WAN show discussion - Teaching kids "normal" or non rich lifestyle.

[DeerDK]

@LinusTech

 

Hi Linus

Regarding your discussion about teaching one's kids what is normal lifestyle, I can really recommend letting them do a year aboard in the style where they live with one family the whole time (unless it's a bad match). I dunno how much you can vet the host family, but it's a really great way to expand one's horizon in many ways, in a way that is not just jetsetting around and doing filantropi tourism. 

(I know, it's still not exactly for the poor, but at least in Denmark there were a ton of through and through middle class people involved). 

Can recommend AFS

 

[8tg]

I think the major point he was trying to make was doing normal things with normal limitations is independent of the value of possessions.

Watching a movie on a TV that costs more than a car is still just watching a movie.

I swear theres some old proverb I can’t remember in detail about the prince making his own bed of silk sheets the same as a peasant made theirs of rough cut hemp sheets. 
 

In that sense I don’t think sending the kids off to experience middle class life is exactly equivalent, what’s effectively family tourism is not something attainable by the middle class.

[DeerDK]

7 minutes ago, 8tg said:

I think the major point he was trying to make was doing normal things with normal limitations is independent of the value of possessions.

Watching a movie on a TV that costs more than a car is still just watching a movie.

I swear theres some old proverb I can’t remember in detail about the prince making his own bed of silk sheets the same as a peasant made theirs of rough cut hemp sheets. 
 

In that sense I don’t think sending the kids off to experience middle class life is exactly equivalent, what’s effectively family tourism is not something attainable by the middle class.

True, it is however generally a great eye opener for how people are different and the same in different countries. 

My brother did a school year I France, I did a work year in Germany, and my family had a Japanese and Chinese exchange student for a year each. I'm still in contact with my Chinese sister. 

[venomtail]

2 hours ago, 8tg said:

In that sense I don’t think sending the kids off to experience middle class life is exactly equivalent, what’s effectively family tourism is not something attainable by the middle class.

Yea, the idea of rich people dipping their toes into "middle class" and "poor" lifestyles as something that can be a trip like going to a zoo has been a trends that's so out of touch and in no way will actually benefit them. Sure, there have been several TV programs where families swap places or simply wives but first we have to remember they're somewhat "aged" adults, fully self aware of the situation they're in, something a child won't comprehend and that it's still entertainment. Would that really work when behind the scenes a TV series has several hundred people working behind it?

 

3 hours ago, DeerDK said:

I can really recommend letting them do a year aboard in the style where they live with one family the whole time (unless it's a bad match). I dunno how much you can vet the host family, but it's a really great way to expand one's horizon in many ways, in a way that is not just jetsetting around and doing filantropi tourism

Sending away kids to some place isn't a magical band aids that's guaranteed to sort them out. It only works when already good, well behaved self aware people are sent away to these places. Just look at universities. The students who behave well and are able to keep their boundaries are the ones who will succeed and the ones who are just itching away to get from their parents to party every weekend will be the dropouts sooner or later. Not like this latter individual does a 180 in their behavior just because they're away from home.

 

I'm not rich myself nor do I have kids but from some (not all) rich families that I know and how their kids turn out, on the surface level I'd say a priority is to let it be known to them that the position of their familiy isn't the average. Important for parent to also let go of the pressure a bit as well, so many rich parents want their kids to be "perfect" so they never leave their kid alone to do kid things. Let them scrape their knees as they're trying to learn how to ride a bike or learn hobbies that might not be stereotypical rich family hobbies like girls being only being allowed to be interested in music or ballet and boys only having the options to learn Tennis or Golf or something...

[DeerDK]

1 hour ago, venomtail said:

...

Sending away kids to some place isn't a magical band aids that's guaranteed to sort them out. It only works when already good, well behaved self aware people are sent away to these places. Just look at universities. The students who behave well and are able to keep their boundaries are the ones who will succeed and the ones who are just itching away to get from their parents to party every weekend will be the dropouts sooner or later. Not like this latter individual does a 180 in their behavior just because they're away from home.

.....

Did I say it did? 

Its also not a matter of "sorting them out". Sounds like sending an ill-behaved brat to a bording school so the parents don't have to deal with them.

Its a suggesting if you want your kids to experince life in another way than what they have at home, learn to adapt to other cultures and generally to respect and be interested in people from other places. A great weapon against intolerance is experience and exposure.

[venomtail]

17 minutes ago, DeerDK said:

Did I say it did? 

