Windows and Linux <--> SSD + HDDs

[KCmetro]

I'm going to run Windows 10 Pro (games) and Linux (everything else) on a new computer.

 

1x512GB M.2 SSD

2x3TB WD Red HDDs RAID 0

 

(actually only 1 red right now... going to get a 2nd tonight, possibly swap it out and go for 2x4TB instead, not sure yet).

 

How would you recommend divvying up the systems (games, apps, storage) on those drives?

[fjdhdhcyfhf]

5 minutes ago, KCmetro said:

I'm going to run Windows 10 Pro (games) and Linux (everything else) on a new computer.

 

1x512GB M.2 SSD

2x3TB WD Red HDDs RAID 0

 

(actually only 1 red right now... going to get a 2nd tonight, possibly swap it out and go for 2x4TB instead, not sure yet).

 

How would you recommend divvying up the systems (games, apps, storage) on those drives?

depends if you are installing steam on linux. Steam on linux needs at least 200GB. Without steam you can get away with 128GB, or if its just for web browsing 16GB

[vorticalbox]

4 minutes ago, KCmetro said:

I'm going to run Windows 10 Pro (games) and Linux (everything else) on a new computer.

 

1x512GB M.2 SSD

2x3TB WD Red HDDs RAID 0

 

(actually only 1 red right now... going to get a 2nd tonight, possibly swap it out and go for 2x4TB instead, not sure yet).

 

How would you recommend divvying up the systems (games, apps, storage) on those drives?

I would half the ssd first partition windows the second Linux then just use the raid for storage of stuffs. Probably could just give Linux 64gb and the rest for windows and games.

 

only problem I see is getting a file format for the second drives that both windows and Linux will read, Linux can read ntfs but I know it can sometime throw errors about windows not being shutdown correctly and this unable to read the drive.

[KCmetro]

1 minute ago, SCHISCHKA said:

depends if you are installing steam on linux. Steam on linux needs at least 200GB. Without steam you can get away with 128GB, or if its just for web browsing 16GB

I'm gaming on Windows... didn't even think about gaming on Linux, interesting thought though. Which is better for gaming? Any games only available on one and not the other?

[vorticalbox]

Just now, KCmetro said:

I'm gaming on Windows... didn't even think about gaming on Linux, interesting thought though. Which is better for gaming? Any games only available on one and not the other?

Windows is better for gaming more supported games and better drivers though with the way windows is going, privacy and all I could see there being a flip in the market and Linux being the go to.

[tlink]

Just now, KCmetro said:

I'm gaming on Windows... didn't even think about gaming on Linux, interesting thought though. Which is better for gaming? Any games only available on one and not the other?

windows is generally better for gaming, but linux is supported by like 85% of my steam games list, mostly AAA's don't support it. personally i would game on linux where i can.

[KCmetro]

1 minute ago, vorticalbox said:

I would half the ssd first partition windows the second Linux then just use the raid for storage of stuffs. Probably could just give Linux 64gb and the rest for windows and games.

 

only problem I see is getting a file format for the second drives that both windows and Linux will read, Linux can read ntfs but I know it can sometime throw errors about windows not being shutdown correctly and this unable to read the drive.

On a past computer I figured out how to swap the main OS drive to actually "lead" things with Linux instead of Windows, I think I just swapped numbers/order in a config setting or something but that's not really a big deal.

 

So basically you're saying...

SSD:

~250GB Windows

~250GB Linux

HDD:

All storage

 

I'm wondering if I should put most of the SSD on Windows if games eat up a lot of space. I was originally going to get ~250GB SSD but decided to up it to the 512GB after realizing games eat up a lot of space.

 

I don't know at the moment how much gaming will be on the Linux side, but originally I didn't there would be any, as I thought *nix is mostly ideal (at least from my past uses) for non-gaming stuff, basically everything but gaming.

 

Can I use TLER with RAID 0?

 

[KCmetro]

5 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

only problem I see is getting a file format for the second drives that both windows and Linux will read, Linux can read ntfs but I know it can sometime throw errors about windows not being shutdown correctly and this unable to read the drive.

I forgot what I did before... maybe XFS? I'll have to consider the options.

