Fresh out of ideas... 8700k Help

[shwamper]

Hey guys, I’m fresh out of ideas as to why I’m unable to reach a higher overclock on my 8700K. I continually hear the 8700k should easily be able to hit 5.0GHz, but I haven’t had much success. So I’m wondering if you guys have any suggestions of either products to improve cooling or Bios setting suggestions to ultimately improve my overclock. 
(Sorry in advanced for how long this is going to be)

Build Information: PC Photos

• CPU: Intel - Core i7-8700K (Delidded w/ conductonaut liquid metal)
• CPU Cooler: CRYORIG - R1 Ultimate
• Thermal Compound: Cryorig CP 7
• Motherboard: Asus - ROG STRIX Z370-E
• Memory: Corsair - Vengeance LPX 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3200
• Video Card: EVGA - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB SC2 Video Card
• Case: Fractal Design - Define C TG ATX Mid Tower Case
• Power Supply: SeaSonic - FOCUS Plus Gold 850W 80+ Gold
• Case Fan: Fractal Design - X2 GP-12 120mm Fan (x3 front intake x1 rear exhaust)
• Case Fan: Fractal Design - X2 GP-14 140mm Fan (x2 top exhaust)
• Other: Phanteks PH-PWHUB_01 PWM Fan Hub
• Storage: Corsair - Force Series GS 240GB 2.5" Solid State Drive
• Storage: Samsung - 840 EVO 500GB 2.5" Solid State Drive
• Storage: Samsung - 960 EVO 500GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive
• Storage: Western Digital - Caviar Black 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive

BIOS Settings:

• BIOS Version: (0615)
• XMP: (ON)
• Asus MultiCore: (OFF)
• AVX Offset: (2)
• CPU Core Ratio: (Sync All Cores)
• Core Ratio: (48)
• LLC: (lvl 6)
• SpeedStep: (Enabled)
• Turbo: (Enabled)
• Long Duration PPL: (4095)
• Package Power Time Window: (127)
• Short Duration PPL: (4095)
• CPU Core/Cache Current Limit Max: (255.50)
• Min CPU Cache Ratio: (45)
• Max CPU Cache Ratio: (45)
• BCLK Adaptive Voltage: (Disabled)
• CPU Core/Cache Voltage: (1.340)
• C-states: (Auto)
• Speed Shift: (Enabled)

Temperatures: Temp Photo

Idle:
-40C across all cores

Load: (After running Prime95 w/o AVX for 1 hour)
-Max 89C on the hottest core
-Average 79.3C on the hottest core

Other Thoughts:

• My CPU is delidded with thermal grizzly liquid metal and I have left the IHS unsealed.
• When I try to push to 4.9GHz I end up having to go up to around 1.42V on the core voltage and the temps get to 90C pretty quick. Anything less and I get watchdog BSOD.
• Could an aftermarket IHS help? (In terms of surface area and lack of concavity such as in the stock IHS?
• I feel like after all the work I’ve put in I’m reaching some kind of wall at around 1.35V (If I set it at 1.40 it likes to sit around 1.35V still). Could this be a c-state/power bios setting issue?
• I have looked at simple things like new fans/ thermal paste but what I have is either in-line with or ever so slightly worse than the top of the line stuff. Which leads me to believe spending $60-$100 is a dead end.

Did I just lose the silicon lottery or is there something I’m not seeing? Let me know guys, all help is very much appreciated.

[Skiiwee29]

sounds like Silicon Lottery if you hit a hard wall at 1.35v. 

[Enderman]

Do you mean 4.9 instead of 5.9?

[DarkEnergy]

18 minutes ago, shwamper said:

I feel like after all the work I’ve put in I’m reaching some kind of wall at around 1.35V (If I set it at 1.40 it likes to sit around 1.35V still). Could this be a c-state/power bios setting issue?

That's called voltage droop. I'm on an old AMD system so not sure if it's the same but look for a setting called "load line calibration." You'd have to set it higher than what it's default at. 

[shwamper]

18 minutes ago, Enderman said:

Do you mean 4.9 instead of 5.9?

Haha yeah my bad.

[shwamper]

9 minutes ago, DarkEnergy said:

That's called voltage droop. I'm on an old AMD system so not sure if it's the same but look for a setting called "load line calibration." You'd have to set it higher than what it's default at. 

