearly audible), but expensive

[rYzYr]

3 hours ago, Jurrunio said:

Corsair ML120s are quiet (even at max speed it's bearly audible), but expensive

I believe the 400 RPM minimum will cause errors with Supermicro (seems to require at least 500 RPM).

[Jurrunio]

1 minute ago, rYzYr said:

I believe the 400 RPM minimum will cause errors with Supermicro (seems to require at least 500 RPM).

why? RPM is none of the motherboard's business, your mobo only controls based on PWM duty cycle.

[WoodenMarker]

8 hours ago, Jurrunio said:

why? RPM is none of the motherboard's business, your mobo only controls based on PWM duty cycle.

It's a safety feature that spits out errors if rpm is too low which may indicate a failing fan. 

 

@rYzYr Why not stick with the stock case fans?

[rYzYr]

5 hours ago, WoodenMarker said:

It's a safety feature that spits out errors if rpm is too low which may indicate a failing fan. 

 

@rYzYr Why not stick with the stock case fans?

The stock case fans from Fractal Design (Dynamic X2 GP-12 PWM) have 3-pin connectors and the Supermicro boards have 4-pin PWM headers. While I could stick with the stock fan, I'm hoping a PWM fan would run at less than 1200 RPM at full load, the max for the stock fan. It's unclear whether I can set a lower fixed RPM with the Supermicro firmware, so I should also look into that.

[WoodenMarker]

4 minutes ago, rYzYr said:

The stock case fans from Fractal Design (Dynamic X2 GP-12 PWM) have 3-pin connectors and the Supermicro boards have 4-pin PWM headers. While I could stick with the stock fan, I'm hoping a PWM fan would run at less than 1200 RPM at full load, the max for the stock fan. 

Have you tried running it at max rpm and seeing how it sounds? It's a pretty quiet fan and you might not need to lower the rpm.

[rYzYr]

28 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

Have you tried running it at max rpm and seeing how it sounds? It's a pretty quiet fan and you might not need to lower the rpm.

Yes. I was able to remove the front fan with no noticeable increase in temps. I'm currently using the stock Intel cooler that comes with the E3 v6 CPUs. The stock case fan is decent (after removing the second fan), but I would prefer a quieter option. I'm also looking at passively cooling the CPU. In fact, I was able to passively cool a E3-1270v6 with the stock cooler heat sink (sans fan) for light use (temps around 70). I suspect switching to a tower heatsink will make running at full load with the single case fan a possibility.

[WoodenMarker]

Where are you shopping / located?

[rYzYr]

8 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

Where are you shopping / located?

Seattle, WA

[WoodenMarker]

6 minutes ago, rYzYr said:

Seattle, WA

Either would be good.

PW2: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/M6vZxr/be-quiet-pure-wings-2-120-870-cfm-120mm-fan-bl039

NF-P12: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/VNBTwP/noctua-nf-p12-redux-1700-pwm-708-cfm-120mm-fan-nf-p12-redux-1700-pwm

[rYzYr]

5 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

Either would be good.

PW2: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/M6vZxr/be-quiet-pure-wings-2-120-870-cfm-120mm-fan-bl039

NF-P12: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/VNBTwP/noctua-nf-p12-redux-1700-pwm-708-cfm-120mm-fan-nf-p12-redux-1700-pwm

Thank you for the suggestions. The NF-P12 has a 3-pin connector, but would be interesting with the low noise adapter--bringing the RPM down to 900. be quiet! hasn't published the low end RPM (https://www.bequiet.com/en/casefans/449), so it's not clear if it exceeds the 500 RPM alarm level.

[WoodenMarker]

1 hour ago, rYzYr said:

Thank you for the suggestions. The NF-P12 has a 3-pin connector, but would be interesting with the low noise adapter--bringing the RPM down to 900. be quiet! hasn't published the low end RPM (https://www.bequiet.com/en/casefans/449), so it's not clear if it exceeds the 500 RPM alarm level.

The NF-P12 comes in both 3 and 4pin variants. I linked the 4pin pwm version.

The rpm range is listed for both fans on PCPartPicker. The 500rpm alarm should only be triggered if the fan goes that low. I don't think that's normally a problem. 

[rYzYr]

1 hour ago, WoodenMarker said:

The NF-P12 comes in both 3 and 4pin variants. I linked the 4pin pwm version.

