When to upgrade?

[Comm123]

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Hello, questions:

 

1) I am looking for a 10900k level of CPU in AMD but am unfamiliar with their chips and when they were last refreshed. (please don't be jealous, I saved for a LONG time to afford this level of chip. 

 

2) When they do refresh their chips, will they use the current socket and motherboard types, (I am buying Corsair Hydro X series custom cooling parts and want to know if I can buy the current AMD CPU mount without it being obsolete because the new chips changed socket form.)

 

3) Why do people prefer AMD when Intel specs seem to do gaming so much better? Does AMD do better multitasking or something?

 

Thank you!

 

 

 

[MartinKweh]

AMD does extremely well in multitasking and workloads far ahead of intel. Even in gaming, intel doesn't lead AMD by that much (if an average of about 3-5% gain in gaming but loss in up to about 30-50% performance in workloads is okay to you, go ahead and get intel. Though, it's a case to case basis since Adobe still prefers intel . 

 

Anyways, it's just that lower end and midrange users can get higher performance, and ability to overclock at a lower price. Taking in to consideration that most people fall under this bracket (including me )

 

though, if you want maximum performance in gaming, going intel is the way to go. Then again , some games go better with AMD due to higher core and thread count but majority in games still prefers Intel's performance.

[Comm123]

Just now, MartinKweh said:

AMD does extremely well in multitasking and workloads far ahead of intel. Even in gaming, intel doesn't lead AMD by that much (if an average of about 3-5% gain in gaming but loss in up to about 30-50% performance in workloads is okay to you, go ahead and get intel. Though, it's a case to case basis since Adobe still prefers intel . 

 

Anyways, it's just that lower end and midrange users can get higher performance, and ability to overclock at a lower price.

I think I understand... So AMD is more for budgetary concerns, but technically Intel still leads? 

[MartinKweh]

1 minute ago, Comm123 said:

I think I understand... So AMD is more for budgetary concerns, but technically Intel still leads? 

In most games, yes. But the higher end graphics card you get, the smaller the difference gets to the point that it's negligible especially if you play at 1440p or higher. Heck I've seen some reviews where the 10900k and the 3900x have the same frame rates at 4k using the 2080ti. 

 

[bellabichon]

5 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

1) I am looking for a 10900k level of CPU in AMD but am unfamiliar with their chips and when they were last refreshed. (please don't be jealous, I saved for a LONG time to afford this level of chip. 

The most comparable AMD CPU to the 10900K is the Ryzen 9 3900X. It's 12c/24t, with a base of 3.8 and a boost up to 4.6. It's also just over half the price of the 10900K (with similar performance in most benchmarks).

10 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

2) When they do refresh their chips, will they use the current socket and motherboard types, (I am buying Corsair Hydro X series custom cooling parts and want to know if I can buy the current AMD CPU mount without it being obsolete because the new chips changed socket form.)

Yes, AMD has promised that their next-gen processors will be compatible with both the AM4 socket, and the B550/X570 chipset.

12 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

3) Why do people prefer AMD when Intel specs seem to do gaming so much better? Does AMD do better multitasking or something?

If you have infinite money and you exclusively game, then Intel's highest-end chips will still give you the best performance. However, when it comes to price-per-dollar metrics, AMD absolutely crushes Intel. AMD also has a solid lead in creative work (rendering, video editing, CAD, etc) due to their superior optimization of HCC processors.

[bellabichon]

4 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

I think I understand... So AMD is more for budgetary concerns, but technically Intel still leads? 

If by "technically" you mean a maximum of 3-5% performance increases for literally double the price, then yeah, Intel still leads. 

[Moonzy]

8 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

1) I am looking for a 10900k level of CPU in AMD but am unfamiliar with their chips and when they were last refreshed. (please don't be jealous, I saved for a LONG time to afford this level of chip. 

same level in what? multitasking? probably the 3900x

gaming? nothing. best gaming chip is 10600k, the cheapest chip to hit the max FPS for most games

or the 10700k if you want some extra threads

 

10 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

2) When they do refresh their chips, will they use the current socket and motherboard types, (I am buying Corsair Hydro X series custom cooling parts and want to know if I can buy the current AMD CPU mount without it being obsolete because the new chips changed socket form.)

