24-bit/192kHz ?

[dklhs90]

So, Hello audio people.

 

I was a little confused as to where to put my topic but I decided to put it in the audio section as it is ultimately audio related.

 

I did use the search and could not find anything on this topic.

 

As you may or may not know, some new flagship smartphones have come out with 24-bit 192kHz support for audio.

 

I was interested in this and wanted to ask if this is anything useful for the audiophiles.

 

Before making the thread I did some reading and there are split articles about how this is not helpful and some articles saying this is a very good feature.

 

Is 24-bit music significantly better than the regular 16-bit music? In theory it should right or not?

 

Also, it seems like 24-bit music are very hard to find.

 

Lots of articles seem to say that 16-bit is good enough for the human ear though...

 

Thanks 

[MayflowerElectronics]

No, 24/192k is total overkill. It's just a spec they can mark up to make themselves look good.

Anything above 48k is unnecessary as the human ear can't even pick it up (I can't hear past 19k) and like you said, most music is 16 bit.

[dklhs90]

No, 24/192k is total overkill. It's just a spec they can mark up to make themselves look good.

Anything above 48k is unnecessary as the human ear can't even pick it up (I can't hear past 19k) and like you said, most music is 16 bit.

Thanks. I guess I will continue to collect regular 16-bit quality music. probably .flac ones since it is better than the regular .mp3

[ploid]

Pretty much all music is either 16bit 44.1kHz or 16 bit 48kHz. Only reason to have higher quality really is if you are producing music.

[Emperor_Piehead]

Thanks. I guess I will continue to collect regular 16-bit quality music. probably .flac ones since it is better than the regular .mp3

Just watch out how much storage you have because if you put .flac on your phone you will blow through storage fast. My .flac files on my pc are about 30mb each. I would say just get some 320 kbps AAC/ LC files for your phone that is about a 1/3 of the file size and as far as I know the closest sounding file to .flac without the huge file.

[dklhs90]

Just watch out how much storage you have because if you put .flac on your phone you will blow through storage fast. My .flac files on my pc are about 30mb each. I would say just get some 320 kbps AAC/ LC files for your phone that is about a 1/3 of the file size and as far as I know the closest sounding file to .flac without the huge file.

thanks for the concern. my Galaxy Note 3 has expandable storage

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[h264]

More headroom. Bout it. What you really want on a cellphone's amp is a low output impedance and a very quiet noise and crosstalk level. Too bad they don't advertise that.

[dklhs90]

More headroom. Bout it. What you really want on a cellphone's amp is a low output impedance and a very quiet noise and crosstalk level. Too bad they don't advertise that.

yes. I always use my fiio E11 with my beyerdynamic DT990.

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[tycheleto]

As is usual with audio, they market it with whatever looks good, and not with what has a real impact. The rest of the audio quality of the phone is so low that really it doesn't make it a difference.

It could make a difference for high end Hi-Fi setups, but those are generally in the $10,000+ range before this becomes a factor.

[dklhs90]

As is usual with audio, they market it with whatever looks good, and not with what has a real impact. The rest of the audio quality of the phone is so low that really it doesn't make it a difference.

It could make a difference for high end Hi-Fi setups, but those are generally in the $10,000+ range before this becomes a factor.

I see. Any protable media player shouldnt be worried about greater than 16bit.

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[dklhs90]

As is usual with audio, they market it with whatever looks good, and not with what has a real impact. The rest of the audio quality of the phone is so low that really it doesn't make it a difference.

It could make a difference for high end Hi-Fi setups, but those are generally in the $10,000+ range before this becomes a factor.

Oh wait one more question. Do .flac make a difference in portable media players? or is .flac overrated on portable media players as well?

[tycheleto]

I see. Any protable media player shouldnt be worried about greater than 16bit.

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Well maybe if you have a really high end portable media player(Astell and Kern anyone?) and a high end amp on top of that(Ray Samuels Audio or even higher end) and really high end headphones(Sennheiser HD800?) you might be able to tell the difference, but I don't think it's relevant to phones for a while.

Oh wait one more question. Do .flac make a difference in portable media players? or is .flac overrated on portable media players as well?

This one is a bit subjective, and comes down to whether you can hear a difference. I personally think that 320kbps formats are sufficient for most phones, but some people can tell the difference between flac and that. Your DT990 is good, but without an external dac/amp I doubt the internal audio in the galaxy note is all that amazing, so the difference will be minor.

Ultimately the idea is to have a balanced system whereby you don't match one very expensive thing with one very cheap thing. A sound system will only sound as good as it's worst part. When it comes to formats, see if you can tell the difference, and find the right balance of quality and file size that works for you. I use 256kbps on my phone and it's still 20GB of stuff, going to flac is just impossible

[dklhs90]

Well maybe if you have a really high end portable media player(Astell and Kern anyone?) and a high end amp on top of that(Ray Samuels Audio or even higher end) and really high end headphones(Sennheiser HD800?) you might be able to tell the difference, but I don't think it's relevant to phones for a while.

This one is a bit subjective, and comes down to whether you can hear a difference. I personally think that 320kbps formats are sufficient for most phones, but some people can tell the difference between flac and that. Your DT990 is good, but without an external dac/amp I doubt the internal audio in the galaxy note is all that amazing, so the difference will be minor.

