LTT Backpack Fail

[dc0421]

I bought the LTT Backpack pretty close to when it first released… I had to warranty it due to a manufacturer error and the back wouldn’t stand straight up like advertised… I received my new (warranty) bag and it still folds over on top of itself. Also still no update on the carabiner replacement. LTT seems to have an issue with quality control and it’s very frustrating especially when you spend almost $300 on a backpack… 

[Dedayog]

2 minutes ago, dc0421 said:

I bought the LTT Backpack pretty close to when it first released… I had to warranty it due to a manufacturer error and the back wouldn’t stand straight up like advertised… I received my new (warranty) bag and it still folds over on top of itself. Also still no update on the carabiner replacement. LTT seems to have an issue with quality control and it’s very frustrating especially when you spend almost $300 on a backpack… 

Post those pics you took of this please.

[Middcore]

I thought they dropped touting "stands up straight" as a feature? 

[Razercake]

17 minutes ago, Middcore said:

I thought they dropped touting "stands up straight" as a feature? 

They did, now this might not have been properly communicated to OP when talking to support for a replacement. but that heavily depends on whether it was a recent replacement or not since it could've been before they removed it as an advertised feature. (I don't remember how long ago it was removed)

 

34 minutes ago, dc0421 said:

still no update on the carabiner replacement. LTT seems to have an issue with quality control

the most recent update was trouble with the manufacturer, so they are in the process of producing the replacements. don't think there is much more to do with speeding that up since it's on the manufacturer now to produce the amount ordered. which takes however long it takes sadly.

[dc0421]

Sorry for the lack of info, it was probably 6 months ago when I got the replacement. But the bag folds over worse and worse as time goes on. 
 

My thoughts on the issue is that if it was advertised as it stands up straight and doesn’t fall over, and then it doesn’t stand straight up… is that not false advertising? Shouldn’t LTT be required to refund the money or atleast send a “sorry we screwed up on that” type of thing?   It took about 10 days to get an initial response and the full replacement from initial contact to the time I received the bag took a little over a month. I could’ve dealt with the bag taking long to ship but communication for support shouldn’t take 10 days… 

[dc0421]

[dc0421]

1 hour ago, Dedayog said:

Post those pics you took of this please.

 

[Razercake]

1 hour ago, dc0421 said:

My thoughts on the issue is that if it was advertised as it stands up straight and doesn’t fall over, and then it doesn’t stand straight up… is that not false advertising? Shouldn’t LTT be required to refund the money or atleast send a “sorry we screwed up on that” type of thing?   It took about 10 days to get an initial response and the full replacement from initial contact to the time I received the bag took a little over a month. I could’ve dealt with the bag taking long to ship but communication for support shouldn’t take 10 days… 

Well sorta, I had a minor defect on mine & they offered to send me a completely new backpack or refund the money(I went with the refund). the backpack is still great & I pretty much got it for free. I would just reach out to support, and explain the problem with the lack of the advertised feature(if you weren't informed that this was no longer a feature) and I'd expect you to have either option. it isn't an advertised feature anymore, they refunded/replaced people who asked for it. not much more they can do after finding out that this was an issue. 

 

support taking 10 days, is long 100%. I had a response within ~5ish hours around the end of July, so I think you just happened to contact them during a busy time. not an excuse but I don't see any other reason as to why it would take 10 days to hear back.

[Adam Pilolla]

Hey OP,

 

Standing upright is no-longer an advertised feature of the backpack. You've received compensation for this in the form of another backpack, but should consider this a normal part of wear-and-tear from now on. For more information see this article from our help center: https://lttstore.gorgias.help/en-US/my-backpack-doesnt-stand-upright-like-in-the-product-photos-is-this-normal-218421

 

As for the zipper pulls, we are aware of the problem and will be providing updated zipper pulls per the process outlined here: https://lttstore.gorgias.help/en-US/one-or-more-of-the-carabiner-zipper-pulls-on-my-backpack-is-misaligned-or-has-snapped-off-completely-how-can-i-get-this-fixed-218420

[Middcore]

For anyone reading who wants a backpack that really does stand up on its own, look at AER stuff. 

