backwards compatibility with PCIE 3.0?

[Yummychickenblue]

right now i have an fm2 a75-ma-e35 which only has PCIE 2.0 so i can't use newer GPUs and i am planning on upgrading sometime this year so i was wondering if i could upgrade my motherboard now keep my current graphics card and then upgrade my GPU later?

[tryphaa]

You can use a current  gpu on PCI-e 2.0. You will have less bandwidth but if you are at 8x or 16x you will be fine.

[amintha1992]

PCIe 3.0 works fine with PCIe 2.0

 

you should be ok as long as your CPU is not two slow other wise it will make a bottleneck

[Flyguygamer]

Yes gen 2 and gen 3 are fully compatible.

[Yummychickenblue]

PCIe 3.0 works fine with PCIe 2.0

you should be ok as long as your CPU is not two slow other wise it will make a bottleneck

at the moment i have the amd a8 6600K (not overclocking because to be honest i am a little scared as well as i am just using the stock cooler

You can use a current gpu on PCI-e 2.0. You will have less bandwidth but if you are at 8x or 16x you will be fine.

so i can get a newer gpu now and upgrade my mobo later?

[tryphaa]

so i can get a newer gpu now and upgrade my mobo later?

yes.

[Yummychickenblue]

yes.

cool i will keep that in mind

[amintha1992]

at the moment i have the amd a8 6600K (not overclocking because to be honest i am a little scared as well as i am just using the stock cooler

you should be just fine for most modern games with multi-core support.

[Yummychickenblue]

you should be just fine for most modern games with multi-core support.

YAY!

I am thinking of getting a GTX 760 will my motherboard/CPU specs handle it ?

[amintha1992]

I am thinking of getting a GTX 760 will my motherboard/CPU specs handle it             ?                   

yes.it should be well balanced. 

[-rascal-]

Well....you may want to get a new power supply with that GTX 760. Looking at your profile...

 

" PSU  some no-name PSU that came with my [Cooler Master TC-102] case (probably shouldn't be using it)"

 

And...looking through Google, that PSU that came with your case is a Cooler Master "Thermal Master" 500W power supply.

And...looking at all the reviews and feedback on the interwebs, it's BAD, HORRIBAD, DISSAPPOINT.

A whooping 20A on a single +12v rail...and 30A on EACH of the +3.3v and +5v. That is NOT a legitimate "500W"; more like a 250W in reality.

[Yummychickenblue]

Well....you may want to get a new power supply with that GTX 760. Looking at your profile...

" PSU some no-name PSU that came with my [Cooler Master TC-102] case (probably shouldn't be using it)"

And...looking through Google, that PSU that came with your case is a Cooler Master "Thermal Master" 500W power supply.

And...looking at all the reviews and feedback on the interwebs, it's BAD, HORRIBAD, DISSAPPOINT.

A whooping 20A on a single +12v rail...and 30A on EACH of the +3.3v and +5v. That is NOT a legitimate "500W"; more like a 250W in reality.

Oh ok I am not very good at PSU specs but I think that it is better to have more rails

Well....you may want to get a new power supply with that GTX 760. Looking at your profile...

" PSU some no-name PSU that came with my [Cooler Master TC-102] case (probably shouldn't be using it)"

And...looking through Google, that PSU that came with your case is a Cooler Master "Thermal Master" 500W power supply.

And...looking at all the reviews and feedback on the interwebs, it's BAD, HORRIBAD, DISSAPPOINT.

A whooping 20A on a single +12v rail...and 30A on EACH of the +3.3v and +5v. That is NOT a legitimate "500W"; more like a 250W in reality.

could you recommend a PSU?

[-rascal-]

Oh ok I am not very good at PSU specs but I think that it is better to have more rails

 

 

could you recommend a PSU?

 

More rails does not necessarily means it's better.

 

+12v, +3.3v, and +5v (as well as -12v, -3.3v, -5v) are all standards and requirements for a PC. Back in the day, a PC relied more on the +5v and +3.3v rails, but once the PC world kicked into high gear (early 2000's), systems now draw most of its power (like 80% - 90%) from the +12v line.

 

If you look at the quality made units from...XFX, SeaSonic, Corsair, Antec, etc...most of the output power is from the +12v.

Examples and some power supply recommendations.

 

Oh, a little high school science.

Power = Current x Voltage

 

Corsair CX500 500W. 38A on a single +12v rail = 456W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139027

 

XFX Core Edition 550W. 44A on a single +12v rail = 528W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207013

 

SeaSonic S12II 520W. 40A on the +12v = 480W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151094

 

Antec NEO 520W. 40A on the +12v = 480W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371030

 

Rosewill Capstone 450W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182066

 

Fractal Design Integra R2 500W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817580001

 

If you look at the corsair CX500 500W, 456W out of the 500W is from the +12v. That is ~91% of the power supply's output.

The XFX 550W; 528W from the +12v. That's 96%.

The SeaSonic and Antec 520W's. ~92%.

[Yummychickenblue]

More rails does not necessarily means it's better.