The rpm range is listed for both fans on PCPartPicker. The 500rpm alarm should only be triggered if the fan goes that low. I don't think that's normally a problem. 

The provided links are to a third party website and not to the manufacturer.

 

NF-P12 PWM has a minimum of 300 RPM. I’ve witnessed the RPM bounce that is typical of Noctua fans with Supermicro due to the low RPM.

https://noctua.at/en/nf-p12-pwm/specification

 

I did some digging and here’s what I’ve found:

 

Nanoxia Deep Silence 120mm PWM

650 - 1500 RPM, 16.9 dB at max

67.3 CFM

durability: 80,000 hours

http://nanoxia-world.com/en/products/fans/deep-silence-pwm/247/deep-silence-120-mm-pwm?c=52

 

Nanoxia Deep Silence 140mm PWM

700 - 1400 RPM, 16.2 dB at max

76.5 CFM

durability: 80,000 hours

http://nanoxia-world.com/en/products/fans/deep-silence-pwm/248/deep-silence-140-mm-pwm?c=50

 

Both cost around half the Supermicro FAN-0124L4, have higher CFM ratings, and provide superior acoustics. Supermicro doesn’t specify the durability.

 

[WoodenMarker]

1 hour ago, rYzYr said:

The provided links are to a third party website and not to the manufacturer.

NF-P12 PWM has a minimum of 300 RPM. I’ve witnessed the RPM bounce that is typical of Noctua fans with Supermicro due to the low RPM.

https://noctua.at/en/nf-p12-pwm/specification

 

I did some digging and here’s what I’ve found:

-snip-

Both cost around half the Supermicro FAN-0124L4, have higher CFM ratings, and provide superior acoustics. Supermicro doesn’t specify the durability.

You linked the 1300rpm model and not 1700rpm. The same specifications are listed on the manufacturer's website. https://noctua.at/en/nf-p12-redux-1700-pwm/specification

 

There's little to no regulation on how fan specs are measured so they can't be reliably compared between different manufacturers. Look at benchmarks and in-depth reviews instead that use the same testing methodology.

CFM isn't everything. Static pressure is also important and there's tonality that can stick out besides straight dBA readings. 

Although not the most scientific way to measure acoustics, the Nanoxia DS 120mm at 5v / 1020rpm / 66.24 1 m3/h and the NF-P12 at 9v / 990rpm / 73.44m3/h are both described as silent before exhibiting 'slight noise from air passing through the fan.' This is with the 1300rpm and not 1700rpm NF-P12.

http://www.dvtests.com/nanoxia-deep-silence-120-mm-1-800-umin-test-and-review/

http://www.dvtests.com/ревю-на-noctua-nf-p12-pwm/

 

I don't have personal experience with Nanoxia fans but they don't seem quiet from reviews I've read, posts from other users online, and youtube clips. 

Although it's not my favorite testing methodology, they're pretty low on list for efficiency. https://us.hardware.info/reviews/5770/7/103-12cm-case-fans-review-test-results-highest-efficiency

They don't make the list at all for pure temps or noise.

From what I gather, they perform fine but are far from the quietest.

 

The Supermicro fan is from San Ace. Very similar to this: https://www.sanyodenki.com/archive/document/product/cooling/catalog_E_pdf/San_Ace_120S25_E.pdf

Expected life is 40,000 hours at 60c.

[rYzYr]

1 hour ago, WoodenMarker said:

You linked the 1300rpm model and not 1700rpm. The same specifications are listed on the manufacturer's website. https://noctua.at/en/nf-p12-redux-1700-pwm/specification

 

There's little to no regulation on how fan specs are measured so they can't be reliably compared between different manufacturers. Look at benchmarks and in-depth reviews instead that use the same testing methodology.

CFM isn't everything. Static pressure is also important and there's tonality that can stick out besides straight dBA readings. 

Although not the most scientific way to measure acoustics, the Nanoxia DS 120mm at 5v / 1020rpm / 66.24 1 m3/h and the NF-P12 at 9v / 990rpm / 73.44m3/h are both described as silent before exhibiting 'slight noise from air passing through the fan.' This is with the 1300rpm and not 1700rpm NF-P12.

http://www.dvtests.com/nanoxia-deep-silence-120-mm-1-800-umin-test-and-review/

http://www.dvtests.com/ревю-на-noctua-nf-p12-pwm/

 

I don't have personal experience with Nanoxia fans but they don't seem quiet from reviews I've read, posts from other users online, and youtube clips. 

