External drive array

[bigjme]

6 drives is most likely my maximum for a good while. Luckily my work industry is in computing, meaning I will be able to get sas and hdds at a cheaper rate then a normal consumer.

You guys have been a huge help so far as if I talk to work about it, they will rush me into buying parts quickly where as I like to plan ahead.

Right now I have been able to make some space up, this server at home is going to be under a bed now, which is 3ft tall, leaving space for my server and a 24 bay case just for good measure.

I love the drive case that linus used in his new bulk storage array, as it basically just accepts loads of drives. Its the type I would like as I wouldnt have any other internals then an expander, and a desktop psu with bridged 24 pin connectors

For rebuilds, I will most likely clone all data to lots of smaller drives in other machines and merge it back if need be, most machines here have 2tbs of storage or more

As the important webserver run on a separate ssd, rebuild time isn't too much of an issue as long as I can keep the machine booted while it builds and simply fetch anything important off for use while it builds.

[ChineseChef]

I assume you are talking about the Norco case?  They do look good, and will likely be the next case I get for mine when I consolidate down to larger drives and a single case without external expanders.  Plus it allows you to connect directly within the chassis without having to run external cables.  Though I use my system purely for bulk storage, and I use Flexraid instead of hardware raid, since I don't need it to be fast at all.  I just use my raid card for the JBOD functionality and to allow me to connect the external units.

[bigjme]

I believe it's the one used in his storinator server. Where the drives slot internally facing down.

Where the case will be sitting, if a drive fails then I will most likely have to drag the entire case out and shut down anyway so hot swap caddies wouldn't really be used. For the amount of storage going into this system, I won't be able to keep a full clone of all the data which is why I wanted raid 6 or 10 as in 6 drives it allows a decent back up.

Raid 10 I will lose around 4tbs of storage in total, and make it more expensive to upgrade later on.

The only raid I have personally done is a Windows software raid on an old machine so I just don't have the proper knowledge to make a good choice.

Even double my current speeds would be great

[ChineseChef]

Ah, yah those storinators are nice, but man are they expensive, lol.  I really want one, but I can buy 20-30 4TB drives for the price of one of those chassis.

 

As far as raids go, if you want something good for your games storage, you can get 3 Tb drives for cheap, and there are plenty of options of brand and model at the cheap price.  4x in a raid 10 and you wouldn't need to upgrade that for a long time, if it was only for games.  4x 3TB in raid 10 would give you 5.5 TB of usable space, and it would be fast.  Newer 3TB drives are nice and quick, as long as you get the 7200 RPM drives.  You would likely get 120-220 MB/s sustained usage, bursting on the higher end.

 

I know you are in the UK, so I'm not sure what is most price effective for you or what availability is like, but there are lots of 4TB drives in the same price range as the 3TB ones.  Though, from looking at pcpartpicker, you can also get the 8TB drives from seagate for the same price per GB as the 3Tb ones, not sure about quantities and availability, but looks like you have the options.  Otherwise it looks like your next best bet is the 6TB WD pro reds. 

 

I would say spec out and price out a bunch of different styles of builds.  See what would get you the most for your money and meet your needs the best.  You may have to make sacrifices here and there, get some used parts (no big deal for enterprise grade stuff).  But don't get used HDDs.  I buy the cheapest HDDs out there, and they work fine, but I would never trust a used drive.

 

You can get some kick ass speeds from RAID 6, but you will have to do your research about which cards to get, and how to best set it up.  I don't normally shoot for insane speeds, so i am not really the best guy to help you there, but you may want to check out Hardforum.com.  I learned a bunch of stuff from reading threads on that forum about different peoples mass storage setups.  And they have tons of info about raid cards.

[bigjme]

Thanks for the suggestion, I will have a look over there. My vms are not that much of my storage, less then 1tb so I may keep those on my current 2tb drives in the sas enclosure with no raid, and raid the rest for my games and other storage which is what uses all the space. Over 3tb of just steam games right now.

As I already have a 4tb wd red it figured out around $230 cheaper to buy 5 more of those rather then 4 6tbs, getting them through work makes the price different even more so I will have to wait for my boss to get back and see what prices he can get

I know we can get a good price on wd reds as we just ordered 18 6tbs for one of our server arrays

Edit:

It seems you are correct with the 8tb seagate drives. In the UK I would pay £23.13 per tb in the 8tb, and £33.75 per tb in the wd reds at 4tb

If I settled at just 8tb usable, even with my current drive, it would still be £60 ($90) cheaper to get 2 new 8tb drives and mirror them. Pushing storage up a little, I can get 4 8tbs for £70 less then 6 4tb reds. The 8 tbs in raid 10 vs the 4tbs in raid 6 for 16tb usable space

I'm not sure how good the seagate drives are, especially not at such a high capacity, I know my wd black and wd red have been amazing so far but I'm unsure

[ChineseChef]

For the 8TB drives, keep in mind they are designed for archive purposes.  So they will do quite poorly in any kind of small or random writes.  Reviews say they are great for storage, but not so good when it comes to regular usage I/O.  You may honestly be best served by getting more of the 4TB drives for your reduced price, and running them in raid 5.  That would give you the fault tolerance and speed you are looking for.  4-6 drives in raid 5 is a good setup, and would give you plenty of space.

 

As far as how good are Seagate, really depends on which model you get, and if you are one of the lucky ones.  I have 20 Seagate drives at the moment, and they are all running great.  But some people have nothing but problems from them.  On the same note I have tons of problems from WD drives, so its really just how the chips fall for you.  But the 8TB are too new to really know how well they will hold up, despite any claims otherwise.  I would suggest staying in the 4-6 TB drive range, since they are the most tested.

[bigjme]

Ok 4tbs is most likely the option unless work can get me the 6tbs at a very very good price.

I guess I will have to wait until next week and see what prices I can get stuff for.

[ChineseChef]

One thing too, if you are able, try different modes when you do finally get your gear.  Build a raid 5 and test it, redo it as a raid 6, test it, see if it changes much.  Might find that the performance is not impacted too much, or you may find a huge difference, but it will at least settle it in your mind and help make a decision about what to do.

[bigjme]

Very good point. I will have to give it a test once ready and see how things work out. Testing games will be pretty difficult so I will have to do some general hdd benchmarks.

Thanks for all your help. It may be a few weeks before I get things sorted properly

[ChineseChef]

Yah, it will be hard to test normal use cases, but just some regular benchmark programs should give you a rough idea if one is way better than the other.

 

Good luck with your build.  Feel free to hit me up if you have more questions or issues.