AMD next gen chips (4000 series) will still use AM4, and might be the last generation to do so.

so the cooling mount will be the same

 

12 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

3) Why do people prefer AMD when Intel specs seem to do gaming so much better? Does AMD do better multitasking or something?

yes

but purely for gaming, 10600k is still the best overall chip, or the 10700k for some extra threads but still keep the FPS

 

2 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

I think I understand... So AMD is more for budgetary concerns, but technically Intel still leads? 

not really, AMD is more of a "for work" chip as of now

it doesnt game badly but intel is still in the lead (by quite a significant margin)

but if you value multithreaded performance, you should consider AMD

 

so if you're purely gaming, stick with intel for now, anyone who says "but AMD have better value" is literally not understanding the term "purely gaming"

but zen3 might take the gaming crown from intel, so let's just wait and see

[Comm123]

1 minute ago, bellabichon said:

The most comparable AMD CPU to the 10900K is the Ryzen 9 3900X. It's 12c/24t, with a base of 3.8 and a boost up to 4.6. It's also just over half the price of the 10900K (with similar performance in most benchmarks).

Yes, AMD has promised that their next-gen processors will be compatible with both the AM4 socket, and the B550/X570 chipset.

If you have infinite money and you exclusively game, then Intel's highest-end chips will still give you the best performance. However, when it comes to price-per-dollar metrics, AMD absolutely crushes Intel. AMD also has a solid lead in creative work (rendering, video editing, CAD, etc) due to their superior optimization of HCC processors.

Okay, thank you both. 

 

So, i edit videos (only Shotcut. no Adobe products) , I game and I web develop. 

I am looking for a higher end computer because I am putting in hardline an don't count on upgrading soon so I want to make it as future proof as possible.

 

That being said, have both Intel and AMD put out their best chips for sale this year already or do they release in the fall and should I wait since I want the system to be as future proof as possible?  I was comparing the 10900k to the 3950X.

[Comm123]

2 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

same level in what? multitasking? probably the 3900x

gaming? nothing. best gaming chip is 10600k, the cheapest chip to hit the max FPS for most games

or the 10700k if you want some extra threads

 

AMD next gen chips (4000 series) will still use AM4, and might be the last generation to do so.

so the cooling mount will be the same

 

yes

but purely for gaming, 10600k is still the best overall chip, or the 10700k for some extra threads but still keep the FPS

 

not really, AMD is more of a "for work" chip as of now

it doesnt game badly but intel is still in the lead (by quite a significant margin)

but if you value multithreaded performance, you should consider AMD

 

so if you're purely gaming, stick with intel for now, anyone who says "but AMD have better value" is literally not understanding the term "purely gaming"

but zen3 might take the gaming crown from intel, so let's just wait and see

Thank you all for our replies, I am trying to keep you all in the conversation.

 

So, Zen3 is AMD's next chip which will support he same Am4 socket?  

 

Okay, so full story layed out...

 

Intel leads in gaming (either by little or a lot but still they lead so if your game only, that's the one for you.

But if you mix work and play (such as video editing) you should consider AMD because their chips work for a person who does both but with a little but of sacrificing in the gaming department.

 

However, their next chip (coming out this year?) may overtake Intel in the gaming department as well so we'll have to wait and see?

 

[Comm123]

10 minutes ago, MartinKweh said:

In most games, yes. But the higher end graphics card you get, the smaller the difference gets to the point that it's negligible especially if you play at 1440p or higher. Heck I've seen some reviews where the 10900k and the 3900x have the same frame rates at 4k using the 2080ti. 

 

Thank you for your helps with this, I appreciate you all, got a lot of information very quickly! 

[dfsgsfa]

13 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

I think I understand... So AMD is more for budgetary concerns, but technically Intel still leads? 

at 4k gaming, amd is still faster

intel only for single thread workload

[Comm123]

1 minute ago, dfsgsfa said:

at 4k gaming, amd is still faster

intel only for single thread workload

Interesting... thank you! 

[SpookyCitrus]

AMD Zen 3 is coming out in the next 2 to 3 months. 

1 minute ago, Comm123 said:

Thank you all for our replies, I am trying to keep you all in the conversation.

 

So, Zen3 is AMD's next chip which will support he same Am4 socket?  

 

Okay, so full story layed out...

 

Intel leads in gaming (either by little or a lot but still they lead so if your game only, that's the one for you.