Although it's not my favorite testing methodology, they're pretty low on list for efficiency. https://us.hardware.info/reviews/5770/7/103-12cm-case-fans-review-test-results-highest-efficiency

They don't make the list at all for pure temps or noise.

From what I gather, they perform fine but are far from the quietest.

 

The Supermicro fan is from San Ace. Very similar to this: https://www.sanyodenki.com/archive/document/product/cooling/catalog_E_pdf/San_Ace_120S25_E.pdf

Expected life is 40,000 hours at 60c.

The NF-P12 1700 RPM has a minimum of 450 RPM according to the link provided, so it's still too low. Remember, even if the fan has a stated minimum of 550, there's a margin of error typically around 10%, so a realistic minimum that won't cause alarms is more like 600 RPM.

Thanks for all the comparative information. I'll spend some time and read through it. It would be nice to see a comparison filtered on the minimum RPM being 600+ as most (all?) of the highly rated fans will not be compatible with Supermicro motherboards. The question isn't whether the Nanoxia's are among the best, it's whether they are quieter than the Fractal Design Dynamic X2 GP-12 or Supermicro FAN-0124L4. Regardless, my testing is showing the CPU cooler fan to be the bigger problem. And, even if you could eliminate a CPU fan, my PSU (Seasonic S12II 620W - https://seasonic.com/s12ii) is arguably noisier than the GP-12. The question then becomes fixed RPM versus the potential energy savings of a PWM. At a cost of around $1.28/yr (https://www.maximintegrated.com/en/design/tools/calculators/general-engineering/energy-cost.cfm), spending $20 - $30 on a PWM fan is not a financially good decision. Whether an aftermarket CPU cooler like the Cryorig M9i (min RPM of 600 +/- 10%) is less noisy than the stock cooler and worth the expense is the question that really needs to be answered. Have you guys done any comparisons of aftermarket coolers to the stock coolers from Intel and AMD?

[WoodenMarker]

24 minutes ago, rYzYr said:

The NF-P12 1700 RPM has a minimum of 450 RPM according to the link provided, so it's still too low. Remember, even if the fan has a stated minimum of 550, there's a margin of error typically around 10%, so a realistic minimum that won't cause alarms is more like 600 RPM.

Thanks for all the comparative information. I'll spend some time and read through it. It would be nice to see a comparison filtered on the minimum RPM being 600+ as most (all?) of the highly rated fans will not be compatible with Supermicro motherboards. The question isn't whether the Nanoxia's are among the best, it's whether they are quieter than the Fractal Design Dynamic X2 GP-12 or Supermicro FAN-0124L4. Regardless, my testing is showing the CPU cooler fan to be the bigger problem. And, even if you could eliminate a CPU fan, my PSU (Seasonic S12II 620W - https://seasonic.com/s12ii) is arguably noisier than the GP-12. The question then becomes fixed RPM versus the potential energy savings of a PWM. At a cost of around $1.28/yr (https://www.maximintegrated.com/en/design/tools/calculators/general-engineering/energy-cost.cfm), spending $20 - $30 on a PWM fan is not a financially strong choice. Whether an aftermarket CPU cooler like the Cryorig M9i (min RPM of 600 +/- 10%) is less noisy than the stock cooler and worth the expense is the question that really needs to be answered. Have you guys done any comparisons of aftermarket coolers to the stock coolers from Intel and AMD?

I doubt the Nanoxia's are quieter than the included GP-12 X2's. Another option is to use a resistor. 

If you're aiming to lower noise, it's probably best to start with identifying what's too noisy instead of replacing fans outright. 

The M9i is definitely quieter than the stock cooler but there are quieter options still like the PR Slim: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/hyQRsY/be-quiet-pure-rock-slim-351-cfm-cpu-cooler-bk008

 

If you want relative performance, here's a tier list:

 

Does the minimum fan rpm error prevent the system from posting?

[rYzYr]

2 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

I doubt the Nanoxia's are quieter than the included GP-12 X2's. Another option is to use a resistor. 

If you're aiming to lower noise, it's probably best to start with identifying what's too noisy instead of replacing fans outright. 

The M9i is definitely quieter than the stock cooler but there are quieter options still like the PR Slim: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/hyQRsY/be-quiet-pure-rock-slim-351-cfm-cpu-cooler-bk008

 

If you want relative performance, here's a tier list:

 

Does the minimum fan rpm error prevent the system from posting?

