7980xe phase change

[SirFlamenco]

Hi  

 

I am thinking about phase changing a cpu I might get in the future. It's a 7980xe and it's TDP haven't been announced. I spoke to somebody that used to have a phase change unit with a 5960x and he told me I might be disappointed because it's not designed to handle a big TDP. What would happen if the phase change was overloaded with heat? The guy says it would shutdown but I find that weird. BTW I will use this: http://www.ldcooling.com/shop/ld-pc-v2-115v-usa/192-ld-pc-v2-115v-phase-change-black-xl-suction.html

[FilipSebik]

1 hour ago, SirFlamenco said:

Hi  

 

I am thinking about phase changing a cpu I might get in the future. It's a 7980xe and it's TDP haven't been announced. I spoke to somebody that used to have a phase change unit with a 5960x and he told me I might be disappointed because it's not designed to handle a big TDP. What would happen if the phase change was overloaded with heat? The guy says it would shutdown but I find that weird. BTW I will use this: http://www.ldcooling.com/shop/ld-pc-v2-115v-usa/192-ld-pc-v2-115v-phase-change-black-xl-suction.html

I don't think you can overload phase change. The compressor may overheat and shut down.

Anyways, it would be not stupid idea with phase cooling but the hassle and BS with insulation is annoying. So go for it I can say.

[Electronics Wizardy]

That compressor doesn't show how much heat it can move, and a oced 18 core will probaby pump out 300-400+ watts depending on how crazy your feeling. You might not get as good temps as you may normally do with lower power chips. If you crazy you can get a bigger compressor and raditor and get it even better, but thats gonna be a lot of work.

 

Board might not be as happy lifetime wise pumping out all that power, but should be fine. Be sure to get a top tier board.

 

That compressor will put a lot of heat into your room. Like space heater running all the time hot, and will kill your powerbill if you leave it running.

 

Basically im assuming your doing this because you can, and not for performance. If you really want more performance just get a dual xeon system.

[jnkokseby]

The phase changer you linked claims to be able to cool up to 300w at -30C, as long as you don't go past 280w I would say you're fine.

[Technomancer__]

30 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

That compressor doesn't show how much heat it can move, and a oced 18 core will probaby pump out 300-400+ watts depending on how crazy your feeling. You might not get as good temps as you may normally do with lower power chips. If you crazy you can get a bigger compressor and raditor and get it even better, but thats gonna be a lot of work.

 

Board might not be as happy lifetime wise pumping out all that power, but should be fine. Be sure to get a top tier board.

 

That compressor will put a lot of heat into your room. Like space heater running all the time hot, and will kill your powerbill if you leave it running.

 

Basically im assuming your doing this because you can, and not for performance. If you really want more performance just get a dual xeon system.

It can handle 300w on -30

[SirFlamenco]

1 hour ago, FilipSebik said:

I don't think you can overload phase change. The compressor may overheat and shut down.

Anyways, it would be not stupid idea with phase cooling but the hassle and BS with insulation is annoying. So go for it I can say.

What would overheat mean? As long as it give me sub zero temps while overclocked, I will be happy. Also how could a compressor overheat if it's still really cold?

59 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

That compressor doesn't show how much heat it can move, and a oced 18 core will probaby pump out 300-400+ watts depending on how crazy your feeling. You might not get as good temps as you may normally do with lower power chips. If you crazy you can get a bigger compressor and raditor and get it even better, but thats gonna be a lot of work.

 

Board might not be as happy lifetime wise pumping out all that power, but should be fine. Be sure to get a top tier board.

 

That compressor will put a lot of heat into your room. Like space heater running all the time hot, and will kill your powerbill if you leave it running.

 

Basically im assuming your doing this because you can, and not for performance. If you really want more performance just get a dual xeon system.

Yea I plan on having the Gigabyte SOC equivalent of x299 (the x99 had a huge amount of space around the socket especially for extreme cooling solutions). Though to return to my question, do you have any idea of what would happen if a compressor would be overloaded?

43 minutes ago, jnkokseby said:

The phase changer you linked claims to be able to cool up to 300w at -30C, as long as you don't go past 280w I would say you're fine.

AH! 280w for a 18 cores i9 overclocked to the sky with a crazy lot of voltage. I am expecting AT LEAST 400w.

28 minutes ago, Ethocreeper said:

It can handle 300w on -30

Yea I know this already, but what about something like 500w?

[Technomancer__]

1 minute ago, SirFlamenco said:

 

Yea I know this already, but what about something like 500w?