[dwkekciej]

On 11/20/2023 at 12:39 PM, Adam Pilolla said:

Hey OP,

 

Standing upright is no-longer an advertised feature of the backpack. You've received compensation for this in the form of another backpack, but should consider this a normal part of wear-and-tear from now on. For more information see this article from our help center: https://lttstore.gorgias.help/en-US/my-backpack-doesnt-stand-upright-like-in-the-product-photos-is-this-normal-218421

 

As for the zipper pulls, we are aware of the problem and will be providing updated zipper pulls per the process outlined here: https://lttstore.gorgias.help/en-US/one-or-more-of-the-carabiner-zipper-pulls-on-my-backpack-is-misaligned-or-has-snapped-off-completely-how-can-i-get-this-fixed-218420

Did they ever notify people that purchase the backpack of this? I remember this being called out as a feature, but I don't recall ever being notified that it wasn't going to be covered by warranty going forward, otherwise, I would have exchanged/returned mine much earlier, as it hasn't really stood upright from about a month after purchase.

[helgehelge123]

On 11/20/2023 at 6:39 PM, Adam Pilolla said:

Hey OP,

 

Standing upright is no-longer an advertised feature of the backpack. You've received compensation for this in the form of another backpack, but should consider this a normal part of wear-and-tear from now on. For more information see this article from our help center: https://lttstore.gorgias.help/en-US/my-backpack-doesnt-stand-upright-like-in-the-product-photos-is-this-normal-218421

 

As for the zipper pulls, we are aware of the problem and will be providing updated zipper pulls per the process outlined here: https://lttstore.gorgias.help/en-US/one-or-more-of-the-carabiner-zipper-pulls-on-my-backpack-is-misaligned-or-has-snapped-off-completely-how-can-i-get-this-fixed-218420

Will Backpacks be replaced for people who bought it before the feature was removed? 
I was careful to always put my backpack against a wall/leg of a table to keep it pretty up right but it's starting to lean over and it was an advertised feature when I bought it. It's kind of like we trusted LMG after all that talk... to trust LMG... 

 

And the zipper delay is not your fault but ridiculous.
The backpack is out over a year, first broken carabineers came to light pretty fast and LMG is hoping to send out the first replacements by April? (I don't remember if they mentioned it in the WAN show or if I read it somewhere. Correct me if I'm wrong.)

[NovaNightmare]

Since everyone who bought a backpack when it was an advertised feature will get the chance to return it if they choose now (since it was before December 9th, right?), I imagine you'd be able to if that was your choice. Not sure what their time frame for this email is, as I've not seen one yet.

[Razercake]

10 hours ago, helgehelge123 said:

Will Backpacks be replaced for people who bought it before the feature was removed? 
I was careful to always put my backpack against a wall/leg of a table to keep it pretty up right but it's starting to lean over and it was an advertised feature when I bought it. It's kind of like we trusted LMG after all that talk... to trust LMG... 

I imagine the new backpack wouldn't be covered since standing upright is no longer advertised as a feature. however, you purchased it when it was, so at least one replacement should be possible. either way, I'd just shoot a message to support and let us know what they say. getting responses here can be a little hit or miss.
 

my defect was minor & they still offered a full replacement or refund, I attached pictures of the defect. if they refunded me, I don't see why they would refuse to replace a backpack purchased before the feature was no longer advertised. I'd say support needs to be clear that the feature is no longer advertised, so you don't expect the replacement to stay upright. it isn't the customer's job to check if the listed features changed since their purchase. 

 

10 hours ago, helgehelge123 said:

And the zipper delay is not your fault but ridiculous.
The backpack is out over a year, first broken carabineers came to light pretty fast and LMG is hoping to send out the first replacements by April? (I don't remember if they mentioned it in the WAN show or if I read it somewhere. Correct me if I'm wrong.)

Yeah, the timeline for it is pretty insane, I do wonder if people could opt for a refund/replacement since running around with broken carabiners isn't viable for everyone. still, for people opting to wait for the replacement kit, the wait has been long. since they decided to create new carabiners that wouldn't be as fragile and had to design a tool to allow easy user replacement, It taking longer is understandable. though I think a lot of people would've preferred to just get regular zipper pull kits when they finished the design on the replacement tool. instead of waiting to get a kit that contains both options, but I don't know how/where the replacement tool is manufactured so maybe it wouldn't have had any meaningful impact on the timeline.