The minimum RPM alarm causes the fan to ramp to 100%. It will then lower as the temperature is measured and eventually go too low once more. It cycles the fan RPM. See this note from Noctua on fan issues with Supermicro: https://noctua.at/en/im-experiencing-fan-speed-issues-with-my-motherboard-from-supermicro-what-can-i-do. The error does not prevent the system from posting or otherwise functioning, but it adds noise to an error log that could mask real fan issues.

[WoodenMarker]

4 minutes ago, rYzYr said:

The minimum RPM alarm causes the fan to ramp to 100%. It will then lower as the temperature is measured and eventually go too low once more. It cycles the fan RPM. See this note from Noctua on fan issues with Supermicro: https://noctua.at/en/im-experiencing-fan-speed-issues-with-my-motherboard-from-supermicro-what-can-i-do. The error does not prevent the system from posting or otherwise functioning, but it adds noise to an error log that could mask real fan issues.

Most good fans ramp down to low rpm to be quiet.

If you want something quiet that isn't costly, it'd probably make more sense to use resistors and run a static rpm or get lower rpm fans and run them at 100% rpm. If temps are fine, a static rpm is pretty low hassle.

 

Slipstream: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/qcTrxr/scythe-case-fan-sy1225db12l

NF-P12: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/8VL48d/noctua-nf-p12-redux-900-373-cfm-120mm-fan-nf-p12-redux-900

TrueQuiet: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/zzQypg/antec-case-fan-truequiet120

[rYzYr]

2 hours ago, WoodenMarker said:

Most good fans ramp down to low rpm to be quiet.

If you want something quiet that isn't costly, it'd probably make more sense to use resistors and run a static rpm or get lower rpm fans and run them at 100% rpm. If temps are fine, a static rpm is pretty low hassle.

 

Slipstream: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/qcTrxr/scythe-case-fan-sy1225db12l

NF-P12: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/8VL48d/noctua-nf-p12-redux-900-373-cfm-120mm-fan-nf-p12-redux-900

TrueQuiet: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/zzQypg/antec-case-fan-truequiet120

Based on my testing, I'm going to stick with the GP-12. As for the CPU cooler, I wasn't able to find the low end RPM for the be quiet! Pure Rock Slim. The Intel E97378-003 runs at 2300 RPM at 100% CPU. I tested the Noctua NH-U12S and it wanted to stay at the minimum of 300 RPM, so I assume whatever tower cooler I might use would operate at the low end at 100% CPU. A switch to something with a 600 RPM minimum could net a 50% reduction in noise. Based on that, I could come out way ahead with something like the Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo (http://www.coolermaster.com/cooling/cpu-air-cooler/hyper-212-evo/).

[WoodenMarker]

6 minutes ago, rYzYr said:

Based on my testing, I'm going to stick with the GP-12. As for the CPU cooler, I wasn't able to find the low end RPM for the be quiet! Pure Rock Slim. The Intel E97378-003 runs at 2300 RPM at 100% CPU. I tested the Noctua NH-U12S and it wanted to stay at the minimum of 300 RPM, so I assume whatever tower cooler I might use would operate at the low end at 100% CPU. A switch to something with a 600 RPM minimum could net a 50% reduction in noise.

The fan on the PR Slim goes down to 500rpm. If that's cutting it too close, you could go with a Freezer 13 which has a minimum 600rpm. 

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/99DwrH/arctic-cooling-cpu-cooler-acfz13

There's also a CO version with a better and more durable fan. https://pcpartpicker.com/product/khQypg/arctic-cooling-cpu-cooler-ucacofz13100bl

[rYzYr]

I tested the Cryorig M9i and Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo. Unfortunately, the Cryorig M9i caused low RPM errors with an RPM of less than or equal to 500. While a sensor or some part of the motherboard may be at fault, this result contradicts the specified range of 600 - 2200 RPM +/- 10%. The Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo performed significantly better with an initial reading of 600 RPM, a top end of 1000 RPM, and a max CPU temperature of 61 degrees C when stressed using the following test command:

 

sudo stress --cpu 8 --timeout 100000

 

The Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo at 100% CPU utilization is quieter than the stock cooler at idle (980 RPM).

 

FWIW, here’s a review of the M9i that compares it to many other popular coolers:

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/CRYORIG/M9i/