Suggestions for the screwdriver.

[maksakal]

Probably a long strech but any plans on making a VDE screwdriver? Well maybe not VDE certified but at least an insulated set? Like I said, probably not but just suggesting it.

What would be usefull however, is a torque screwdriver. Torque specs is slowly starting to become thing in the industry and I can see LTT being the first to come out with a torque screwdriver made for PC building.

For instance having a longer shaft (length of the shaft influences the torque) would be usefull when screwing down a cooler. Some manufacturers supply a long tool in the box so you can thighten down the cooler.

I can see LTT pushing manufacturers to specifying torque specs on all their components. I would even go as far as calling it a revolution. I hate it when (LTT does this too) somebody says "finger thight" or "thight but not too thight", those are subjective terms. I've seen people over thightening their coolers soo much that they damaged their sockets, or cracked their motherboard. How do you strip a screw with a manual screwdriver? I don't know how but some people can do it.

This other channel eFixx (electricians) did a video about "wrist torque". They asked electricians who said they didn't need a torque screwdriver to torque down screws and almost all of them over torqued it with a few under torqueing. None of them came near the correct torque spec while all of them were convinced they had it just right. So what I'm saying is "finger thight" or "not too thight" is subjective AF.

I think this could be a mark LTT leaves on the industry. You better start specifying torque specs because we're starting the conversation and going to tell everybody about this.

Wera, Wiha, Swiss Tools (PB Swiss) and Gedore (I know I'm European) all have a line up which could be used as a benchmark.

One pitfall to concider however is price. A good set starts at 160 euro's and I don't think LTT could do much to break that price threshold. So is 160 euro's something an enthousiast is willing to invest in something they will need every once in a while. Having sais that I'm amazed at LTT's ability to ship such large amouts of the wrecheting screwdriver at that price point. So if there's anybody who can market a purpose built torque screwdriver it's LTT.

[saintlouisbagels]

9 minutes ago, maksakal said:

 hate it when (LTT does this too) somebody says "finger thight" or "thight but not too thight", those are subjective terms.

This isn't just PC building though.

It's extends to building everything - from assembling basic drawers you order from Amazon to setting up $1M equipment.

It even happens in cooking - knead the dough until xxx, salt to taste, etc.

 

It down to the operator to either have common sense or have some sort of pre-existing experience.

[maksakal]

22 minutes ago, saintlouisbagels said:

This isn't just PC building though.

It's extends to building everything - from assembling basic drawers you order from Amazon to setting up $1M equipment.

It even happens in cooking - knead the dough until xxx, salt to taste, etc.

 

It down to the operator to have common sense.

Don't agree with that. When screwing into a piece of wood you know when to stop. When you are setting up a piece of equipment which is worth 1M then everything is specified and documented. Or else you are liable for 1M which nobody wants.

Nobody cooks as good as m mother if you're trying to say that but cook books and recepies are always specified with exact amounts.

To get back to the 1M equipment. Over or under torqueing your PC hardware does have serious risks involved, whats that AMD bracket called again which can be over torqued destroying the Threadripper? Who's fault is that? AMD's for not specifying a torque spec? The motherboard manufacturer for not supplying the correct tools? Or yours because you were to eager?

But having said all this, I'm not so sure what point you're trying to make. So manufacturers shouldn't supply torque specs and everybody should just accept they could put too much salt in their food?

[Skiiwee29]

This has been suggested and discussed previously here:

 

 

[maksakal]

The guy calls himself Nexans? Seriously? He probably works there.

I don't know about the requirement, but every experienced electrician knows it's a F'in good idea.

The big brands have ratcheting screwdrivers but I find them too much of a hassle, changing the shafts and such. I have a set of regular screwdrivers, it's much quicker to have a set of regular screwdrivers in your pocket. The whole sets always comes in a pouch because else it's impossible to keep everything together. The pouch takes op too much space.

However like I said the big brands have ratcheting VDE screwdrivers so there is probably a market for them. But maybe not the pro market. And the LTT audience doens't need a VDE certification as they probably won't work on high voltage BUT if you are going to produce insulated screwdrivers then it's a good idea to have them certified as somebody somewhere probably is going to use them for high voltage and have an accident. That then opens up a whole case of liability, I thought this and that because LTT said so and such.

Wera has the Turbo screwdriver which I find usefull, so maybe have a look at that? Big big big disadvantage of the Turbo is that in turbo mode it's 2 handed use. Bought one, rarely use it but in some cases it is nice to have.

Anyway a ratcheting VDE screwdriver doesn't make much sense (for me) but now I rememberd why I started about the VDE thing (started typing then I had to leave and when I came back I had forgotten).

How about ESD screwdrivers and tools? You guys make all this fuss about having an ESD strap but don't carry ESD tools. Last I checked LTT Store doesn't even carry ESD straps, ESD gloves or ESD testers. Think there would be a huge market for those among not only LTT fans but the whole community.

And ofcourse the whole torque thing. I mean look at the whole torque debacle with AMD sockets.