Edited December 14, 2023 by Razercake
reduce image size

[FFLORO]

2 hours ago, Razercake said:

I imagine the new backpack wouldn't be covered since standing upright is no longer advertised as a feature. however, you purchased it when it was, so at least one replacement should be possible. either way, I'd just shoot a message to support and let us know what they say. getting responses here can be a little hit or miss.
 

my defect was minor & they still offered a full replacement or refund, I attached pictures of the defect. if they refunded me, I don't see why they would refuse to replace a backpack purchased before the feature was no longer advertised. I'd say support needs to be clear that the feature is no longer advertised, so you don't expect the replacement to stay upright. it isn't the customer's job to check if the listed features changed since their purchase. 

 

Yeah, the timeline for it is pretty insane, I do wonder if people could opt for a refund/replacement since running around with broken carabiners isn't viable for everyone. still, for people opting to wait for the replacement kit, the wait has been long. since they decided to create new carabiners that wouldn't be as fragile and had to design a tool to allow easy user replacement, It taking longer is understandable. though I think a lot of people would've preferred to just get regular zipper pull kits when they finished the design on the replacement tool. instead of waiting to get a kit that contains both options, but I don't know how/where the replacement tool is manufactured so maybe it wouldn't have had any meaningful impact on the timeline.

I might be blind, or it's the image compression, but what's the actual defect on this? And they've offered a full refund for it...?:o

[Razercake]

1 hour ago, FFLORO said:

I might be blind, or it's the image compression, but what's the actual defect on this? And they've offered a full refund for it...?:o

One of the straps isn't sewn together, so it can be pulled out of the metal adjustment thing(idk the name)

^{this thing}

you should be able to click the pictures in my previous comment to get a better view of it, first image is the strap with the proper ending. The next image is the 2 straps next to each other, where you should be able to see one with a proper sewn ending & one that is just straight. 

 

I was surprised when I heard back, I got the choice between a replacement or a refund. wouldn't have to return the backpack either way (maybe cause I live in the EU?) so I opted for the refund. it's perfectly functional otherwise, just had to tie a knot at the end of the faulty strap. when it comes to customer support, I just always go the route of asking worst case they can't help. this was my message to support: "Hey, so I just got my LTT Backpack: <order nr> & I noticed something one the straps. one of them isn't properly tied up or sewn (unsure the exact wording) is this normal?" also had some more in there regarding the screwdriver, it had some play I wanted to make sure was within spec(it was) but that is everything I said in regards to the backpack. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[FFLORO]

58 minutes ago, Razercake said:

One of the straps isn't sewn together, so it can be pulled out of the metal adjustment thing(idk the name)

^{this thing}

you should be able to click the pictures in my previous comment to get a better view of it, first image is the strap with the proper ending. The next image is the 2 straps next to each other, where you should be able to see one with a proper sewn ending & one that is just straight. 

 

I was surprised when I heard back, I got the choice between a replacement or a refund. wouldn't have to return the backpack either way (maybe cause I live in the EU?) so I opted for the refund. it's perfectly functional otherwise, just had to tie a knot at the end of the faulty strap. when it comes to customer support, I just always go the route of asking worst case they can't help. this was my message to support: "Hey, so I just got my LTT Backpack: <order nr> & I noticed something one the straps. one of them isn't properly tied up or sewn (unsure the exact wording) is this normal?" also had some more in there regarding the screwdriver, it had some play I wanted to make sure was within spec(it was) but that is everything I said in regards to the backpack. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Ohh, ok, I thought the defect was visible on both pics so that threw me off - well, glad it's all good for you! I'm waiting for mine from BF/CM deal now, shipping to EU indeed takes a while

[Adam Pilolla]

20 hours ago, helgehelge123 said:

Will Backpacks be replaced for people who bought it before the feature was removed? 
I was careful to always put my backpack against a wall/leg of a table to keep it pretty up right but it's starting to lean over and it was an advertised feature when I bought it. It's kind of like we trusted LMG after all that talk... to trust LMG... 