But if you mix work and play (such as video editing) you should consider AMD because their chips work for a person who does both but with a little but of sacrificing in the gaming department.

 

However, their next chip (coming out this year?) may overtake Intel in the gaming department as well so we'll have to wait and see?

 

Yes Zen3 is coming out here in the next 2 to 3 months and will be on the AM4 socket, so any AM4 bracket coolers will work with the new boards, and B550 and X570 are confirmed as compatible with the new CPUs. We haven't gotten any benchmarks or info on how they perform so we don't know for sure if they will outperform intel in gaming. However for video editing and multitasking they already take the cake. And gaming isn't as far off performance wise as you may think, comparing the 3900x to the 10900k in most cases it's an at most performance gap of 10fps. Is 10fps worth an extra $250, I don't think so. I'd wait to see what AMD has to offer with Zen3 then decide.

[Moonzy]

2 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

So, Zen3 is AMD's next chip which will support he same Am4 socket?

yes

just take note that not all AM4 boards will support it

500 series chipset will support it, while 400 series boards will depend on vendors to implement a beta bios

 

3 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

Intel leads in gaming (either by little or a lot but still they lead so if your game only, that's the one for you.

But if you mix work and play (such as video editing) you should consider AMD because their chips work for a person who does both but with a little but of sacrificing in the gaming department.

depends, on how you want to balance work and gaming

intel chip can multithread just fine, just not a good value for it

 

4 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

However, their next chip (coming out this year?) may overtake Intel in the gaming department as well so we'll have to wait and see?

may be the case, have to wait and see

 

4 minutes ago, dfsgsfa said:

at 4k gaming, amd is still faster

intel only for single thread workload

interesting, can i get the source for this?

[dfsgsfa]

5 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

interesting, can i get the source for this?

 

[Moonzy]

11 minutes ago, dfsgsfa said:

 

interesting, and im interested to know why AMD cpu run games faster when it's GPU bound

pcie doesnt seem to be the cause since 2080ti doesnt run on pcie4.0

 

also OP, there's also pcie 4.0 to consider, that intel doesnt have

keep an eye out when ampere launches, see if it matters

[Comm123]

13 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

interesting, and im interested to know why AMD cpu run games faster when it's GPU bound

pcie doesnt seem to be the cause since 2080ti doesnt run on pcie4.0

 

also OP, there's also pcie 4.0 to consider, that intel doesnt have

keep an eye out when ampere launches, see if it matters

Thank you all so much for your information.

 

What is "ampere" is that their PCIE4 naming?

Yes, I head that intel doesn't currently support PCIE 4 so if I am truly looking to future proof this as much as possible, That is probably the deciding factor given how well AMD already does in all the other aspects.

 

Are both intel and AMD refreshing in the next couple months? 

[Comm123]

29 minutes ago, dfsgsfa said:

 

Thank you! 

[Moonzy]

4 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

What is "ampere" is that their PCIE4 naming?

ampere is Nvidia's next gen GPU name, or so we call it

4 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

Are both intel and AMD refreshing in the next couple months? 

AMD most likely yes

intel have no news, and unlikely to have a refresh for the remaining year, as their new chip came out earlier this year iirc

 

pcie 4.0 may be nice to have, but im not sure how it'll affect gaming, it might matter, it might not matter

[Comm123]

3 hours ago, Moonzy said:

ampere is Nvidia's next gen GPU name, or so we call it

AMD most likely yes

intel have no news, and unlikely to have a refresh for the remaining year, as their new chip came out earlier this year iirc

 

pcie 4.0 may be nice to have, but im not sure how it'll affect gaming, it might matter, it might not matter

Okay, thank you.

 

And what about those chips that on their motherboards, they have ram slots on both sides?

 

Those are crazy expensive and for multimedia companies, right? - no so much the general consumer? 

[Moonzy]

2 hours ago, Comm123 said:

Okay, thank you.

 

And what about those chips that on their motherboards, they have ram slots on both sides?

 

Those are crazy expensive and for multimedia companies, right? - no so much the general consumer? 

If your main goal is gaming then don't look at those

[Comm123]

On 8/25/2020 at 9:46 PM, Moonzy said:

If your main goal is gaming then don't look at those

Okay, well i am looking fo r work and play but those are like a 7,000$ machine, right? there are no reasonably priced threadrippers, right? 

