Custom NAS Server

[ChronoZoggt]

Hello everybody!

 

I am looking to build a NAS to back up three different PCs to. It should be able to back up two 1 TB notebook system Hard-Drives (Microsoft OS) and my Desktop Drive structure which consists of one 256GB System Drive and Two 1TB data drives. So 5TB (rounded up to five 1TB drives from 4.25TB in total data space), probably in RAID 1 for each of those backup drives for 10TB ( 10 times 1 TB) of Disk space in total. Maybe another Notebook will be added soon with two additional drives (one data drive with hourly backups and another system drive), so the Server should be expandable.

 

The whole system should be syncing with the two desktop Data drives hourly (or bi-hourly, something in that ballpark) that would mostly be small transactions of less than 2GB if that is even reached, and the occasional Game of 20+GB. The three System drives would be backed up weekly (These should be complete mirrors, so they would need to be copied completely I think? Would there be an option to just sync the differences here as well?). 

 

Now, this is my first venture into Server territory, so I need your help.

 

So, here are my questions:

• Would there be a problem with the NAS having four OS drives? would I be able to bypass that by setting the boot-order in the BIOS to the right system drive?
• Which CPU would be sufficient? (more on that below with some CPUs I searched out)
• What kind Motherboard would I need? (Details below)
• Which Case could be used for such a build. (Details below)
• ECC memory, but how much?
• What backup software would be the best for that kind of system? (Details below)
• FreeNAS is the OS I should use, right?
• What drives would work best for that application? (Details below)

 

Additional Info:

 

I am living in Germany, EU and that whole system should be around 1000€. If it would exceed that I would ditch the RAID setup and go with simple Backups instead and maybe go for a RAID update at a later point in time.

 

 

On the terms of the CPU:

 

I found a couple of CPUs using the ARK-Website. I am mostly looking for low-power-consumption Xeons so I have the following CPUs(CPU/Cores/Threads/Base Clock/Boost Clock):

• E3-1220L v3 / 2 / 4/ 1,1GHz / 1,5GHz
• E3-1240L v3 / 4 / 8 / 2GHz / 3GHz
• E3-1265L v3 /4 / 8 / 2,5GHz / 3,7GHz

What CPU would be sufficient for that kind of work? I suspect that file transfer does not take that much CPU power, but better safe than sorry, right Are these CPUs maybe the completely wrong line of Xeons?

 

 

In terms of the Motherboard:

 

What Motherboards would I need to look at? Does the LGA1150 Xeon support Z79 like the i7-4790K in my Gaming Rig or would I need a Server Chipset? I am really lost here...

 

 

In terms of the case:

 

I suspect I would need a Rack case to fit 8 drives and the raid cards? Open for any options here (Rack or standard case) as the server would be near the Router anyways, where there is enough space.

 

 

In terms of the backup software:

 

I would prefer software which is affordable for a consumer and that works with all three PCs (Windows 8 and Windows 10, no Macs in the Ecosystem). What would I use for the Data drive syncing and what would I use for the system drive cloning? Currently I am using a boot disk called Hiren's Boot Disk which clones Drives to other drives, but I feel like there would be better options for that.

 

 

In terms of the HDDs:

 

Are there other options than WD Reds? Only have good experiences with WD and only used them, but if you guys can recommend any other brand I will look into it for sure I am looking for 1TB drives to potentionally RAID together, as all my HDDs are 1TB in size, more space on the Server drives would just go wasted. Maybe I could go for a 2TB drive for the two Desktop data drives, but the system drives are 1TB each, so more space would just go wasted, wouldn't it? Would partitioning a 2TB drive into two 1TB partitions to hold the two Notebook drives work with the backup systems?

 

 

A huge thanks to everyone who can be of any help!

[Benergy]

• No, setting the boot order should be fine.

Those older Xeons should perform ok, as more threads benefits a NAS more than single core performance.

Depends on the size of your case, use Intel's site to look up the CPU, find out what socket it needs, and you can get any board with that socket of any size to fit the case (BIOS may need updated if it has an old chipset).

Once again that depends what size you want it to be. You certainly do not NEED a rack case (in fact they generally have poor airflow and have the drives closer together), a tower with enough drive bays would be fine.

I'd say 8GB. It's not exactly getting a lot of action with 3 users (less might be OK).

You could set up a crontab for an rsync over the LAN in any Linux distribution. Very powerful and lightweight. I don't have experience with any dedicated NAS OS'.

WD Red drives are good for NAS', performing better at being accessed by multiple users simultaneously and being able to withstand vibrations from neighbouring drives. If you're only backing up the PCs once a week or something, WD Green or any 5400 RPM drives would be good as they use less power and are significantly cheaper.