 

And the zipper delay is not your fault but ridiculous.
The backpack is out over a year, first broken carabineers came to light pretty fast and LMG is hoping to send out the first replacements by April? (I don't remember if they mentioned it in the WAN show or if I read it somewhere. Correct me if I'm wrong.)

The OP received a replacement because they'd asked for one prior to us dropping the feature. We are no longer offering that because we now know that it's unrealistic to expect backpacks to continue to stand upright throughout their lifetime.

Everyone who has bought a backpack prior to Dec. 8th is being offered the opportunity to return their backpack for a full refund due to the missing dual-bottom layer feature. You're welcome to follow that process if so desired; otherwise we'll be compensating you with $25 off your next order. You'll receive an email with more details on how to do those things before the end of this week.

Edited to add: we're planning to begin shipping replacement carabiners by at least January if not slightly before.

Edited December 14, 2023 by Adam Pilolla

[helgehelge123]

56 minutes ago, Adam Pilolla said:

The OP received a replacement because they'd asked for one prior to us dropping the feature. We are no longer offering that because we now know that it's unrealistic to expect backpacks to continue to stand upright throughout their lifetime.

Edited to add: we're planning to begin shipping replacement carabiners by at least January if not slightly before.

Thank you for the clarification on the carabiner shipping date. That’s a lot better

 

about the standing thing, you (as is lmg) sold it to me as standing up right. How is it unrealistic for me to assume the backpack is standing up right it‘s entire life and not just a month. There are backpacks that do that. 
 

i put back the original plastic bag till last month when i was not using the pack to keep it healthy as long as possible. I did not know you didn‘t follow the trust me guarantee on that feature. 
 

If my backpack loses all its strengths in the future its on me and the only chance is to return it now?

[FrozenIpaq]

4 hours ago, helgehelge123 said:

Thank you for the clarification on the carabiner shipping date. That’s a lot better

 

about the standing thing, you (as is lmg) sold it to me as standing up right. How is it unrealistic for me to assume the backpack is standing up right it‘s entire life and not just a month. There are backpacks that do that. 
 

i put back the original plastic bag till last month when i was not using the pack to keep it healthy as long as possible. I did not know you didn‘t follow the trust me guarantee on that feature. 
 

If my backpack loses all its strengths in the future its on me and the only chance is to return it now?

Not sure that type of tone is necessary here on the "I did not know you didn't follow the trust me guarantee on that feature". Product development is not straight-forward, especially on the longevity of a product - there's only so much testing that can be done - it was more of a "bonus" and was never described as a main selling point of "this product stands up by itself" and more "due to the way it was constructed, it can stand up by itself in some cases" or something like that. They probably could've marketed it differently and Linus might have said it differently live.

 

They realized over time that the bag does not indeed, maintain that ability, and updated their information on it. Personally I never expected the backpack to stay upright based on its construction - I think most "standing" backpacks are more rigid on their base (which also makes them less comfortable to wear). Would've expected them to realize that at the onset though since it isn't a rigid bottom.

 

They're doing what they can to correct the double-layer piece - they felt that was worth the TMB guarantee. If you aren't happy with the backpack, return it. They're giving you that option - go ahead and take it if you are concerned. 

[helgehelge123]

5 hours ago, FrozenIpaq said:

Not sure that type of tone is necessary here on the "I did not know you didn't follow the trust me guarantee on that feature".

It was not my intention to attack any individual.
To be fair, i don‘t know how hard it is to develop a product. Best I did is create some useful 3D file and print it but I didn’t sell that product, so nobody was affected by the mediocrity of my work. 

I just feel a bit helpless.
Even though I‘m a working adult and earn about average for Germany, ~350€ for a Backpack is a lot of money and after all that talk of Linus to trust him, i did exactly that. And they quietly took away a feature that was not the most important one but clearly influenced my decision. (I know they talked about removing that feature for future sells, I didnt know they retroactively removed it for everyone.)

 

Its the best backpack i ever owned and probably will ever own and I dont want to return it. It‘s perfect for my job as an IT technician carrying a laptop, tablet, the Switch for overnight jobs and a lot of cables and of cause the world class LTT screwdrivers. 
 