[fjdhdhcyfhf]

2 minutes ago, KCmetro said:

I'm gaming on Windows... didn't even think about gaming on Linux, interesting thought though. Which is better for gaming? Any games only available on one and not the other?

go to steam and theres a search filter for linux games. I mostly play CSGO and total war. Linux is better because you have a better filesystem and a cleaner un-bloated customisable OS. Dying light is the most newest game that I have. I want to get mad max but I'm waiting for price drop.

 

If you list the applications you use on linux i could check on my system and give you an estimate.

[KCmetro]

5 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

Windows is better for gaming more supported games and better drivers though with the way windows is going, privacy and all I could see there being a flip in the market and Linux being the go to.

What's the deal with that anyway (windows & privacy)?

5 minutes ago, tlink said:

windows is generally better for gaming, but linux is supported by like 85% of my steam games list, mostly AAA's don't support it. personally i would game on linux where i can.

Okay this is making my decision more difficult. lol  

I have 512GB SSD & either 6TB or 8TB HDD RAID 0....

just looking at the 2 types...

only put the systems on the SSD?

and only store stuff on the HDDs?

What (beyond the systems) would be best on the SSD?

If systems are going on the SSD + games/apps/main non-storage stuff, that would be 3 general parts.

Is a half-and-half approach ideal or go heavy with one OS?

[fjdhdhcyfhf]

3 minutes ago, KCmetro said:

I forgot what I did before... maybe XFS? I'll have to consider the options.

Yea Windows is a dick on filesystem support. Iv had no problems with FAT or NTFS. NTFS just has problems when windows does not unmount properly but its just flag that you can overwrite in linux anyway

[vorticalbox]

2 minutes ago, KCmetro said:

What's the deal with that anyway (windows & privacy)?

Okay this is making my decision more difficult. lol  

I have 512GB SSD & either 6TB or 8TB HDD RAID 0....

just looking at the 2 types...

only put the systems on the SSD?

and only store stuff on the HDDs?

What (beyond the systems) would be best on the SSD?

If systems are going on the SSD + games/apps/main non-storage stuff, that would be 3 general parts.

Is a half-and-half approach ideal or go heavy with one OS?

microsoft is being awesome and a shit bad at the same time. Like forcing updates, monitoring users, though that up for debate and what finally made me move to Linux fulltime the silent install off applications without user consent. Then on the flip supporting Linux, moving towards a more open source software.

 

Seems Microsoft is in a bit of turmoil just now, I now run windows in a VM and do everything else in Linux. I don't pc game other than a hand full of games that also have Linux support like euro truck and dungeon defenders.

[KCmetro]

4 minutes ago, SCHISCHKA said:

go to steam and theres a search filter for linux games. I mostly play CSGO and total war. Linux is better because you have a better filesystem and a cleaner un-bloated customisable OS. Dying light is the most newest game that I have. I want to get mad max but I'm waiting for price drop.

 

If you list the applications you use on linux i could check on my system and give you an estimate.

The #1 motivator for finally building a new computer was discovering the still-not-released but seems-to-be-worth-it Star Citizen. I think it's non-Steam (?) and currently only Windows but possibly Linux in future after official release. (?)

 

However, I am building the computer for more than just gaming. It'll be a lightweight non-dedicated server (linux side) when not running games.

 

As for games, I honestly have nooooo idea what cool games are out there right now, I've been googling stuff, but don't know where to start as far as windows vs linux games. The computer will probably be pretty empty at first, until I start to really discover some great games. It has some kick to it for solid gaming, so I don't want to hold back when it comes to picking the games that are the most demanding of hardware (for the sake of quality of course lol). But I also enjoy the simple non-fancy games.

 

The server side of things, the computer will run that whenever I'm not sitting at it playing games, but that factors into how I might divvy things up. Or maybe not, if games will also go on linux. I think the HDDs are the main thing for either gaming or light server purposes (I still need to get backup setup but that'll have to wait).

 

 

[fjdhdhcyfhf]

3 minutes ago, KCmetro said:

The #1 motivator for finally building a new computer was discovering the still-not-released but seems-to-be-worth-it Star Citizen. I think it's non-Steam (?) and currently only Windows but possibly Linux in future after official release. (?)