Its also not a matter of "sorting them out". Sounds like sending an ill-behaved brat to a bording school so the parents don't have to deal with them.

Just saying too many people make the mistake of thinking sending kids away is a one trick solution to getting them sorted out because they themselves didn't do enough of a job teaching their child. That it not gonna do anything and is only a valuable experience to those kids who are already well behaved in the first place.

 

18 minutes ago, DeerDK said:

A great weapon against intolerance is experience and exposure.

Double edged sword. If the experience is bad enough they can become jaded thereafter and only confirm and have their beliefs engrained and rooted even deeper for the rest of their life.

[DeerDK]

22 minutes ago, venomtail said:

Just saying too many people make the mistake of thinking sending kids away is a one trick solution to getting them sorted out because they themselves didn't do enough of a job teaching their child. That it not gonna do anything and is only a valuable experience to those kids who are already well behaved in the first place.

 

Double edged sword. If the experience is bad enough they can become jaded thereafter and only confirm and have their beliefs engrained and rooted even deeper for the rest of their life.

You keep assuming i talk about making them more well behaved. That was never what this was about.

Did you watch WAN from last friday?

It was Linus and Yvonne musing about how to keep their kids from growing detached from normal issues in life due to growing up rich. Not about how to raise them.

 

Regarding the last point, I really don't see that being a common issue to be honest. Speaking from both first and secondhand experience.

That said, yes, the exchange student themselves need to be motivated for it to be a good thing.

 

But we are running out on a tangent.

[Erioch]

I thought the idea was very tone-deaf.  There are better ways than just going to live like the poors.

[DeerDK]

5 hours ago, Erioch said:

I thought the idea was very tone-deaf.  There are better ways than just going to live like the poors.

I don't disagree. That is one of the reasons im suggesting a more positive angle

[Erioch]

Shaquille O'Neal tells a story where he overhears his son telling his friends that he's rich.  Shaq goes over to him and says, "You're not rich, I am."

[LogicalDrm]

This has been discussed previously in:

 

As for your suggestion of studying abroad. Sure. But even his oldest is way too young for such. I haven't seen any under 16 year old exchange students. Maybe on the bigger towns. But first we had was when I was 17 year old. So matching US high school/college levels. Its really common in University level here. 

[DeerDK]

3 hours ago, LogicalDrm said:

This has been discussed previously in:

 

As for your suggestion of studying abroad. Sure. But even his oldest is way too young for such. I haven't seen any under 16 year old exchange students. Maybe on the bigger towns. But first we had was when I was 17 year old. So matching US high school/college levels. Its really common in University level here. 

My brother was 15 I think, but yes, that is the earliest common age. So, high school, college or university.

[Kisai]

On 1/15/2024 at 10:25 AM, LogicalDrm said:

This has been discussed previously in:

 

As for your suggestion of studying abroad. Sure. But even his oldest is way too young for such. I haven't seen any under 16 year old exchange students. Maybe on the bigger towns. But first we had was when I was 17 year old. So matching US high school/college levels. Its really common in University level here. 

Exchange students have usually finished high school in their home country. What they are experiencing on exchange is culture, so what "Grades" they get in the guest country is irrelevant cause no employer back in their home country is ever going to check that.

 

Hell, not a single employer in Canada will check your grades from high school either. They only care that you graduated. Only colleges/universities will check more thoroughly, but that' is because of government regulations that require them to admit only the top-of-the-class students first.

 

Ultimately though, if Linus wanted to teach his kids about "not everyone lives like us" the easiest way would be to go rent a trailer or an RV in a surrey/langley trailer park. But that would uproot his kids from where they go to school most likely. So that might be an entirely negative experience, and if I were in his kids shoes, would likely see this with contempt.

 

There are no easy answers, people with a certain level of wealth, will never experience what it's like to live on welfare, or what it's like to have barely enough income to afford rent and food. People who experience these, tend to have the smallest property, two kids to a bedroom on bunk beds, and only one television/computer with the cheapest tier of internet if they have it at all.

 

This is what "allowances" typically are for when kids are old enough to learn how to do house chores. You give them minimum-wage level money if they keep their room's clean, and additional money if they have good grades at school. You, the parent, do not buy them things outside of their birthday or Christmas. If they want to do activities outside school/home, they have to pay for them themselves. No new phones, computers, or other tech gadgets unless they've worked for them. Only one present from "Santa"

 

 

[djksm]

On 1/17/2024 at 1:35 AM, Kisai said:

Only one present from "Santa"

 

 

lol