Beginner need some help for lights setup

[Slyou333]

Hello everybody , my name is Fabien. Im a total beginner in videography and i need some tips thanks in advance for helping me out.

Here is the thing , im looking to shoot videos with people sitting on chair with table in front of them , and a close background. To show you what i would like to do i guess its more easy with exemples.

 

Take a look at this video from buzzfeed :

 

So basically this is what i need to achieve  , close up , people sitting ,table  close background.

To do that i have a Canon 70D with a rode mike , i think its ok to start for video/sound . Now my big problem is the lights. I just bought one LED light

https://www.amazon.com/YONGNUO-YN900-3200k-5500k-Adjustable-Temperatur/dp/B00OMO6680

I know one light isnt enough but i wanted to try it out anyway to see the quality of this LED because it was one of the only available where i live.

Now the problems i have :

- first , when i use this light as key light ( i only have one anyway lol ) , even i put the diffuser plate , and even i put it at the lowest intensity , its very hard on the eyes... I guess you get used to it after a while but when you just seat on the chair its kind of shocking. I really dont know with 2 more lights how this will turn out

- What i manage to achieve only with this led as a key light is not great at all. I have HUGE shadows on the backwall ; ( painted like a white/beige ) so i know it gonna hapens with one light only and a led pannel but does buying a second and third  led panel gonna help me out that much with the shadows ? I dont like so far at all the look i have even my background isnt set yet. ( i just have the plain wall , could be ok but color is terrible ).

 

It doesnt look professional at all

 

So my questions is for the type i video i wanna shoot ; should i buy other light kit ? likes soft box ?

 

 

I have this available but i really dont know much what im doing

 

 Please help me out and tell me how to achieve the lights in the video above.  like a daylight video and i would like the people in front of camera not to be like a deer in the headlights.

 

I found this video very interesting because at 4:15 he cuts the lights he is using to put only a Yongnuo 300 , then i get kind of this effect , very dense light and not nice at all . What i want is what he have before

Sorry the post was that long , thanks in advance for answers.

 

 

 

[jonsmith9847]

 

[ALwin]

12 minutes ago, Slyou333 said:

snip

Obviously you already know a single LED panel is NOT enough.

1. Harsh on the eyes?  Trust me, that bright light may appear bright to your eyes, but chances are it isn't bright enough for the camera.
2. Don't put lights too close to your subjects if they are uncomfortable with the brightness.  Place the lights a few meters away from your subjects.  This brings up point 3.
3. If you increase the distance between your subjects and lights, you need to increase either the brightness of that single light source or more appropriately add more lights.  The small studio at my office has eight of these kind of lights (see image below, though not that exact brand) mounted on rails on the ceiling and they are not always enough.
4. If you don't want harsh shadows in the background, the background also needs to be lit with a couple of lights.
5. You don't always need softboxes or diffusers.  Softboxes, diffusers, reflectors, etc. have their uses but it is not always necessary to use them.

 

[Slyou333]

thanks for your answer jonsmith , interesting video. However it doesnt help me much  except for the fact that going with led panels would be a good option. Doesnt really explain how to set up panel ,distance , diffuser , how many lights , i  looked some videos already about this so i get some ideas but i would like expert telling me what i really need to achieve what i want and if im not going the wrong way

[Slyou333]

4 minutes ago, ALwin said:

tips

 

Thanks ALwin for your answer. In my case my " studio is a quite small room , i would say 4*4 meters. I have curtains on the windows and from what i read i should close all of this the best i can to prevent light from outside at the maximum. Stupid question in this case , should i turn off the ceiling lights too when shooting and only using LED panels ? because i tried that with only the one panel  i have and it feels like you are outside in the dark with a train coming your way... not really the atmosphere im looking for my " actors " .

 

In my case do you think i could be ok with a 3 light panel LED setup to get what i want ?

 

Im was thinking it wasnt that hard to get like the buzzfeed video lights above with a small/mediumm budget but i maybe wrong, wasnt planing to buy 8 lights

 

 

[ALwin]

7 minutes ago, Slyou333 said:

snip

If you want to light your set evenly like in the first video you posted (Americans watch anime blah blah blah) you will need more than three light sources.

 

A three point lighting kit/setup is not really designed for even lighting.  They are used to create a strong contrast between your subject and the background.  To focus the viewer's attention on the subject and not the background, or make your subject pop.  An example of the style it creates is these images below:

 

Here a three point light setup can be used to create shadows on the subject's face that gives the image style depth.

 

 

 

 

While if you want to evenly light up the entire set and all the subjects, you need a lot more lights. 

 

E.g. these setups below:

 

[ALwin]

8 minutes ago, Slyou333 said:

i turn off the ceiling lights too when shooting and only using LED panels

You don't necessarily have to turn them off.  If you don't have enough LED panels, you can use your ceiling lights to brighten up the ambience so that things are more evenly lit and reduce harsh shadows cast by using your LED panels on your subjects.

 

Size of the room doesn't really matter, but depending on the type of lighting style you want to create, you more or less have to determine how many light sources you need.  The small studio we have in my office is probably just somewhat bigger than your room, perhaps 6x8 meters (I haven't really measured it).

[Slyou333]

Thanks Alwin , i understand that the more light the better it will be. Im surprised that i may need that much lights for what i want to do; gonna cost a fortune

 

even a video like this , This kind of lights would be enough for me

 

No way i can achieve that with a " beginner " light kit ?