But all this leaves a bitter taste in my moth. 
 

edit after reading your comment again. 
maybe the test units with 2 bottom layer had the strength to stand up right and thats why they didn’t catch it? 

[FFLORO]

3 hours ago, helgehelge123 said:

edit after reading your comment again. 
maybe the test units with 2 bottom layer had the strength to stand up right and thats why they didn’t catch it? 

That's exactly what I was thinking, it'd make sense for it to at least last longer if that was the case. In any way, you have an option now to return it, no questions asked, for a full refund and they're really transparent about everything going on and as we learn more things, I think that's very well TMB confirmed

[Razercake]

Since the double layering issue is causing everyone who bought the backpack before the 8th to get a refund option this is overall a non-issue. 

16 hours ago, Adam Pilolla said:

The OP received a replacement because they'd asked for one prior to us dropping the feature. We are no longer offering that because we now know that it's unrealistic to expect backpacks to continue to stand upright throughout their lifetime.

just to be clear. if someone bought it when it was advertised as a feature, and contacted support after you removed it. would you not offer replacement/refund anymore? I understand not doing it for new purchases, but seems strange to remove this offer for people who bought it when it was listed as a feature. again this is overall a non-issue cause of the lack of double-layer, providing an opportunity to refund.

 

I'm just interested in fully knowing LMG's view on this, as I expected you to offer customers a refund/replacement at least once. since these people bought a product that could stand on its own but didn't. can you clarify that a bit? wanna make sure I don't misunderstand what you mean.

[AbsoluteWoo]

11 hours ago, FrozenIpaq said:

Not sure that type of tone is necessary here on the "I did not know you didn't follow the trust me guarantee on that feature". Product development is not straight-forward, especially on the longevity of a product - there's only so much testing that can be done - it was more of a "bonus" and was never described as a main selling point of "this product stands up by itself" and more "due to the way it was constructed, it can stand up by itself in some cases" or something like that. They probably could've marketed it differently and Linus might have said it differently live.

 

They realized over time that the bag does not indeed, maintain that ability, and updated their information on it. Personally I never expected the backpack to stay upright based on its construction - I think most "standing" backpacks are more rigid on their base (which also makes them less comfortable to wear). Would've expected them to realize that at the onset though since it isn't a rigid bottom.

 

They're doing what they can to correct the double-layer piece - they felt that was worth the TMB guarantee. If you aren't happy with the backpack, return it. They're giving you that option - go ahead and take it if you are concerned. 

I agree product development is not straight forward but that is not an excuse for a business to sell something that doesn't perform as advertised. I don't have the bag but I watch a lot of LTT and I didn't know they'd removed this feature. And it doesn't matter if it wasn't a "main" feature, it was a feature of the bag and I'd have been pretty annoyed if I had spent £300 on it and it didn't perform as advertised. And it doesn't matter what other bags do, the bag was advertised as being able to stand up on it's own and it doesn't.

 

You talk about longevity but 12 months isn't exactly a long time for a premium backpack (and from the sound of it the bag fails to perform as advertised much quicker than 12 months).

 

I deliberated over the LTT backpack for a long time and I am actually very relieved now that I didn't buy one. The bag not standing up on it's own is just as much of an issue as the carabiners and missing dual lining imo.

[FFLORO]

2 hours ago, AbsoluteWoo said:

I deliberated over the LTT backpack for a long time and I am actually very relieved now that I didn't buy one. The bag not standing up on it's own is just as much of an issue as the carabiners and missing dual lining imo.

Neither of which is actually an issue though - in every case there's a plan how to fix it and a full refund if you don't like it. I feel like most of the people actually complaining are those who haven't actually bought it and want to tell themselves now it was a good decision not to feel like they're missing out or something

 

And having dealt with a lot of faulty products in the past, LMG's support team is second to none - even giants like Samsung try to always reject any claims, blame the user and avoid any responsibility for weeks/months, here the rule actually is to 'make it right'

 

tl;dr if you actually bought something and have an issue, reach out to the support team, you'll be fine lol