Starting computer twice issue

[Soularyem]

Hello everyone.  I'm having a strange issue with booting my computer that's been racking my brain.h

 

PC Specs:

 

CPU: AMD FX-9590 4.7 GHz 8-Core

Motherboard: ASRock 990FX Extreme6 ATX

Video Card: PowerColor Radeon RX 480 8GB

Case:  Corsair 200R ATX Mid Tower Case
More details in the pic below

 

 

Issue: When I press the power, everything turns on as normal (lights on mouse, fans in the case, light on the mouse) EXCEPT the keyboard and monitor.  After I press the power for 5 seconds, wait less than a second, then repress the power button again, it boots up perfectly.  So, basically, I have to boot it twice every time I keep it off for long periods.  Restarting it is no problem in booting.  It only the first time after I keep it off for a while.

 

The if I'm not mistaken, bios/uefi is up to date.  Everything seems secure on the inside (video card, wires, etc.).  I could be missing something simple, but any advice would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance.

[Nord]

Are you cuting off the electricity to the system after you've shut it down?

Like turning off the PSU or a switch on a powerstrip? - If yes, thats probably the issue.

 

Holding down the power button also usualy "discharges" the system of elecricity.

Try plugging your PC directly into a wall socket, no powerstrips inbetween (or try a different powerstrip if thats not possible), and see if that makes a difference.

 

What happens when you let the PC boot up while neither the keyboard nor monitor works and then unplug & plug either or both the Monitor / Keyboard into the PC again?

Do they start working or not?

 

Do you hear any static/electrical noise when booting/rebooting/holding the power button coming from the PC that usualy is not there once its working?

 

Whats your powersupply? Brandname, productname & wattage.

[Quaker]

Most likely the initial power surge is overloading some area of the power supply and causing it to go into an emergency shutdown mode. When you restart, everything is at least partially charged up and so the starting surge is lower and things boot up normally.

You can probably fix this by getting a "better" power supply - "better" in this case, could mean either more wattage, or better quality, depending upon what you have now.

Or, you could get rid of the power hungry FX-9590 and get an Intel Skylake of some kind or wait for Zen.

[Soularyem]

Thank you for the fast responses and I apologize for my delay in replying (I'm at work and Internet is very limited).

 

My power supply is "EVGA SuperNOVA 650 G1 120-G1-0650-XR 80+ GOLD 650 W."

 

I won't be able to do the power strip or monitor/keyboard tests until I get home from work. When I do, I'll give an update if either works. 

 

I don't hear any other sounds than the normal fans and buzz of my hard drives.

 

This is my first PC build. So please excuse my "n00bness." ☺

 

[Soularyem]

@Nord - So, I plugged it into the wall instead of the power protector with the same thing happening.  Before I turned it off and on again, I disconnected the monitor and keyboard, waited a few seconds, then connected them again.  Still nothing.  They keyboard remains off (the keys have LED and light up when a connection is made to the computer).  The monitor remains off, as if it's not connected either.

 

 

[Nord]

The next most likely thing would be your PSU, like Quaker said with the power surge.

However it is extremly odd that this only seems to affect your Monitor or probably the GPU aswell as your keyboard.

 

 

When you do a cold start and dont get a signal on the monitor, do you hear the windows "welcome sound" when you continue to let the PC boot up?

 

Did you try to plugin your keyboard into a different USB port?

Did you try a different GPU or using the integrated iGPU (if your CPU even has one)?

DId you try a different monitor or TV?

Did you try a different connection port on the GPU? Usualy they have 2 DVI and 1 up to 3 HDMI ports, so just switch them and see if that does something, maybe.

 

 

 

 

[Soularyem]

@Nord I did not try different USB ports, which I'm going to do in the morning.  For some reason, it will still start up normally if I shut it down, even after waiting a few minutes.  It's when I wake up in the morning or come home from work and turn it on that it happens.  I only have this one monitor and an HDMI port. (the other one I have is an old Dell monitor that only has the old VGA connection) and I only have this GPU ( PowerColor Radeon RX 480 8GB).