 

sorry to make you look those kinds of vids lol

 

[ALwin]

13 minutes ago, Slyou333 said:

i understand that the more light the better it will be

You're misunderstanding what I am trying to say.  My point is, if you want to evenly light up your set you need to use more lights than just a single panel or three panels.  TV talk shows and sitcoms usually try to get an evenly lit look when filming.  I suggested getting more lights because that's the only way you can achieve the same kind of lighting setup as the first YouTube video you posted.

 

But if you want to create an artistic style, you can use Zero lights, one light, two, three, as many as you require to create the look and style you want.

 

This video shows an example of a set which is more or less evenly lit, with minimal shadows.  Look at their faces, whichever way they turn, it doesn't look like there are any shadows cast on their faces.

 

 

Here is a video where the set is light with fewer light sources to create artistic shadows and relationship between subject and background.  Here you can see shadows on the sides of their faces which are opposite the lights.

 

[Slyou333]

Thanks Alwin , i understand more , i thought since the area im filming at the end is probably 1*1.5 meters and the wall behind i could be ok with a small kit. Even the last video i put ? same deal ?

 

Sorry if i have stupid questions im a total noob...

[ALwin]

5 minutes ago, Slyou333 said:

Thanks Alwin , i understand more , i thought since the area im filming at the end is probably 1*1.5 meters and the wall behind i could be ok with a small kit. Even the last video i put ? same deal ?

 

Sorry if i have stupid questions im a total noob...

A small kit combined with the ceiling lights might be ok.  I can't say with any certainty because I'm not there in person to check things out.

[Omon_Ra]

1 minute ago, Slyou333 said:

Thanks Alwin , i understand more , i thought since the area im filming at the end is probably 1*1.5 meters and the wall behind i could be ok with a small kit. Even the last video i put ? same deal ?

 

Sorry if i have stupid questions im a total noob...

You need to understand how light works; after all the manipulation of light is exactly what video/cinema/photography is. With a single light source you're going to have shadows no matter what. You need multiple lights to fill in (hence terms like 'fill light') the shadows that are cast by the other lights. Before the explosion of cheap LED panels, I used (still do from time to time) those shop lights you can get at Home Depot, Lowes or any other big box store for ~$10 a light.

 

 

They definitely have their drawbacks: generally really short power cables so you need extension cords, they get insanely hot, so take care not to burn yourself and your subjects will be under a fair amount of heat. The cage protector things cast shadows, so you need to remove them; so again, be EXTRA careful. However, they put off a ton of light, pretty easily setup, and are cheap. When I was in college (2004-8) that's what was given to us if we needed lighting for our projects. You could even just get a bunch of cheap desk lamps and put all of the same color temp CFL in them.

[Slyou333]

Thanks Omon_Ra for answer , however my budget is not that small. I can go up to 1000$ or little more if necessary.  Only thing was that i wasnt happy with the result with only one light LED panel . I know its not enough at all to know what final results will be but i didnt want to go the wrong way for what i need to achieve .

 

One question i have is difference beetwen Led panel and softbox for the " actor " in a setup similar to what i want to do. I put myslef behind the table and the light is very hard on the eyes, not pleasant at all. I wonder if its the same thing for softbox ? i would like the people in front of camera to not feel like a deer in headlights.

 

 

[ShadowCaptain]

20 hours ago, Slyou333 said:

One question i have is difference beetwen Led panel and softbox for the " actor " in a setup similar to what i want to do. I put myslef behind the table and the light is very hard on the eyes, not pleasant at all. I wonder if its the same thing for softbox ? i would like the people in front of camera to not feel like a deer in headlights.

 

 

Softboxes are still bright

 

sadly, actors pretty much get blinded by lights - as do singers on stage, the lights are often so bright they cannot even SEE the audience when playing on stage

[ALwin]

9 hours ago, ShadowCaptain said:

Softboxes are still bright

 

sadly, actors pretty much get blinded by lights - as do singers on stage, the lights are often so bright they cannot even SEE the audience when playing on stage

There's not really any way to avoid that unless the filming is done outdoors in daylight where the sun provides a lot of brightness (when even then diffusers and reflectors should be used, if necessary, to reduce the harshness of sunlight).  What appears bright to our eyes does not necessarily mean it is bright enough for the camera.

 

In the small studio at my office when filming interviews, even with all nine Kino style lights turned on, and even with the aperture wide open I need to set the gain on the camera to +6db because the lights are not bright enough.

 

You can however reduce the strain bright lights have on the eyes of people who are in front of the camera by indirectly aiming the lights instead of putting it straight in front of their eyes.  Ceiling, side angles, and low angle light placement as long as the lights are not directly in front wherever they are looking.

[Evanair]

I've done 3 point lighting interviews with one light many times, never underestimate the power of bounce cards (aka white foam board)

 

There are many videos on lighting for photography using bounce lighting and defusing. Many, if not all, of the same techniques can be used for video with continuous lighting.

 

Before you invest in gear, look at the simple techniques rather than gear, it can and usually will, save you a ton of money and turn out just as good. 

 

Doesn't matter how *weird* it looks as long as the end product looks awesome.

[ALwin]

2 hours ago, Evanair said:

snip

It really depends on how the OP wants the set to be lit.  A three point system doesn't work if the OP wants to have the set evenly lit.

[Slyou333]

thanks all of you for your replies , im continuing my research and experimentation and going to the good direction i think i hope to be able to post a picture/video when my lighting setup is over so you can tell me what you think about it cheers