What Ram Should I Get?

[rpalmz46]

Hello,

I was trying to figure out what speed of ram I should upgrade to, its come to my attention that I may be holding myself back in terms of some fps with how slow my memory is for how good the rest of my computer is. I was thinking of buying either some corsair 3200mhz or 3600mhz ram but wasn't for sure what was better as I'm not very experienced in ram speed or timings and knowing whats good. I also considered getting some steel viper 4000mhz ram I watched some videos comparing ram speeds with my CPU and it seems like it can be pretty significant fps gains for much faster ram in some more demanding titles not all. I seen as high as 40fps in some games, but either way if anyone has any recommendations for what set I should get I would appreciate the advice.

Thanks

 

 

 

Specs:

RTX 3080

I7-10700K

750W PSU

Ram 16GB 2400mhz with XMP

Asus TUF z390 Chipset

Hel

[CryingWimp]

The biggest thing that matters is having dual rank per channel. This is important on both AMD and Intel. Intel matters less about ram speed since there is no FCLK to consider like Ryzen. Performance does not scale linearly, so going above 3600cl16 will start having diminishing returns for a lot higher price.

 

8GB dims are almost always single rank, so the only way to get dual rank per channel is by getting 32GB of ram. Either 4x8GB or a quality 2x16GB kit. 16GB sticks are hit or miss on being dual rank, only the expensive kits are guaranteed dual rank, so the best option for most people is 4x8GB.

 

3200cl16 and 3600cl18 is what most people should buy, any less doesn't really save any money and is the bottom of the barrel bin, going over this starts getting expensive fast.

 

Speed and timings combined is what determines the performance of RAM. A 3600CL16 kit is great without getting into the crazy pricing of high binned kits, after this things get expensive.

[rpalmz46]

8 minutes ago, CryingWimp said:

The biggest thing that matters is having dual ranks per channel. This is important on both AMD and Intel. Intel matters less about ram speed since there is no FCLK to consider like Ryzen.

 

8GB dims are almost always single channel, so the only way to get dual ranks per channel is by getting 32GB of ram. Either 4x8GB or a quality 2x16GB kit. 16GB sticks are hit or miss on being dual rank, only the expensive kits are quarantined dual rank, so the best option for most people is 4x8GB.

 

3200cl16 and 3600cl18 is what most people should buy, any less doesn't really save any money and is the bottom of the barrel bin, going over this starts getting expensive fast.

 

Speed and timings combined is what determines the performance of RAM. A 3600CL16 kit is great without getting into the crazy pricing of high binned kits, after this things get expensive.

I thought that if you had two 8gb sticks of ram and had them slotted right they would run in dual channel this is what my ram speeds are at the moment and what

channel hwinfo says they are in.

 

 

 

[rpalmz46]

I was kind of wondering why it says my frequencies get slower as the list goes down but im sure there is a reason for that.

[GuiltySpark_]

2 minutes ago, rpalmz46 said:

I thought that if you had two 8gb sticks of ram and had them slotted right they would run in dual channel this is what my ram speeds are at the moment and what

channel hwinfo says they are in.

 

 

 

He's confusing the terms dual rank and dual channel. 

 

IMO don't overcomplicate this. Unless you're someone to tinker with your RAM for hours for fun, just get a 3200 CL14 or 3600 CL16 kit and call it a day.

 

The difference between the two in REAL world applications/games is going to be so minimal it's not worth your time.

[CryingWimp]

Dual channel and dual rank are different things.

 

Consumer CPUs have 2 memory channels, 2 physical links wired to the CPU. On 4 slot motherboards, 2 slots each are shared to each channel. This is why putting ram in the correct slots matters.

 

Ranks is how the ram stick itself arranges the memory chips on the stick. Depending on the type of chips it will group them together in 1 or 2 groups (for non server ram and non laptop ram). Having 2 groups (2 ranks) gives a latency advantage through a bunch of voodu magic way over my head 

 

You want to be using both channels of your MB  with 2 ranks per channel.

[rpalmz46]

I was thinking of getting either https://www.amazon.ca/Crucial-Ballistix-Desktop-Gaming-BL2K8G36C16U4B/dp/B083V93HJG/ref=sr_1_7?dchild=1&keywords=3600mhz+ram&qid=1626113638&sr=8-7 or https://www.amazon.ca/Corsair-CMK16GX4M2Z3600C18-PC4-28800-Desktop-Vengeance/dp/B07FBVYFKH/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=3600mhz+ram&qid=1626113638&sr=8-5. I think the crucial ballistix may be better though.

[rpalmz46]

2 minutes ago, CryingWimp said:

Dual channel and dual rank are different things.

 

Consumer CPUs have 2 memory channels, 2 physical links wired to the CPU. On 4 slot motherboards, 2 slots each are shared to each channel. This is why putting ram in the right slots matters.

 

Ranks is how the ram stick itself arranges the memory chips on the stick. Depending on the type of chips it will group them together in 1 or 2 groups (for non server ram). Having 2 groups, 2 ranks, gives a latency advantage through a bunch of voodu magic way over my head 

 

You want to be using both channels of your MB  with 2 ranks per channel.

Hmm okay well im probably going to just stick with buying a 2 stick 8gb each kit for the moment. Just as it is a bit simpler and will still be a decent upgrade i feel for my money.

[CryingWimp]

IMO - Just overclock your current ram. See how high you can go.

 

If your not getting 2 ranks per channel the difference will be tiny. The difference purely from MTs without any of the other benefits is maybe 3%.

Dual rank is closer to 10%.

 

Combined all the possible ways to maximize performance is closer to 15% in some scenarios.