 

However, I am building the computer for more than just gaming. It'll be a lightweight non-dedicated server (linux side) when not running games.

 

As for games, I honestly have nooooo idea what cool games are out there right now, I've been googling stuff, but don't know where to start as far as windows vs linux games. The computer will probably be pretty empty at first, until I start to really discover some great games. It has some kick to it for solid gaming, so I don't want to hold back when it comes to picking the games that are the most demanding of hardware (for the sake of quality of course lol). But I also enjoy the simple non-fancy games.

 

The server side of things, the computer will run that whenever I'm not sitting at it playing games, but that factors into how I might divvy things up. Or maybe not, if games will also go on linux. I think the HDDs are the main thing for either gaming or light server purposes (I still need to get backup setup but that'll have to wait).

 

 

thats not really a list of software I can work with. You might want to get a seperate drive or put your partitions with empty/unused space to grow into

[KCmetro]

10 minutes ago, SCHISCHKA said:

Yea Windows is a dick on filesystem support. Iv had no problems with FAT or NTFS. NTFS just has problems when windows does not unmount properly but its just flag that you can overwrite in linux anyway

I thought I used XFS on the old RAID setup on the past computer and did read/write with both Windows and Linux, but a quick google shows that Windows doesn't read XFS. Weird. Maybe I used another fs type. So I guess NTFS is the way then... well hmm, then again, I could partition the HDDs (hoping that's okay in a RAID0 setup) and put some of it into NTFS (for both systems) and some of it into LVM/etc. (for just linux).

6 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

microsoft is being awesome and a shit bad at the same time. Like forcing updates, monitoring users, though that up for debate and what finally made me move to Linux fulltime the silent install off applications without user consent. Then on the flip supporting Linux, moving towards a more open source software.

 

Seems Microsoft is in a bit of turmoil just now, I now run windows in a VM and do everything else in Linux. I don't pc game other than a hand full of games that also have Linux support like euro truck and dungeon defenders.

That's right, I remember now, there has been news about the privacy/monitoring issues with Windows 10. I guess I'll stick to something like Kali for that, although I haven't decided yet on which linux to run (as the main system next to windows). I will definitely run VMs on the linux side, lots of VMs, but they won't be windows, all linux. The only reason I'm getting Windows is for the Windows-only games.

[KCmetro]

8 minutes ago, SCHISCHKA said:

thats not really a list of software I can work with. You might want to get a seperate drive or put your partitions with empty/unused space to grow into

That's an interesting thought, starting with unused space and expanding later, I have a tendency to just reserve all of it from day one though. I don't have a list of software. 

 

Just the essentials:

Windows = 10GB or 20GB, just the installation, right?

It'd need some room to work with, not sure how much is needed for Steam on it.

Linux = 128GB or much less, or like you mentioned 200GB+ with Steam on it.

Games, apps, main content on the SSD = (?) GB.

Everything else going onto storage, what I might do if possible is move things back and forth that won't be as actively used, which might mean keeping X-amount available for that.

 

On Windows, I will not install anything except games and maybe some essentials, but it's all about gaming.

On Linux, virtualization server content.

 

This is a tough one, because I don't know what exactly I'm going to put on it.

 

[fjdhdhcyfhf]

200GB for games. Windows and Ubuntu are around 16GB. Linux virtual machines are <1GB without XServer or apps.

Easier to get a second SSD.

[KCmetro]

A 2nd SSD and RAID the two?

 

I'm getting ready to drop $ on extra HDDs for that RAID... possibly a total of 4 HDDs for RAID10, but that's going against my original intention of keeping the cost down.

 

...wait... I don't think I can use a 2nd SSD (at least not the M.2 variety) with that motherboard.

 

[vorticalbox]

1 hour ago, KCmetro said:

A 2nd SSD and RAID the two?

 

I'm getting ready to drop $ on extra HDDs for that RAID... possibly a total of 4 HDDs for RAID10, but that's going against my original intention of keeping the cost down.

 

...wait... I don't think I can use a 2nd SSD (at least not the M.2 variety) with that motherboard.