 

Also, no, I don't hear the Windows welcome sound.  In fact, other than the normal power lights for the case, the only thing that lights up is the mouse.

 

I think you and @Quaker are right.  It might be the power supply.  I'm going to look into getting another one and see if that helps after I try the keyboard in the morning.

 

Again, thank you both very much for your help.  :-)

[samiscool51]

PSU is not providing enough power to try and start the system, it looks like it failed in powering the system for the first time, but when you turn it off and drain the system, the PSU has to provide more power to fill up the capacitors in the system, forcing it to send more power and kick starting the system and allowing the system to start

if the PSU is still under warertry return it and say it is failing to power the system when the capacitors on the components are full and it can only start if they are empty

[Nord]

Since the system fails to boot even when it is not displaying anything, as you can not hear the windows login sound, its most certainly the PSU. Samiscool51 summed it up pretty well of whats happening.

A 650W Gold PSU provides in reality somewhere between 87% to 90% of the 650W, so thats around 570W~.

Alone your CPU is 220W and the GPU is 170W, so thats almost 400W. Add an average of 1x SSD, 2x HDD, 3x system fans, some peripherals and you have around 550W that your system is drawing under full load or a short time during booting.

That 550w is basically just 20W less than what your PSU is able to provide, so very close allready.

Powersupplys will degrade over time, depending on how much you use them and if you use them to what extend, they can suffer performance losses after 1 or 2 years already - which means they provide even less wattage. Especially when you run them always "maxed", which you did.

Powersupplys also usualy perform at theyr best somewhere around 60%-80% of load, its called a efficency curve - example of an 1200W PSU:

So with your current PSU the required system wattage, efficience wise, should idealy be a maximum of 450W~.

Which is btw. why proper builders will always suggest you "overkill" PSU's.

 

 

If you do indeed pick up a new PSU, I'd recommend you to get a 750W silver rated PSU. With that rating it will provide around 635W, with your system drawing around 550W, you would still almost always be in a very efficient curve for the PSU.

Obviously you could also get a 750w gold rated PSU, but that wont do any considerable difference and platinum rated would be just a waste of money for your machine.

Futureproof wise you'd be good with any of these, heck you'd even could use your current one as any reasonable consumer Intel CPU will barely even get close to 100W TPD and thats what you would be getting if you do upgrade.

 

Ofc you could juggle the numbers for the PSU's, here is a list of the efficiency ratings:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/80_Plus

its basicaly "listed wattage" times "rating %", and then you calculate if you would stay within the 50 - 80% area of the powersupplys provided wattage you intend to buy.

 

also:

http://www.coolermaster.com/power-supply-calculator/

this is a calculator where you can enter your system and it will tell you your approximate load wattage. Ignore the PSU suggestions though.

[Soularyem]

@Nord @samiscool51 @Quaker You're all 100% right.  I'm not pulling enough juice.  When I initially created the build, I saw that it came up to about 488 W on PCPartPicker.  The calculator shows I'm pulling in at least 594 and the graph shows it's just a bit over.  I'm going to have to get a new PSU.

 

Thank you all so much for your help.  This has been racking my brain for the past few weeks.  

[Quaker]

11 hours ago, Nord said:

Which is btw. why proper builders will always suggest you "overkill" PSU's.

I disagree. A "proper" builder is not going to recommend you spend extra on a power supply so that you can save $1 a year (or less) on electricity.

Even looking at your own graph, the difference in efficiency is only about 2%. That's not worth worrying about unless you have a large number of servers running 24/7.

[Nord]

Well each PSU has its unique curve, so you cant just look at one and say its not worth it. I just took the first fitting graph from google search that I saw.

 

Also its not 80$ that you will invest more, looking at BeQuiet PSU's a proper 500W PSU goes for 55€ and a 700W for 90€.