 

+12v, +3.3v, and +5v (as well as -12v, -3.3v, -5v) are all standards and requirements for a PC. Back in the day, a PC relied more on the +5v and +3.3v rails, but once the PC world kicked into high gear (early 2000's), systems now draw most of its power (like 80% - 90%) from the +12v line.

 

If you look at the quality made units from...XFX, SeaSonic, Corsair, Antec, etc...most of the output power is from the +12v.

Examples and some power supply recommendations.

 

Oh, a little high school science.

Power = Current x Voltage

 

Corsair CX500 500W. 38A on a single +12v rail = 456W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139027

 

XFX Core Edition 550W. 44A on a single +12v rail = 528W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207013

 

SeaSonic S12II 520W. 40A on the +12v = 480W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151094

 

Antec NEO 520W. 40A on the +12v = 480W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371030

 

Rosewill Capstone 450W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182066

 

Fractal Design Integra R2 500W.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817580001

 

If you look at the corsair CX500 500W, 456W out of the 500W is from the +12v. That is ~91% of the power supply's output.

The XFX 550W; 528W from the +12v. That's 96%.

The SeaSonic and Antec 520W's. ~92%.

so do i want the one with the highest output from the 21v rail?

[EclipseSkye]

I'm using a card with PCIe 3.0 on my PCIe 2.0 slot and have not met any problem so far.

[Yummychickenblue]

I'm using a card with PCIe 3.0 on my PCIe 2.0 slot and have not met any problem so far.

ok thanks

[-rascal-]

so do i want the one with the highest output from the 21v +12v rail?

 

Yes, essentially.

Your entire system is almost powered by the +12v line.

• CPU / Processor
• GPU / Graphics card
• HDD (along with a bit of +5v)
• Motherboard (along with a small mix of +3.3v and +5v)
• Case fans (if PWM controlled and not voltage controlled)

 

And...yes, PCI-E 3.0 and PCI-E 2.x (and PCI-E 1.x) are all backwards compatible.

As of now, PCI-E 2.0 is NOT a bottlenecking factory for graphics cards - even something like a GTX 780Ti.

 

 

PCI-E 3.0 was pushed out to the market because the inventors of the PCI-Express interface wanted to. Well....more hype, new product, more money for them. Intel also wanted to use it as a marketing scheme so people would jump onto the "Ivy-Bridge" bandwagon.

 

AMD stuck with PCI-E 2.x on their AM3+, and even FM2, because PCI-E 3.0 is not a necessity. That's why they waited until FM2+; could've even waited for another round before pushing it out (successor of AM3+? FM3?).

 

When you're advertising double the bandwidth by going from PCI-Express 2.x  ---> PCI-Express 3.0, people will be like

 

(There was already talks of PCI-E 4.0 when PCI-E 3.0 wasn't even out to market yet. I mean, COME ON!! Are you fu%king kidding me?! *sign* *face desk*)

[Yummychickenblue]

Yes, essentially.

Your entire system is almost powered by the +12v line.

• CPU / Processor
• GPU / Graphics card
• HDD (along with a bit of +5v)
• Motherboard (along with a small mix of +3.3v and +5v)
• Case fans (if PWM controlled and not voltage controlled)

 

And...yes, PCI-E 3.0 and PCI-E 2.x (and PCI-E 1.x) are all backwards compatible.

As of now, PCI-E 2.0 is NOT a bottlenecking factory for graphics cards - even something like a GTX 780Ti.

 

 

PCI-E 3.0 was pushed out to the market because the inventors of the PCI-Express interface wanted to. Well....more hype, new product, more money for them. Intel also wanted to use it as a marketing scheme so people would jump onto the "Ivy-Bridge" bandwagon.

 

AMD stuck with PCI-E 2.x on their AM3+, and even FM2, because PCI-E 3.0 is not a necessity. That's why they waited until FM2+; could've even waited for another round before pushing it out (successor of AM3+? FM3?).

 

When you're advertising double the bandwidth by going from PCI-Express 2.x  ---> PCI-Express 3.0, people will be like

 

(There was already talks of PCI-E 4.0 when PCI-E 3.0 wasn't even out to market yet. I mean, COME ON!! Are you fu%king kidding me?! *sign* *face desk*)

so I want a good mix of all but the most important is the 12v rail

[Yummychickenblue]

If I were to upgrade my system should I do a fresh install of windows?

[Yummychickenblue]

Yes, essentially.

Your entire system is almost powered by the +12v line.

• CPU / Processor
• GPU / Graphics card
• HDD (along with a bit of +5v)
• Motherboard (along with a small mix of +3.3v and +5v)
• Case fans (if PWM controlled and not voltage controlled)

 

And...yes, PCI-E 3.0 and PCI-E 2.x (and PCI-E 1.x) are all backwards compatible.

As of now, PCI-E 2.0 is NOT a bottlenecking factory for graphics cards - even something like a GTX 780Ti.

 

 

PCI-E 3.0 was pushed out to the market because the inventors of the PCI-Express interface wanted to. Well....more hype, new product, more money for them. Intel also wanted to use it as a marketing scheme so people would jump onto the "Ivy-Bridge" bandwagon.