[ChronoZoggt]

 

• No, setting the boot order should be fine.
• Those older Xeons should perform ok, as more threads benefits a NAS more than single core performance.
• Depends on the size of your case, use Intel's site to look up the CPU, find out what socket it needs, and you can get any board with that socket of any size to fit the case (BIOS may need updated if it has an old chipset).
• Once again that depends what size you want it to be. You certainly do not NEED a rack case (in fact they generally have poor airflow and have the drives closer together), a tower with enough drive bays would be fine.
• I'd say 8GB. It's not exactly getting a lot of action with 3 users (less might be OK).
• You could set up a crontab for an rsync over the LAN in any Linux distribution. Very powerful and lightweight. I don't have experience with any dedicated NAS OS'.
• WD Red drives are good for NAS', performing better at being accessed by multiple users simultaneously and being able to withstand vibrations from neighbouring drives. If you're only backing up the PCs once a week or something, WD Green or any 5400 RPM drives would be good as they use less power and are significantly cheaper.

 

 

Thanks for all the answers!

 

I will definitely have a look at crontab in Linux, so I may not have to fiddle with FreeNAS.

Also, WD Greens should be fine for me then to back the system drives up, so: money saved there

 

And if 8GB of RAM is okay, would the Xeon E3-1220L v3 also suffice? Or should I move up to a higher clocked/threaded one?

[brob]

A Xeon is not really needed for a home NAS, especially one used mostly for backups.

 

Use something like FreeNAS on a usb stick for the o/s. HDD designed for NAS are much more reliable than WD Green.

 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i3-6100 3.7GHz Dual-Core Processor  (€131.05 @ Mindfactory)
Motherboard: Asus B150-PRO D3 ATX LGA1151 Motherboard  (€84.44 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Memory: G.Skill Value 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory  (€76.10 @ Mindfactory)
Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)
Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)
Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)
Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)
Case: NZXT Source 210 Elite (Black) ATX Mid Tower Case  (€49.90 @ Caseking)
Power Supply: SeaSonic 360W 80+ Gold Certified ATX Power Supply  (€67.04 @ Mindfactory)
Total: €1012.65
Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-01-12 11:04 CET+0100

[Streetguru]

Hello everybody!

Well here's the hard drives you should buy, and there goes your budget

 

Compress your data, you'll also want at least a Haswell i3 with a board that supports ECC and ECC memory

 

PCPartPicker part list: http://de.pcpartpicker.com/p/4ZdyK8

Price breakdown by merchant: http://de.pcpartpicker.com/p/4ZdyK8/by_merchant/

Storage: Hitachi Ultrastar 7K4000 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€216.18 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Hitachi Ultrastar 7K4000 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€216.18 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Hitachi Ultrastar 7K4000 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€216.18 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Hitachi Ultrastar 7K4000 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€216.18 @ Mindfactory)

Total: €864.72

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-01-12 11:14 CET+0100

[ChronoZoggt]

A Xeon is not really needed for a home NAS, especially one used mostly for backups.

 

Use something like FreeNAS on a usb stick for the o/s. HDD designed for NAS are much more reliable than WD Green.

 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i3-6100 3.7GHz Dual-Core Processor  (€131.05 @ Mindfactory)

Motherboard: Asus B150-PRO D3 ATX LGA1151 Motherboard  (€84.44 @ Amazon Deutschland)

Memory: G.Skill Value 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory  (€76.10 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)

Case: NZXT Source 210 Elite (Black) ATX Mid Tower Case  (€49.90 @ Caseking)

Power Supply: SeaSonic 360W 80+ Gold Certified ATX Power Supply  (€67.04 @ Mindfactory)

Total: €1012.65

Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-01-12 11:04 CET+0100

 

So I would not be able to get ECC memory with that i3, would I? I would use normal DDR3 RAM, right?

Can I clone a complete drive to a partition of another drive? Otherwise I would need 1TB drives each I think, or am I completely misinformed and I only need to backup C:\ to be able to recover a system drive and not bitwise clone the whole drive because of the MBR?

 

That Case is exactly the type of case I searched for btw, thank you

[ChronoZoggt]

Well here's the hard drives you should buy, and there goes your budget

 

Compress your data, you'll also want at least a Haswell i3 with a board that supports ECC and ECC memory

 

PCPartPicker part list: http://de.pcpartpicker.com/p/4ZdyK8

Price breakdown by merchant: http://de.pcpartpicker.com/p/4ZdyK8/by_merchant/

Storage: Hitachi Ultrastar 7K4000 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€216.18 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Hitachi Ultrastar 7K4000 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€216.18 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Hitachi Ultrastar 7K4000 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€216.18 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Hitachi Ultrastar 7K4000 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€216.18 @ Mindfactory)

Total: €864.72

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-01-12 11:14 CET+0100

Do I really need 7200RPM Drives for Backup at such a price? The drives will not really be stresses 24/7 or anywhere near that, so would I need that kind of Drive at this pricepoint?