Ya I have it set to Level 6. Level 7 is the max. One of the many reasons I am stumped.

[DarkEnergy]

Just now, shwamper said:

Ya I have it set to Level 6. Level 7 is the max. One of the many reasons I am stumped.

Hmm, yeah I wouldn't set it to the max. I'm surprised the voltage sits as low as it does considering. 

[DarkSmith2]

First of all, download the freaking new bios which states: 

"ROG STRIX Z370-E GAMING BIOS 0616
1. Improve OC performance
2. Improve system stability"

 

 

[shwamper]

9 minutes ago, DarkSmith2 said:

First of all, download the freaking new bios which states: 

 

 

Woah there. I installed it this evening. Still having the same issues.

[DarkSmith2]

4 minutes ago, shwamper said:

Woah there. I installed it this evening. Still having the same issues.

have you tried:

- to remove AVX offset

- to set CPU Current Capability: 140%

[shwamper]

1 minute ago, DarkSmith2 said:

have you tried:

- to remove AVX offset

- to set CPU Current Capability: 140%

-Yes I've tried removing AVX it just makes it more unstable in certain tasks.
-Where is CPU Current Capability in the bios?

[DarkSmith2]

5 minutes ago, shwamper said:

-Yes I've tried removing AVX it just makes it more unstable in certain tasks.
-Where is CPU Current Capability in the bios?

Should be same spot as your LLC, external digi+ power control.

[Carlyle2020]

Hi there,

 

if i read correctly you mention "watchdog BSOD" in regards of having to put more voltage to the System.

Linking the "watchdog BSOD" and CPU  voltage would be a "false dichotomy" if i remember correctly.

 

In short: Kindly unpdate your sata drivers to be able to differ between CPU-OC-BSOD and Software-BSOD

Check: " DPC_WATCHDOG_VIOLATION " in the interwebs.

 

Furthermore set follwing values until you have reached a stable overclock:

 

Min CPU Cache Ratio: (Auto)  / that one can stay on Auto longterm

Max CPU Cache Ratio: (42=standard)   / always 300 under CPU / i suggest max of 47 in the far away future, which suits a 5.0 CPU goal.

The "Faustregel", which would be "rule of thumb" i supoose, is that 1Ghrz of Cache OC is worth as much as 100Mhrz CPU OC.

So don't bother OC concerning cache until everythng else is sorted out, since it isn worth THAT much.

It smoothes out avg. framerates a bit so there is a little merrit, still.

 

Cache uses CPU vcore ! So u see why you would not want to OC both at teh same time.

Get the CPU stable and OC Cache afterwards and see what sticks whith no CPU vcore bump to get it higher.

 

In my case a 47 OC cache stress test with aida64 puts exactly + 0,050 volt on top of my CPU VID / 1,285 results in 1,335 

Cinebench does not.

 

XMP....MCE....:Do Help in a big way !

 

But really why bother using beefed up voltages that are calculated to work like a broad band antibiotik on every board in every type of climate?

Why not test what your personal Rig needs and in the process maybe lower temps?

 

So MCE off, Sync all cores, set to 50.

XMP manual:  Set ram to 3200 16/18/34  / Next month u can try 15/17/34-which they like but don't show much in tests

 

And now to VCCIO (1.10 -1.35)  Set around  1.2 for 16 Gig

and System Agent Voltage (1.10 -1.35).

 

XMP will mostly set those values already higher than stock i believe.

Those are to be dialled in manually without XMP i suggest. See what cinebench likes.

Especially VCCIO is generating heat.

Start with 1.2 for both and work your way down until your cinebench scores suffer (Or Up to stabilize).

In my personal case i could even set Agent a bit lower than CIO, which is not the normal way around.

Most give CIO a very small lead.

 

LLC: Use 4 longterm, never ever use 7 (which overshoots by a lot)

AVX: 3 until the system is rock stable. Then remove if possible.

 

adaptive voltage: is your firend, not foe !

Set 1.35 in additional Boost Clock. See if it stable and work your way down until cinebench stops working.

 

SVID : Best Scenario

Not really needed because of the SVID scenario, but still put 0.01 in both:

 

IA AV load line

IA DC load line

 

Memory preset: Choose mode 1 / maaaaybe mode 2 in later days

 

And now kindly test the heck out of it.