Ultimately the idea is to have a balanced system whereby you don't match one very expensive thing with one very cheap thing. A sound system will only sound as good as it's worst part. When it comes to formats, see if you can tell the difference, and find the right balance of quality and file size that works for you. I use 256kbps on my phone and it's still 20GB of stuff, going to flac is just impossible

I see. Thanks for the info. As for having an external amp, will the phone bypass the internal crappy amp and use the external amp or will it go through both crappy then the external amp?

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[tycheleto]

I see. Thanks for the info. As for having an external amp, will the phone bypass the internal crappy amp and use the external amp or will it go through both crappy then the external amp?

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If it is connected from the headphone jack, it will be using both the internal amp and the external amp. Only way to bypass as far as I know is to take a digital out from the microusb port and have an external dac+amp, but even then Samsung still gives digital volume control when using digital out. Always annoyed me as I could not figure out what is the original volume.

At the end of the day, Samsung's audio implementation just isn't as good as what I've seen from Apple, where once you can even bypass most of the internal amp without having an external dac.

[dklhs90]

If it is connected from the headphone jack, it will be using both the internal amp and the external amp. Only way to bypass as far as I know is to take a digital out from the microusb port and have an external dac+amp, but even then Samsung still gives digital volume control when using digital out. Always annoyed me as I could not figure out what is the original volume.

At the end of the day, Samsung's audio implementation just isn't as good as what I've seen from Apple, where once you can even bypass most of the internal amp without having an external dac.

I used to have an iPod touch where I could connect my external amp through the 30pin connector but I got rid of the iPod because I got tired of carrying around many devices. I guess i need to find a way to get an amp the can bypass the onboard amp. it will be hard because my phone uses a USB 3.0 connector...

[tycheleto]

I used to have an iPod touch where I could connect my external amp through the 30pin connector but I got rid of the iPod because I got tired of carrying around many devices. I guess i need to find a way to get an amp the can bypass the onboard amp. it will be hard because my phone uses a USB 3.0 connector...

I still keep my old iPhone 3GS/iPod touch around for music only.

The micro usb3.0 is backwards compatible with usb 2.0 apparently(just use one half of the connector). Alternatively, most usb dacs will require you to connect a usb otg cable to the phone, and then have a standard usb cable connected to that.

[dklhs90]

I still keep my old iPhone 3GS/iPod touch around for music only.

The micro usb3.0 is backwards compatible with usb 2.0 apparently(just use one half of the connector). Alternatively, most usb dacs will require you to connect a usb otg cable to the phone, and then have a standard usb cable connected to that.

Cool do you know if there are external amps out there that work like this. I only know FiiO amps so I would be starting from scratch of searching.

[tycheleto]

Cool do you know if there are external amps out there that work like this. I only know FiiO amps so I would be starting from scratch of searching.

For FiiO dac+amp there is the e07 and the e17. If possible, you should see if you can find a store near you specializing in these things, as they might let you audition them. Choose what sounds best to you, not just based on reviews. For all I know, you may be perfectly satisfied with the fiio e11, and the e17 may have no significant improvement to you

[dklhs90]

For FiiO dac+amp there is the e07 and the e17. If possible, you should see if you can find a store near you specializing in these things, as they might let you audition them. Choose what sounds best to you, not just based on reviews. For all I know, you may be perfectly satisfied with the fiio e11, and the e17 may have no significant improvement to you

I have a fiio e7 docked onto my e9 for my monitors on my computer and since yesterday I seem to have lost my e11. Cant find it anywhere...

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[tycheleto]

I have a fiio e7 docked onto my e9 for my monitors on my computer and since yesterday I seem to have lost my e11. Cant find it anywhere...

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Then you should be fine for now, unless you are really planning to move into higher end stuff. I find anything above what you have a sufficiently large investment that you only want to do if you know you'll hear the difference 

[dklhs90]

Then you should be fine for now, unless you are really planning to move into higher end stuff. I find anything above what you have a sufficiently large investment that you only want to do if you know you'll hear the difference 

Lol i found my FiiO e11 in a dark corner in my bag. So, now what i need to find is a mini usb 2.0 to a 3.5  audio jack right to use my e11 for the better amp?

[dklhs90]

Maybe something like this will work with my Note 3 and the FiiO E11? 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Neewer-USB-3-5mm-Audio-Headphone/dp/B005J2YJHO/ref=pd_sxp_grid_pt_1_0

[tycheleto]

Lol i found my FiiO e11 in a dark corner in my bag. So, now what i need to find is a mini usb 2.0 to a 3.5  audio jack right to use my e11 for the better amp?

 

USB is a digital cable. 3.5mm is an analog connector. Either you run a standard 3.5mm to 3.5mm audio cable from the audio jack to your e11(if the e11 has a 3.5mm in), or you need to get a USB OTG cable for your phone, then connect a standard USB to Mini usb cable to plug into that.

[dklhs90]

USB is a digital cable. 3.5mm is an analog connector. Either you run a standard 3.5mm to 3.5mm audio cable from the audio jack to your e11(if the e11 has a 3.5mm in), or you need to get a USB OTG cable for your phone, then connect a standard USB to Mini usb cable to plug into that.

the fiio e11 has a 3.5mm in and also has a mini usb female but I dont know if the mini usb female can do anything appart from charging the external amp.

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[tycheleto]

the fiio e11 has a 3.5mm in and also has a mini usb female but I dont know if the mini usb female can do anything appart from charging the external amp.

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Right it's only an amp. Yeah, so you need to do 3.5mm to 3.5mm analog in. If you have an e07, you should see if you can get the cables to take a digital in, and see if there's any noticeable difference in sound quality.