[brob]

So I would not be able to get ECC memory with that i3, would I? I would use normal DDR3 RAM, right?

Can I clone a complete drive to a partition of another drive? Otherwise I would need 1TB drives each I think, or am I completely misinformed and I only need to backup C:\ to be able to recover a system drive and not bitwise clone the whole drive because of the MBR?

 

That Case is exactly the type of case I searched for btw, thank you

 

The i3 in that build supports ECC, http://ark.intel.com/products/90729/Intel-Core-i3-6100-Processor-3M-Cache-3_70-GHz.

 

Think of the NAS as a single very large drive. In a FreeNAS environment the o/s provides varying degrees of protection against hardware failures through software RAID.

 

A simple way to implement backup would be using a backup solution that ran on each workstation and created appropriate backups on the NAS. 

 

Backup is a fairly complex topic. Not something that can be covered in a single forum post.

 

One can use something as simple as an automated Windows Backup job running on each workstation. But that requires some human intervention to manage the backup sets. Removing old ones to free up space.

 

There are numerous more sophisticated backup solutions available, some free, others costing something. A package like Acronis True Image for example, can be setup to minimize the space required for each backup, while managing the total amount of NAS storage consumed by a workstation's backup database. One can create an emergency recovery boot usb/cd which can be used to boot a system and restore from a backup stored on the NAS. (In small network environments, having each workstation responsible for its own backup works much better in practice than having a single central server "pulling" backups.)

[ChronoZoggt]

The i3 in that build supports ECC, http://ark.intel.com/products/90729/Intel-Core-i3-6100-Processor-3M-Cache-3_70-GHz.

 

Think of the NAS as a single very large drive. In a FreeNAS environment the o/s provides varying degrees of protection against hardware failures through software RAID.

 

A simple way to implement backup would be using a backup solution that ran on each workstation and created appropriate backups on the NAS. 

 

Backup is a fairly complex topic. Not something that can be covered in a single forum post.

 

One can use something as simple as an automated Windows Backup job running on each workstation. But that requires some human intervention to manage the backup sets. Removing old ones to free up space.

 

There are numerous more sophisticated backup solutions available, some free, others costing something. A package like Acronis True Image for example, can be setup to minimize the space required for each backup, while managing the total amount of NAS storage consumed by a workstation's backup database. One can create an emergency recovery boot usb/cd which can be used to boot a system and restore from a backup stored on the NAS. (In small network environments, having each workstation responsible for its own backup works much better in practice than having a single central server "pulling" backups.)

okay, thanks for that clarification! Arconis seems like the option I will use for system drive backup then. Would there also be an option for syncing data drives to the NAS in small intervals similar to mirroring the drive to the NAS?

[brob]

okay, thanks for that clarification! Arconis seems like the option I will use for system drive backup then. Would there also be an option for syncing data drives to the NAS in small intervals similar to mirroring the drive to the NAS?

 

I believe so. True Image has a feature called Nonstop Backup that provides for continuous protection. It requires that the NAS support SMB, which FreeNAS does.

[Streetguru]

Do I really need 7200RPM Drives for Backup at such a price? The drives will not really be stresses 24/7 or anywhere near that, so would I need that kind of Drive at this pricepoint?

Those just happen to be just about the most reliable drives around

 

Like spend money depending on how important your data is, you also don't have to back up the entire hard drives, just put the important files on the back up system

[ChronoZoggt]

A Xeon is not really needed for a home NAS, especially one used mostly for backups.

 

Use something like FreeNAS on a usb stick for the o/s. HDD designed for NAS are much more reliable than WD Green.

 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i3-6100 3.7GHz Dual-Core Processor  (€131.05 @ Mindfactory)

Motherboard: Asus B150-PRO D3 ATX LGA1151 Motherboard  (€84.44 @ Amazon Deutschland)

Memory: G.Skill Value 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory  (€76.10 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)

Storage: Seagate  4TB 3.5" 5900RPM Internal Hard Drive  (€151.03 @ Mindfactory)

Case: NZXT Source 210 Elite (Black) ATX Mid Tower Case  (€49.90 @ Caseking)

Power Supply: SeaSonic 360W 80+ Gold Certified ATX Power Supply  (€67.04 @ Mindfactory)

Total: €1012.65

Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-01-12 11:04 CET+0100

 

Should I still get an i3-6100 after the info about the bug in them surfaced? Or will BIOS updates fix it soon enough?

[brob]

Should I still get an i3-6100 after the info about the bug in them surfaced? Or will BIOS updates fix it soon enough?

 

Until a fix is released there is no way to know if the problem will be corrected. But Intel has said they do have a BIOS based fix.

 

As far as I am aware the problem has only cropped up running Prime 95 with certain settings. It so happens that this program is a favorite stability tester for those who like to overclock. Which is likely why this problem has received the notice it has.