 

AMD stuck with PCI-E 2.x on their AM3+, and even FM2, because PCI-E 3.0 is not a necessity. That's why they waited until FM2+; could've even waited for another round before pushing it out (successor of AM3+? FM3?).

 

When you're advertising double the bandwidth by going from PCI-Express 2.x  ---> PCI-Express 3.0, people will be like

 

(There was already talks of PCI-E 4.0 when PCI-E 3.0 wasn't even out to market yet. I mean, COME ON!! Are you fu%king kidding me?! *sign* *face desk*)

I was looking at the Fractal Design PSU and noticed that it has 2 12v rails, how will that affect performance?

[-rascal-]

so I want a good mix of all but the most important is the 12v rail

 

Yes, that is correct.

 

If I were to upgrade my system should I do a fresh install of windows?

 

It is not exactly "required," but it would be recommended that you do. It's great when you successfully just plug and play and you don't have to reinstall everything....BUT if that doesn't work out, you still be spending hours, days, or weeks trying to fix unknown system crashes, blue-screens, etc.

 

I was looking at the Fractal Design PSU and noticed that it has 2 12v rails, how will that affect performance?

 

Multiple rails is good and bad...depending on how you look at it, and who you talk to.

 

Separate rails provide more protection from short circuits or other types of failures. If say...your CPU / Processor and Hard drives are on rail 1, and your GPU / Graphics Card is on rail 2. Rail 2 blows up because of a power outage. Only thing dead is your graphics card. Your CPU and Hard Drives are safe and unharmed.

 

The problem with multiple rails is you need to spread your power draw out.

Using the above example, CPU + HDD + fans on Rail 1, and Graphics Card and other stuff on Rail 2.

If you put everything on Rail 1, and only 3 fans on Rail 2...you will overload the power supply (and the automatic shut off kicks in).

 

Single Rail...well...you put everything on one. It's simpler.

You get "less" protection. The Rail blows up, everything is gone.

 

 

In all honesty, power supplies these days have a lot of safety features built-in (i.e. Over voltage protection, over current protection, Active PFC, etc). Personally, I'd suggest going with a single rail power supply.

 

You will see, though, high wattage power supplies (we are talking 1500W+) tend to use multiple rails. And it makes sense. 1500W? You gotta be running 4 graphics cards and be overclocking with extreme water cooling or with Dry Ice, Liquid Nitrogen, or something. At that point, when sh!t goes sideways, or things hit the fan, you better hope you have the most protection as possible.

[Yummychickenblue]

Yes, that is correct.

 

 

It is not exactly "required," but it would be recommended that you do. It's great when you successfully just plug and play and you don't have to reinstall everything....BUT if that doesn't work out, you still be spending hours, days, or weeks trying to fix unknown system crashes, blue-screens, etc.

 

 

Multiple rails is good and bad...depending on how you look at it, and who you talk to.

 

Separate rails provide more protection from short circuits or other types of failures. If say...your CPU / Processor and Hard drives are on rail 1, and your GPU / Graphics Card is on rail 2. Rail 2 blows up because of a power outage. Only thing dead is your graphics card. Your CPU and Hard Drives are safe and unharmed.

 

The problem with multiple rails is you need to spread your power draw out.

Using the above example, CPU + HDD + fans on Rail 1, and Graphics Card and other stuff on Rail 2.

If you put everything on Rail 1, and only 3 fans on Rail 2...you will overload the power supply (and the automatic shut off kicks in).

 

Single Rail...well...you put everything on one. It's simpler.

You get "less" protection. The Rail blows up, everything is gone.

 

 

In all honesty, power supplies these days have a lot of safety features built-in (i.e. Over voltage protection, over current protection, Active PFC, etc). Personally, I'd suggest going with a single rail power supply.

 

You will see, though, high wattage power supplies (we are talking 1500W+) tend to use multiple rails. And it makes sense. 1500W? You gotta be running 4 graphics cards and be overclocking with extreme water cooling or with Dry Ice, Liquid Nitrogen, or something. At that point, when sh!t goes sideways, or things hit the fan, you better hope you have the most protection as possible.

Ok thanks, will I need anything over a 500 watt PSU. Because it seems like people build some pretty high end systems on them

[-rascal-]

Ok thanks, will I need anything over a 500 watt PSU. Because it seems like people build some pretty high end systems on them

 

For your system, and to provide some headroom for future upgrades (given that you will only use a single graphics card...no SLi), a 500W - 550W is plenty.

 

Just for an example, my system (more info available on my profile) pulls about 400W from the wall. Since my power supply is only 80 PLUS Bronze, that is about ....eh... 340W.

[Yummychickenblue]

For your system, and to provide some headroom for future upgrades (given that you will only use a single graphics card...no SLi), a 500W - 550W is plenty.

 

Just for an example, my system (more info available on my profile) pulls about 400W from the wall. Since my power supply is only 80 PLUS Bronze, that is about ....eh... 340W.

Ok, thanks for all the help now I know what I am doing when shopping for power supplies