Should be fine

[0ld_Chicken]

of course you can overload a phase change unit.  They are designed to handle a certain amount of load and beyond that temps will start suffering and you may shorten the units lifetime.  It's like leaving the windows open while the AC is on, it can't keep up and its going to get hot.

Temps are going to go way up if you're overloading it, eventually the compressor will probably shut off due to high pressure or temperature lockouts on the high side.  If you'll get -30c at 300w at 500w you might be lucky to get 0c.  Thats just my guess but at a certain point you won't even be cold enough to really make a big difference in clock speeds.

 

You'd probably be best off trying to find a larger unit or find someone who can custom make one for your specific needs

[SirFlamenco]

54 minutes ago, 0ld_Chicken said:

of course you can overload a phase change unit.  They are designed to handle a certain amount of load and beyond that temps will start suffering and you may shorten the units lifetime.  It's like leaving the windows open while the AC is on, it can't keep up and its going to get hot.

Temps are going to go way up if you're overloading it, eventually the compressor will probably shut off due to high pressure or temperature lockouts on the high side.  If you'll get -30c at 300w at 500w you might be lucky to get 0c.  Thats just my guess but at a certain point you won't even be cold enough to really make a big difference in clock speeds.

 

You'd probably be best off trying to find a larger unit or find someone who can custom make one for your specific needs

Damn you're helpful, but yea you are right I guess.. I want this unit to last me AT LEAST 5 years considering it's 1500$ CAD. Temps don't really matter, as long as I get my overclock done. Now, if it struggles AT STOCK, that's a total different pair of shoes. If the guy that actually had it is saying it's more for 115x series and he is right, then I should probably find someone who could do a cascade for me. Even that would be a struggle though, because it would need to be a canadian in order to avoid exorbitant shipping and borderline r*** import charges, plus the high risk of something breaking and then the dude would "accidentally" forget my phone number (Ah). I think the only thing that is still viable for 24/7 sub zero cooling would be to get a larger unit, as you said. Though I can't seem to find any other phase change retailers, let alone one that sells better units then the Little devil which is already a beast. I also tried ebay, but the only phase change cooler available right now is on ebay.uk and it's pickup only. Have any idea of what I could do and/or phase change retailers? I don't want toxic gazes in my appartement too, so modifying an AC is a big NO-NO.

[0ld_Chicken]

9 hours ago, SirFlamenco said:

Damn you're helpful, but yea you are right I guess.. I want this unit to last me AT LEAST 5 years considering it's 1500$ CAD. Temps don't really matter, as long as I get my overclock done. Now, if it struggles AT STOCK, that's a total different pair of shoes. If the guy that actually had it is saying it's more for 115x series and he is right, then I should probably find someone who could do a cascade for me. Even that would be a struggle though, because it would need to be a canadian in order to avoid exorbitant shipping and borderline r*** import charges, plus the high risk of something breaking and then the dude would "accidentally" forget my phone number (Ah). I think the only thing that is still viable for 24/7 sub zero cooling would be to get a larger unit, as you said. Though I can't seem to find any other phase change retailers, let alone one that sells better units then the Little devil which is already a beast. I also tried ebay, but the only phase change cooler available right now is on ebay.uk and it's pickup only. Have any idea of what I could do and/or phase change retailers? I don't want toxic gazes in my appartement too, so modifying an AC is a big NO-NO.

As far as I can tell phase is dying out but I don't follow it that closely.  Seems like everyone uses dice or ln2 cause it's colder/cheaper and you really don't need to be using it longer than a few hours a session anyways.  Custom built cascade units would be absurdly expensive I think and probably not the easiest thing to use if you don't know what you're doing with hvac systems.

 

Modifying your own is a lot of work and requires a lot of special tools/equipment which would easily double your costs.  I've been kinda wanting to get into it myself since I am an HVAC technician and have all these tools at my disposal, but I just don't have enough free time atm.  I currently have a pile of working components (both PC and HVAC) but we'll see when I get around to it.  I may just buy a pot and dump some dice in there and call it a day cause it would be SO much easier i think.  