 

why not just run windows and then run all your Linux in vms? You said you weren't gaming (maybe) on Linux and any game that is on Linux will most certainly have a windows client.

[KCmetro]

40 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

why not just run windows and then run all your Linux in vms? You said you weren't gaming (maybe) on Linux and any game that is on Linux will most certainly have a windows client.

I want the server side of things to have full control over the hardware. Yep, gaming on Windows, and I guess I can on Linux too (I didn't know that was really a viable option). I'm interested in some basic games but the computer is really intended for the high quality games, which I've understood to be better played on Windows, but I'm curious about what's out there for Linux. In any case, the primary purpose of each system will be Windows=gaming & Linux=server (while linux will also be normal computing). Well, technically both systems will be normal computing, but only incidental in Windows while that's almost-only gaming. lol

[vorticalbox]

4 hours ago, KCmetro said:

I want the server side of things to have full control over the hardware. Yep, gaming on Windows, and I guess I can on Linux too (I didn't know that was really a viable option). I'm interested in some basic games but the computer is really intended for the high quality games, which I've understood to be better played on Windows, but I'm curious about what's out there for Linux. In any case, the primary purpose of each system will be Windows=gaming & Linux=server (while linux will also be normal computing). Well, technically both systems will be normal computing, but only incidental in Windows while that's almost-only gaming. lol

what can a Linux server do that a windows one couldn't? The reason I keep asking is unless you have one critical task that can only be done on Linux them its just a waste to partition up like that.

 

Not to mention you would have to restart putting more "wear" on your hardware.

[KCmetro]

3 hours ago, vorticalbox said:

what can a Linux server do that a windows one couldn't? The reason I keep asking is unless you have one critical task that can only be done on Linux them its just a waste to partition up like that.

 

Not to mention you would have to restart putting more "wear" on your hardware.

The answer is simple:

 

Preference.

 

I've considered VMs but haven't given much thought to running Windows VM inside Linux.

 

Edit -

 

Some thoughts...

 

Windows main with Linux VM:

I don't want to do this. The primary Linux install will be a virtualization host server. However, running a Linux VM inside Windows main is fine but only for temporary uses.

 

Linux main with Windows VM:

I would need to consider this option. If I can still fully optimize my hardware with a Windows VM, notably for gaming, then I might run Linux as the main 100% of the time, and just boot up a Windows VM inside it when gaming.

 

Alternating Linux and Windows as mains:

I at least know that, this way, I am guaranteed 100% full utilization of all resources - with the obvious exception of the shared SSD/HDD space - when gaming in Windows and when doing all other tasks in Linux.

 

I'm not really a fan of multi-booting. It's a thing of yesterday, with VMs serving their purpose. I need to find out if I can fully maximize my hardware with Windows games - the highest quality ones - if running Windows as VM inside Linux.

 

Otherwise, this is basically what I'm looking at, but I'm open to other options:

 

Linux: server with about a dozen VMs running as part of a self-contained IaaS. General computing. Everything will be done on the Linux side except gaming. ...unless the games I want to run work in Linux, then they'll go there. However, I know that at least some of them require Windows, so...

 

Windows: gaming.

 

[takethispie]

On 01/12/2016 at 0:20 AM, SCHISCHKA said:

depends if you are installing steam on linux. Steam on linux needs at least 200GB. Without steam you can get away with 128GB, or if its just for web browsing 16GB

there is no minimum storage size required by steam, I don't know where you got that.

[fjdhdhcyfhf]

1 minute ago, takethispie said:

there is no minimum storage size required by steam, I don't know where you got that.

i base it off the steamOS requirements and my own game library, which does not have a lot of games but is currently occupying 1/2 a 240GB SSD

http://store.steampowered.com/steamos/buildyourown

[takethispie]

42 minutes ago, SCHISCHKA said:

i base it off the steamOS requirements and my own game library, which does not have a lot of games but is currently occupying 1/2 a 240GB SSD

http://store.steampowered.com/steamos/buildyourown

steamOs is only one linux distro among a hundred (and not a good one IMO) so the storage requirement is only for it, steam on linux doesn't need 200GB