[rpalmz46]

3 minutes ago, CryingWimp said:

IMO - Just overclock your current ram. See how high you can go.

 

If your not getting 2 ranks per channel the difference will be tiny.

When I had my previous motherboard msi had some onboard feature called memorytryit and i got it to go to like 3800mhz lol stable but asus doesnt have the same feature. Memory overclocking seems a bit annoying to me is the main reason I haven't tried it. I also don't really know how to manually do it.

[Downkey]

10 minutes ago, rpalmz46 said:

I was thinking of getting either https://www.amazon.ca/Crucial-Ballistix-Desktop-Gaming-BL2K8G36C16U4B/dp/B083V93HJG/ref=sr_1_7?dchild=1&keywords=3600mhz+ram&qid=1626113638&sr=8-7 or https://www.amazon.ca/Corsair-CMK16GX4M2Z3600C18-PC4-28800-Desktop-Vengeance/dp/B07FBVYFKH/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=3600mhz+ram&qid=1626113638&sr=8-5. I think the crucial ballistix may be better though.

Both kits are horribly overpriced. https://pcpartpicker.com/product/2TFKHx/crucial-ballistix-16-gb-2-x-8-gb-ddr4-3600-memory-bl2k8g36c16u4b

[rpalmz46]

Just now, Downkey said:

Both kits are horribly overpriced. https://pcpartpicker.com/product/2TFKHx/crucial-ballistix-16-gb-2-x-8-gb-ddr4-3600-memory-bl2k8g36c16u4b

Yeah im canadian so my prices are about 30% more roughly over US

 

 

[Downkey]

Just now, rpalmz46 said:

Yeah im canadian so my prices are about 30% more roughly over US

 

 

nvm i just saw that you are canadian lmao

But avoid that corsair kit, still horribly overpriced and will perform like a 3200 cl16 kit

[CryingWimp]

You'd probably have better performance getting another cheap 2x8gb cl15 and running all 4 sticks to take advantage of dual rank plus having 32GB total. There is a chance the kits won't like each other though and not play well together.

[rpalmz46]

Just now, CryingWimp said:

You'd probably have better performance getting another cheap 2x8gb cl15 and running all 4 sticks to take advantage of dual rank.

Do you happen to know of any videos showcasing the improvement of using dual rank setup vs not?

[CryingWimp]

Every YouTuber that did a video on memory, who also included Intel not just AMD, in the last 18 months. Most videos focus on AMD because of the FCLK.

Time stamped

[rpalmz46]

5 minutes ago, CryingWimp said:

Every YouTuber that did a video on memory, that also included Intel not just AMD, in the last 18 months.

I found this showcasing some seems like the difference can be negligible to around 5-10 fps over the 2x16gb kit.

 

That's on average some games have quite a bit of a difference.

 

 

[CryingWimp]

Getting the best ram generally is a terrible value/performance compared to getting a better CPU or GPU. For people who already own ram, they don't really need to worry about upgrading ram for performance.

 

However if buying new ram, I'm just saying prioritizing dual rank is more performance compared to just getting higher MTs. For latency, around 3200CL16 / 3600CL18 or equivalent is generally the sweet spot for price/performance.

 

2400MTs to 3600MTs will make a difference for sure, it just won't be as big as the benchmarks imply at first glance. We see the worst-best case scenario in most benchmarks having slow single rank kits with bad timings at the bottom and faster dual rank kits towards the top. There are many differences apart from just MTs from the bottom to the top of the benchmark charts.

 

 

If your ram was any faster I'd definitely recommend not spending money on ram, but since yours is only 2400MTs and you don't like overclocking, it will make a difference with your high end 3080/10700k system. IMO wait till you can do 4x8GB and get all the benefits though, you'll have 32GB of ram, dual rank, plus the extra MTs.

 

Buying 2x8 now and 2x8 in the future risk getting different memory chips that won't like each other. Even ordering 2 identical kits at the same time both can show up with different memory chips on the sticks. Many people take that risk without issue though.

[rpalmz46]

1 hour ago, CryingWimp said:

Getting the best ram generally is a terrible value/performance compared to getting a better CPU or GPU. For people who already own ram, they don't really need to worry about upgrading ram for performance.

 

However if buying new ram, I'm just saying prioritizing dual rank is more performance compared to just getting higher MTs. For latency, around 3200CL16 / 3600CL18 or equivalent is generally the sweet spot for price/performance.

 

2400MTs to 3600MTs will make a difference for sure, it just won't be as big as the benchmarks imply at first glance. We see the worst-best case scenario in most benchmarks having slow single rank kits with bad timings at the bottom and faster dual rank kits towards the top. There are many differences apart from just MTs from the bottom to the top of the benchmark charts.

 

 

If your ram was any faster I'd definitely recommend not spending money on ram, but since yours is only 2400MTs and you don't like overclocking, it will make a difference with your high end 3080/10700k system. IMO wait till you can do 4x8GB and get all the benefits though, you'll have 32GB of ram, dual rank, plus the extra MTs.

 

Buying 2x8 now and 2x8 in the future risk getting different memory chips that won't like each other. Even ordering 2 identical kits at the same time both can show up with different memory chips on the sticks. Many people take that risk without issue though.

If i was to buy 4x8gb sticks what one would you recommend?

[CryingWimp]

Personally I'd get 3600CL16, here in Canada it's the same price as 3600CL18 though.

 

Brand/RGB etc is all personal preference. I'd get which ever brand I like was the lowest price.

[freeagent]

31 minutes ago, rpalmz46 said:

If i was to buy 4x8gb sticks what one would you recommend?

G.Skill Trident Z 3200C14. If you ever get into over clocking they will run the speeds and timings you want.