 

Maybe @Jumper118 can put me in my place and tell you what you need to know though since he's actually into phase

[Jumper118]

17 hours ago, SirFlamenco said:

Hi  

 

I am thinking about phase changing a cpu I might get in the future. It's a 7980xe and it's TDP haven't been announced. I spoke to somebody that used to have a phase change unit with a 5960x and he told me I might be disappointed because it's not designed to handle a big TDP. What would happen if the phase change was overloaded with heat? The guy says it would shutdown but I find that weird. BTW I will use this: http://www.ldcooling.com/shop/ld-pc-v2-115v-usa/192-ld-pc-v2-115v-phase-change-black-xl-suction.html

you are going to need a rotory single stage that is at least 1hp or probably 1.5hp to keep a cpu with that many cores in check.. it doesnt matter what the stock tdp of the cpu is at all cos you arent going to run an unlocked chip under phase at stock speed anyway. yes it will shut off it it overheats, but it could also blow up or leak really hot or really cold gas all over so you dont want to overload it  

[SirFlamenco]

2 hours ago, 0ld_Chicken said:

As far as I can tell phase is dying out but I don't follow it that closely.  Seems like everyone uses dice or ln2 cause it's colder/cheaper and you really don't need to be using it longer than a few hours a session anyways.  Custom built cascade units would be absurdly expensive I think and probably not the easiest thing to use if you don't know what you're doing with hvac systems.

 

Modifying your own is a lot of work and requires a lot of special tools/equipment which would easily double your costs.  I've been kinda wanting to get into it myself since I am an HVAC technician and have all these tools at my disposal, but I just don't have enough free time atm.  I currently have a pile of working components (both PC and HVAC) but we'll see when I get around to it.  I may just buy a pot and dump some dice in there and call it a day cause it would be SO much easier i think.  

 

Maybe @Jumper118 can put me in my place and tell you what you need to know though since he's actually into phase

Yea but I want 24/7 overclock and dice ain't gonna do this. This is the most extreme cooling solution as far as day to day go. Do you know how much as cascade unit would cost?

2 hours ago, Jumper118 said:

you are going to need a rotory single stage that is at least 1hp or probably 1.5hp to keep a cpu with that many cores in check.. it doesnt matter what the stock tdp of the cpu is at all cos you arent going to run an unlocked chip under phase at stock speed anyway. yes it will shut off it it overheats, but it could also blow up or leak really hot or really cold gas all over so you dont want to overload it  

Would this work? http://londongrow.com/shop/hc-1000a-water-chiller/ I get this is a chiller, but should it be able to cool the cpu much better than the Little Devil? It's 1 hp and have a cooling capacity of 1650w minus the power consumption it's actually 1100w. Also I know I need to buy a watercooling parts such as cpu and reservoir. 

[Jumper118]

4 minutes ago, SirFlamenco said:

Yea but I want 24/7 overclock and dice ain't gonna do this. This is the most extreme cooling solution as far as day to day go. Do you know how much as cascade unit would cost?

Would this work? http://londongrow.com/shop/hc-1000a-water-chiller/ I get this is a chiller, but should it be able to cool the cpu much better than the Little Devil? It's 1 hp and have a cooling capacity of 1650w minus the power consumption it's actually 1100w. Also I know I need to buy a watercooling parts such as cpu and reservoir. 

cascade is normally double or more the price cos you have 2x or 3x of every part.

 

a water chiller will keep the cpu as close to ambient temps as possible but its not going to get you sub zero at all, so you wont get anywhere near the same cold scaling.  

[SirFlamenco]

21 minutes ago, Jumper118 said:

cascade is normally double or more the price cos you have 2x or 3x of every part.

 

a water chiller will keep the cpu as close to ambient temps as possible but its not going to get you sub zero at all, so you wont get anywhere near the same cold scaling.  

I have a budget of 1,5k, should it be enough? 

 

Also for the chiller would it be more like a) it could cool the cpu even overclocked to the sky while not being able to go under ambient because of physics OR b) it would cool only a little bit better than a good watercooling setup while having a huge waste of potential seeing how much watts it can dissipate. 

[Jumper118]

Just now, SirFlamenco said:

I have a budget of 1,5k, should it be enough? 

 

Also for the chiller would it be more like it could cool the cpu even overclocked to the sky while not being able to go under ambient because of physics OR it would cool only a little bit better than a good watercooling setup while having a huge waste of potential seeing how much watts it can dissipate. 

noraml water it will run 40-50c max with a big rad. with a chiller the best you are going to get is 20-30c under load. with phase it should be below 0 all the time. 

[SirFlamenco]

8 minutes ago, Jumper118 said:

noraml water it will run 40-50c max with a big rad. with a chiller the best you are going to get is 20-30c under load. with phase it should be below 0 all the time. 

It's fine I know this already but would it be more a) or b)

[Jumper118]

1 minute ago, SirFlamenco said:

It's fine I know this already but would it be more a) or b)

b 

[SirFlamenco]

1 minute ago, Jumper118 said:

b 

Have any explanations on why this would happen?

[Jumper118]

Just now, SirFlamenco said:

Have any explanations on why this would happen?

well if you have enough rads on a normal loop then you could get almost ambient temps, it would just take up way more space.