Rolling brownouts

[BiotechBen]

Hi guys, just easing my mind here:

A quality surge protector and high quality power supply will protect my PC from ghetto-fabulous electricity that's now having rolling brownouts right?

[Juular]

Provided that these brownouts don't have voltage surges, because these are different things - a surge protector or PSU quality have nothing to do with that. But getting a good surge protector is always a good idea, even if you already have a good PSU, maybe add a good UPS there too (which would actually help with brownouts). They all complement eachother. Surge protection is done by components with limited lifetime, so they lose their protecting ability the more surge energy they dissipate, so you can't really go overkill on that, because eventually they will all fail thus providing no protection.

[BiotechBen]

1 hour ago, Juular said:

Provided that these brownouts don't have voltage surges, because these are different things - a surge protector or PSU quality have nothing to do with that. But getting a good surge protector is always a good idea, even if you already have a good PSU, maybe add a good UPS there too (which would actually help with brownouts). They all complement eachother. Surge protection is done by components with limited lifetime, so they lose their protecting ability the more surge energy they dissipate, so you can't really go overkill on that, because eventually they will all fail thus providing no protection.

I know my SEASONIC FOCUS GM-550W has served me well in unstable power conditions conditioning power for my rig, and the surge protector is old but has never been tripped (had low draw things on it). So would the surge protector or the power delivery of the PSU help protect components from potential danger with the brownouts?

[mariushm]

A power supply only has enough reserves of energy to keep your computer powered for around 20-50ms without AC power from your wall. 

If the AC voltage is still above the minimum listed on the label, the power supply should still be functional and provide proper voltages. 

If the brownout is so severe you get much lower voltage, the psu may tolerate it if it's for a few seconds, and/or only if it's not used at near its maximum output. 

 

A surge protector will try to protect devices after it from big spikes in the power, but may not protect from brownouts in any way. To protect from long-ish periods of too low voltage / too high voltage, you want / need to use an UPS - the USP will detect these events and switch to powering the devices connected to it from the internal battery, through an inverter. 

 

 

[Juular]

2 hours ago, BiotechBen said:

So would the surge protector or the power delivery of the PSU help protect components from potential danger with the brownouts?

You don't understand what i'm saying. Surge protection and brownouts have nothing to do with each other. Brownout is the loss of energy supply, a surge protector or any PSU wouldn't help with that, you need a UPS which would supply the energy to your PC from discharging the internal accumulator battery. Voltage surges are well, voltage surges, instantanous high voltage spikes (transient conditions) in the mains, they can happen any time, either because of some fault in the energy system, possibly happening before or after brownout but not necessarily, or some imroperly designed equipment on the same line, or the worst case scenario - lightning strike. This is where surge protector, PSU and UPS, all three can help (well, aside of the lightning strike unless you have some industrial scale surge protector).

TLDR: No, surge protector or PSUs wouldn't help with brownouts.

[BiotechBen]

3 hours ago, Juular said:

You don't understand what i'm saying. Surge protection and brownouts have nothing to do with each other. Brownout is the loss of energy supply, a surge protector or any PSU wouldn't help with that, you need a UPS which would supply the energy to your PC from discharging the internal accumulator battery. Voltage surges are well, voltage surges, instantanous high voltage spikes (transient conditions) in the mains, they can happen any time, either because of some fault in the energy system, possibly happening before or after brownout but not necessarily, or some imroperly designed equipment on the same line, or the worst case scenario - lightning strike. This is where surge protector, PSU and UPS, all three can help (well, aside of the lightning strike unless you have some industrial scale surge protector).

TLDR: No, surge protector or PSUs wouldn't help with brownouts.

The mention of the PSU smoothing power in brownouts before was indirectly targeting the question of "can brownouts cause damage to my PSU, or are the internal power delivery systems in the PSU designed to help with providing stable power delivery to the computer?" In previous brownouts, the PSU in my system was able to continue providing sufficient power for there not to be a power loss. My guess for that is overspeced capacitors.

[BiotechBen]

Another thing to mention is these brownouts last for only 5-10 seconds. Just long enough for all the lights to go dark and tv to shut off and sometimes lose power to PC.

[mariushm]

41 minutes ago, BiotechBen said:

Another thing to mention is these brownouts last for only 5-10 seconds. Just long enough for all the lights to go dark and tv to shut off and sometimes lose power to PC.

Sounds like the perfect job for an UPS.

[Juular]

1 hour ago, BiotechBen said:

My guess for that is overspeced capacitors.

Kinda. High wattage PSU can provide power to the PC under load load for fraction of a second, but not 5-10 seconds. Like, lets say you're just browsing internet, so the total power draw of the whole PC would be like 75W, you got a 750W PSU. Most PSUs have hold-up time of 17ms under full load (i think it's a requirement in ATX spec), so at 75W load, that would be 170ms, i.e 0.17 seconds. If it's say 1.2kW, it's a robust unit and it has increased nominal hold up time of say 30ms, then that would be just about half a second of hold up time at 75W load, still, not something you can rely on. You need a UPS.

[IPD]

On 11/1/2021 at 3:01 AM, BiotechBen said:

I know my SEASONIC FOCUS GM-550W has served me well in unstable power conditions conditioning power for my rig, and the surge protector is old but has never been tripped (had low draw things on it). So would the surge protector or the power delivery of the PSU help protect components from potential danger with the brownouts?

Tripping is irrelevant.  All surge protectors will wear out over time.  And if they don't--they're dangerous and shouldn't be used.  Good surge protectors will brick themselves to prevent current pass-through when they reach EOL.

 

You want a UPS--as many above have stated.  Let the UPS deal with power interruption and spikes.  I trust quality control on the big 3 UPS makers more than I do on virtually any PSU brand.  Make it easy for the PSU and get a UPS.

[BiotechBen]

So it appears that the brownouts are not happening anymore. I have issued a work order to have it checked out. this building still has some ghetto-fabulousness to it, seeing as rearranging which outlets have power draw on them seems to have helped significantly. All outlets in the room are on the same circuit which makes me curious if the outlets are just poor quality (university run apt buildings).

[IPD]

All the more reason to guarantee smooth, uninterrupted power delivery to your PC via a UPS.

[BiotechBen]

Is it possible that the short brownouts we're caused by the solar flares that weekend? Solar flares can mess with voltages in weak power grids. (Located in Upstate Pennsylvania, in affected area)