 

Rgds Carlyle

 

ps mine is 1678 long , cinebench wise, with a similar setup

 

 

[Belezeebub]

Is your CPU thermal Throtteling ? I would never try to push higher till I could get the Temp down, with a delid you should be in the high 60's low 70's not where you are.. maybe that cooler just can't do it ?

 

that plus the fact that Newegg has a warning about mounting that cooler on the sale page leads me to think it might not be set on your CPu correctly which would explain the temp.

 

on a side note for a few bucks more you could have gotten a AIO that would have better cooling IMHO

 

[shwamper]

On 5/27/2018 at 12:14 PM, Carlyle2020 said:

Hi there,

 

if i read correctly you mention "watchdog BSOD" in regards of having to put more voltage to the System.

Linking the "watchdog BSOD" and CPU  voltage would be a "false dichotomy" if i remember correctly.

 

In short: Kindly unpdate your sata drivers to be able to differ between CPU-OC-BSOD and Software-BSOD

Check: " DPC_WATCHDOG_VIOLATION " in the interwebs.

 

Furthermore set follwing values until you have reached a stable overclock:

 

Min CPU Cache Ratio: (Auto)  / that one can stay on Auto longterm

Max CPU Cache Ratio: (42=standard)   / always 300 under CPU / i suggest max of 47 in the far away future, which suits a 5.0 CPU goal.

The "Faustregel", which would be "rule of thumb" i supoose, is that 1Ghrz of Cache OC is worth as much as 100Mhrz CPU OC.

So don't bother OC concerning cache until everythng else is sorted out, since it isn worth THAT much.

It smoothes out avg. framerates a bit so there is a little merrit, still.

 

Cache uses CPU vcore ! So u see why you would not want to OC both at teh same time.

Get the CPU stable and OC Cache afterwards and see what sticks whith no CPU vcore bump to get it higher.

 

In my case a 47 OC cache stress test with aida64 puts exactly + 0,050 volt on top of my CPU VID / 1,285 results in 1,335 

Cinebench does not.

 

XMP....MCE....:Do Help in a big way !

 

But really why bother using beefed up voltages that are calculated to work like a broad band antibiotik on every board in every type of climate?

Why not test what your personal Rig needs and in the process maybe lower temps?

 

So MCE off, Sync all cores, set to 50.

XMP manual:  Set ram to 3200 16/18/34  / Next month u can try 15/17/34-which they like but don't show much in tests

 

And now to VCCIO (1.10 -1.35)  Set around  1.2 for 16 Gig

and System Agent Voltage (1.10 -1.35).

 

XMP will mostly set those values already higher than stock i believe.

Those are to be dialled in manually without XMP i suggest. See what cinebench likes.

Especially VCCIO is generating heat.

Start with 1.2 for both and work your way down until your cinebench scores suffer (Or Up to stabilize).

In my personal case i could even set Agent a bit lower than CIO, which is not the normal way around.

Most give CIO a very small lead.

 

LLC: Use 4 longterm, never ever use 7 (which overshoots by a lot)

AVX: 3 until the system is rock stable. Then remove if possible.

 

adaptive voltage: is your firend, not foe !

Set 1.35 in additional Boost Clock. See if it stable and work your way down until cinebench stops working.

 

SVID : Best Scenario

Not really needed because of the SVID scenario, but still put 0.01 in both:

 

IA AV load line

IA DC load line

 

Memory preset: Choose mode 1 / maaaaybe mode 2 in later days

 

And now kindly test the heck out of it.

 

Rgds Carlyle

 

ps mine is 1678 long , cinebench wise, with a similar setup

 

 

Thank you for this. Lots of great information. Gonna start testing now

[shwamper]

On 5/27/2018 at 12:32 PM, Belezeebub said:

Is your CPU thermal Throtteling ? I would never try to push higher till I could get the Temp down, with a delid you should be in the high 60's low 70's not where you are.. maybe that cooler just can't do it ?

 

that plus the fact that Newegg has a warning about mounting that cooler on the sale page leads me to think it might not be set on your CPu correctly which would explain the temp.

 

on a side note for a few bucks more you could have gotten a AIO that would have better cooling IMHO

 

Not a water-cooling guy. Don't want to deal with any possible leaks, buildup in the cpu block, etc. And as someone who considers himself fairly handy alternating screws is something I live by. On another note, thats my main goal of this post; to lower temps with the intent on reaching a higher overclock.