 

It seems unlikely to me that a home NAS encounter the particular conditions that trigger the bug.

[Streetguru]

Should I still get an i3-6100 after the info about the bug in them surfaced? Or will BIOS updates fix it soon enough?

It's not going to affect you, but you should probably go haswell with with the i3 as it'll be cheaper

[brob]

It's not going to affect you, but you should probably go haswell with with the i3 as it'll be cheaper

 

Haswell has just as many, if not more issues.

[Streetguru]

Haswell has just as many, if not more issues.

What do ya mean?

[brob]

What do ya mean?

 

See Errata in http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/specification-updates/4th-gen-core-family-desktop-specification-update.pdf.

[Streetguru]

See Errata in http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/specification-updates/4th-gen-core-family-desktop-specification-update.pdf.

Okay, I doubt any of those really affect end users for most tasks though.

[brob]

Okay, I doubt any of those really affect end users for most tasks though.

 

Agreed. But then Prime 95 is not an application used by most end users either. One has to choose based on one's own comfort level. But I would say that if the Skylake problem was serious there would be a lot more chatter about it.

[ChronoZoggt]

Until a fix is released there is no way to know if the problem will be corrected. But Intel has said they do have a BIOS based fix.

 

As far as I am aware the problem has only cropped up running Prime 95 with certain settings. It so happens that this program is a favorite stability tester for those who like to overclock. Which is likely why this problem has received the notice it has.

 

It seems unlikely to me that a home NAS encounter the particular conditions that trigger the bug.

MSI has already put out a BIOS based beta-fix for two of their motherboards, but still good to know that the loads of data probably won't trigger it like prime numbers

 

It's not going to affect you, but you should probably go haswell with with the i3 as it'll be cheaper

Okay, I will look into Haswell, but I doubt that the price delta would be persuading me to go with the older i3. Thanks you for the notice anyways

 

Ultimately, thank you two guys, as you have helped me quite a bit here

[Streetguru]

MSI has already put out a BIOS based beta-fix for two of their motherboards, but still good to know that the loads of data probably won't trigger it like prime numbers

There's not going to be a noticeable performance difference from haswell to skylake. and if you go ECC the DDR4 ECC memory probably still costs a good deal more

[ChronoZoggt]

There's not going to be a noticeable performance difference from haswell to skylake. and if you go ECC the DDR4 ECC memory probably still costs a good deal more

Would you, by chance, have a recommendation for a Haswell motherboard with an Intel NIC and 6 Sata ports for ~100€, roughly equivalent to the Z170 one here: http://de.pcpartpicker.com/part/asus-motherboard-b150prod3

 

I am completely lost when comparing motherboards even just from asus Are there any efficient ways to do that? Manufacturer's websites seem to be a bit lackluster in that regard.

[Streetguru]

Would you, by chance, have a recommendation for a Haswell motherboard with an Intel NIC and 6 Sata ports for ~100€, roughly equivalent to the Z170 one here: http://de.pcpartpicker.com/part/asus-motherboard-b150prod3

 

I am completely lost when comparing motherboards even just from asus Are there any efficient ways to do that? Manufacturer's websites seem to be a bit lackluster in that regard.

You can just adjust the sliders on PC part picker on the bottom left to sort by sata ports, this one should have Gigabit and 6 Sata ports, but you're still better off going haswell for a less expensive build, especially if you get a proper NAS with ECC

also I wouldn't really buy anything with a low end chipset, might end up less stable

 

https://de.pcpartpicker.com/part/asrock-motherboard-h170mpro4s

[ChronoZoggt]

You can just adjust the sliders on PC part picker on the bottom left to sort by sata ports, this one should have Gigabit and 6 Sata ports, but you're still better off going haswell for a less expensive build, especially if you get a proper NAS with ECC

also I wouldn't really buy anything with a low end chipset, might end up less stable

 

https://de.pcpartpicker.com/part/asrock-motherboard-h170mpro4s

I am actually searching for a socket 1150 Z97 Haswell mainboard. As Intel has announced that important security updates will only be available with Skylake on Windows 10, I would rather have a Haswell that is getting updates on any platform. Also playing memory controller lottery with DDR3 memory on a Skylake Processor is not what I want either, so I think I will go with an Haswell i3 4170 I think. same price as the 6100 but a higher clock and Haswell architecture.

 

Thanks for the tips with PC Part Picker as well, I never actaully used that website, so that is quite good to know

 

One more question though: Is every Motherboard compatible with ECC memory as long as the Processor is? Or do I need special Motherboards for that?

[Streetguru]

I am actually searching for a socket 1150 Z97 Haswell mainboard. As Intel has announced that important security updates will only be available with Skylake on Windows 10, I would rather

You need a motherboard with ECC support, a Super Micro board is usually a pretty good bet as they mostly make server boards, server boards in general should have ECC support.