[MarkPol88]

Linus stated multiple times, that they will not make a product just for making it - they need to add something other that branding.

8 hours ago, maksakal said:

whats that AMD bracket called again which can be over torqued destroying the Threadripper? Who's fault is that? AMD's for not specifying a torque spec?

44 minutes ago, maksakal said:

I mean look at the whole torque debacle with AMD sockets.

You do know, that you got special torque wrench with those processors, right? So to answer the question: it is man's fault for not using tools provided by manufacturer.

There was no debacle - only two kind of people. One kind that used provided tool, other that did not.

43 minutes ago, maksakal said:

However like I said the big brands have ratcheting VDE screwdrivers so there is probably a market for them.

45 minutes ago, maksakal said:

Think there would be a huge market for those among not only LTT fans but the whole community.

Too many "probably" and "I think so" - the fact that they moved impressive amount of screwdrivers do not make them manufacturer on the same level as the brands you mentioned. Designing and making a driver that also needs to pass any certification would skyrocket the price to levels not acceptable by community.

Only viable option might be torque driver, but again - designing it with something new from the team, not just a re-brand, would cost so much, that I do not see it in near future.

[maksakal]

That is not a torque screwdriver, that is a T screwdriver (also not a wrench). People were overtorqueing their socket because a T screwdriver is purposly made for high torque. If you do not use a T screwdriver when you are supposed you will probably end up under torqueing.

Also that is a stupid tool. A T screwdriver has that specific shape so you can really push down on it and excert force. AMD has the shaft sticking out at the top which means you can't hold it the way you're supposed, meaning you can't really torque it. So why include the T screwdriver when you can't use it the way you're supposed to? Just include a regulat screwdriver or a tool like Noctua does.

 

Quote

Too many "probably" and "I think so" - the fact that they moved impressive amount of screwdrivers do not make them manufacturer on the same level as the brands you mentioned. Designing and making a driver that also needs to pass any certification would skyrocket the price to levels not acceptable by community.

I'm not going todo their research for them, just suggesting it's upto LTT todo with it what they will.

[crostiger]

 

1 hour ago, maksakal said:

That is not a torque screwdriver, that is a T screwdriver (also not a wrench). People were overtorqueing their socket because a T screwdriver is purposly made for high torque. If you do not use a T screwdriver when you are supposed you will probably end up under torqueing.

Also that is a stupid tool. A T screwdriver has that specific shape so you can really push down on it and excert force. AMD has the shaft sticking out at the top which means you can't hold it the way you're supposed, meaning you can't really torque it. So why include the T screwdriver when you can't use it the way you're supposed to? Just include a regulat screwdriver or a tool like Noctua does.

 

I'm not going todo their research for them, just suggesting it's upto LTT todo with it what they will.

 

 

Ok so going to try and cover things in the original and this post.  As far as price goes are there things that are comparable that are cheaper yes better depends on the person. And along with the price there have been and still are instances that R&D cost money if you were paying for engineers for years with no profits coming in from what they were doing you might start a little high to is that to say the prices will come down some day who knows in time I hope so a little. Do I think they need to be certified I personally don't believe so. And as far as the torque wrench comment that's why they make them I have emailed company's asking for the torque spec and they said there isn't one were in my instance everything else I have that is similar has one and asked them to make one up and send it to me so if it breaks it inst my fault. Same idea with not using the tool that came with it that is a build in torque wrench for that item. And as far as building computers go most have instructions on how to install certain items little vague at times yes but it also doesn't tell you to grab a driver will a handle on it and go to town. Other then coolers most things you go tell it touches then like 1/16 of a turn more haven't mest up anything yet and I will snap most bolts put in front of me and told to crank it down then they come back what did you do it was still turning then it snapped off then I get better instruction.

[Dutch_Master]

1 hour ago, MarkPol88 said:

There was no debacle - only two kind of people. One kind that used provided tool, other that did not.

Wrong. There are those who purchased used EPYC components where the used EPYC CPU did NOT come with the AMD-provided torque wrench.   I'm one of the many.

 

1 hour ago, maksakal said:

Also that is a stupid tool.

Actually, no. AMD provided torque-wrenches specifically tuned (set) for the correct torque on the EPYC CPU socket. So, it's not stupid, it's clever. Or even brilliant if you're an AMD fanboi

[MarkPol88]

17 minutes ago, Dutch_Master said:

Wrong. There are those who purchased used EPYC components where the used EPYC CPU did NOT come with the AMD-provided torque wrench.   I'm one of the many.

How is that a AMD problem?

[saintlouisbagels]

7 hours ago, maksakal said:

That is not a torque screwdriver

Yes it is. It's a pre-set torque screwdriver. (video is time-coded)

 

[maksakal]

17 hours ago, saintlouisbagels said:

Yes it is. It's a pre-set torque screwdriver. (video is time-coded)

 

Ok, I didn't know that.... How is that mechanism supposed to be tuned to an exact torque setting? It's more like between 2 and 3nM.