 

Furthermore elecricity prices differ, from country to country and even from region to region, so maybe other people would save more than you would.

Plus, its not only about the elecricity prices its about the efficiency of the PSU. If he gets a "on the edge" PSU again, like the one he is using currently, the same problem could easily appear again in some time, so might aswell make sure that does not happen and get more Watt than needed now.

IF I'am correct, and the issue is that the PSU just got old & weak(er), by just having a slightly overkill 700W PSU for example he would have allready saved w/e amount he has now to spend on a new PSU, since the issue he is currently having would have not even appeared in the first place.

 

Obviously its for the OP to decide what he is going to do, we just leave our advises

 

[Soularyem]

So, here's an update for those are still reading and are still willing to help out:

 

I got and installed a new power supply, which is a EVGA 750 GQ Gold.  After installing it, the "double staring" issue actually continued!

 

In addition to this, one of the issues from the beginning is that it also completely freezes up, in which CTRL+ALT+DEL doesn't work.  It usually happens when I'm gaming, as the GPU gets pretty hot (over 80 C while gaming).  But it froze last night while simply running the antivirus.

 

I'm under the impression at this point that either it's the video card, the motherboard or I'll need a much higher power supply, but I'm obviously no expert (as I said, this is my first build and I'm still learning).

 

Any other theories on what it could be would be very welcome and appreciated.

[Nord]

The new PSU you picked up is way more than you need, in fact it is esily enough so you could add a second 480 to your system and still have a fair amount of headroom left.

 

Now to figure out why it still does the double startup, you'd literally need to remove parts from the PC until it stops doing it..

Start with the RAM, just leave 1 stick in - then try the other stick only, after that remove all HDD's/SSD's apart of the system drive... after that remove the GPU and use the onboard one. Hell even try and remove the case fans (CPU also, as long as you have a heatsink, its still fine to run the CPU w/o a fan for a few minutes) and if all of this fails it is either the motherboard or the CPU, if you have spare for those somewhere, might aswell run tests there.

 

You could also try to reset your BIOS settings to default for the double restart issue.

Switch to a different AV is probably also a possible solution, if you say the PC freezes during a virus scan, its not unlikely the AV is crappy, which one are you using btw?

Further for the freezing problem, check if you have some log files from windows for why the PC crashed/froze. Bluescreen reader is probably the most userfriendly program to a.) find and b.) open said logs.

 

Edit:
Are you using any "emulation" software programs? Like Daemon Tools to simulate a CD-Drive for example? And if so is said "drive" simulated all the time?

I had daemon tools make my PC freeze with a soundloop some years back, was on windows XP, but  still it could be a possibility.

 

 

[Soularyem]

As a bit of a strange update, the freezing issue has been, as of now, fixed.  The strange part is I have no idea how or what happened between installing the new power supply to now.

 

Allow me to be more specific.  As I mentioned, I installed the new power supply Friday night and still had the issue.  It continued every day, Saturday morning, Sunday morning and Tuesday evening (I had it on all day Monday playing games, which is another issue).

 

Last night (Wednesday) upon getting home, I turned it on and waited as normal.  However, instead of getting a blank screen, it booted normally on the first try, without me having to hard reset it.  I've done absolutely nothing different since Friday.  As another test, I tried it tonight after work and school and it started up on the first try again.  I don't want to jinx it, but it looks like it corrected itself out of nowhere.  I'm a bit perplexed and a little nervous about it, but as the movie "Batteries Not Included" says "The quickest way to end a miracle is to ask it why it is... or what it wants.."

 

Again, thank you all again for all of your help ( @Nord, you've been amazingly helpful).

 

Now my next issue is to find out why it keeps freezing while gaming, but that will be another thread for another day....

 

*One note: I'm not going to mark this as solved just yet.  I want to give it a full week before I do.  It's only been 2 days.  Let's see what happens a week from now.