 

I'm looking for a top of the line current gen (10900k) level of CPU weather that be AMD's upcoming chips this fall that you mentioned.  I am just looking to build a top of the line (but not ridiculous) machine to be future proof as possible since i am doing hard line tubing and plan on just not upgrading for a while.

 

What would you recommend (including seeing how AMD's new Ryzen chips do this fall)

 

RTX2080 ti level of consumer builds, not the titan cards level if that helps give an idea?  The top consumer, not multimedia video editing level, just a top of the line for work and play for the next few years. 

[Moonzy]

2 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

well i am looking fo r work and play but those are like a 7,000$ machine, right?

only if your work can justify the price

games dont run well (sometimes worse) on HEDT (high end desktops) platforms due to lower single core boost in some HEDTs

 

3 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

I'm looking for a top of the line current gen (10900k) level of CPU weather that be AMD's upcoming chips this fall that you mentioned.

i would recommend 10700k instead if your main focus is gaming, unless your work can justify having those two extra cores

games nowadays generally dont run on more than 4 cores, and i dont see 8 cores being insufficient anytime soon

 

by the time games utilise 8 cores, you're probably due an upgrade anyways due to the lack of single core performance relative to options of that time. and games heavily rely on single core performance.

 

34 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

What would you recommend (including seeing how AMD's new Ryzen chips do this fall)

waiting for reviews to

1) see if AMD tops intel in gaming

2) see if pcie 4.0 matters for gaming with next gen cards

 

36 minutes ago, Comm123 said:

since i am doing hard line tubing and plan on just not upgrading for a while

no offense, but you dont sound like the kind of person i would recommend running watercooling

due to the effort and maintenance needed

even i myself avoid it because it's a hassle to deal with, not to mention the risks

[Comm123]

13 hours ago, Moonzy said:

only if your work can justify the price

games dont run well (sometimes worse) on HEDT (high end desktops) platforms due to lower single core boost in some HEDTs

 

i would recommend 10700k instead if your main focus is gaming, unless your work can justify having those two extra cores

games nowadays generally dont run on more than 4 cores, and i dont see 8 cores being insufficient anytime soon

 

by the time games utilise 8 cores, you're probably due an upgrade anyways due to the lack of single core performance relative to options of that time. and games heavily rely on single core performance.

 

waiting for reviews to

1) see if AMD tops intel in gaming

2) see if pcie 4.0 matters for gaming with next gen cards

 

no offense, but you dont sound like the kind of person i would recommend running watercooling

due to the effort and maintenance needed

even i myself avoid it because it's a hassle to deal with, not to mention the risks

Thank you for answering all my questions, I appreciate your help.  I know quite a bit but the AMD chips are new an since I was looking for a future-proof build, thought i'd look at them but since I've been an Intel person I haven't payed much attention to AMD.

 

I understand, no, I do sound naive,  I actually enjoy building PCs ands gaming, just didn't know a lot in those areas.  I am just looking to take a break for a while and want to build a machine that will last for a while.  Thanks for the heads-up on the maintenance, I am familiar, just needed to square these specs out of the way first. 

 

I am gaming mostly, I suppose but I am going to be using it for more work soon, and just needed to know about AMD before I purchased.  

 

Thank you for all the information and I look forward to their chips coming out this fall, hopefully we'll get a free copy of CoD CW with a purchase! 

 

Thank you again, M8.  You've helped quite a bit!

[Comm123]

17 hours ago, Moonzy said:

only if your work can justify the price

games dont run well (sometimes worse) on HEDT (high end desktops) platforms due to lower single core boost in some HEDTs

 

i would recommend 10700k instead if your main focus is gaming, unless your work can justify having those two extra cores

games nowadays generally dont run on more than 4 cores, and i dont see 8 cores being insufficient anytime soon

 

by the time games utilise 8 cores, you're probably due an upgrade anyways due to the lack of single core performance relative to options of that time. and games heavily rely on single core performance.

 

waiting for reviews to

1) see if AMD tops intel in gaming

2) see if pcie 4.0 matters for gaming with next gen cards

 

no offense, but you dont sound like the kind of person i would recommend running watercooling

due to the effort and maintenance needed

even i myself avoid it because it's a hassle to deal with, not to mention the risks

My last question:

 

Intel wont update again until next year? - AMD and Intel aren't on the same cycle?