Prototype Products

[ToboRobot]

After listening to the WAN show I think there is a good opportunity to test new products in the market without full production runs.

A small clothing brand (Outlier NYC) I am a fan off has a line of prototypes where they sell limited runs of new product ideas they are testing, with the hope that they will be come regular mass scale products, or fill a niche.  And I think LTT could easily test the market and iterate products rapidly with the community, to minimize risk, find unexpected hits and create a fun community buzz with fresh new things.

I would be happy to forgo the Trust Me Bro warranty for a Work with Us program, where I can try the cool new gear early, and provide real customer feedback.  Some will reject the prototype small run pricing, but others will love the exclusivity and being part of a journey. 

[manikyath]

afaik the "prototype run" scale of LTTstore is in the range of "singular items", because items they arent entirely sure about will likely be a minimum order size production run anyways..

[LogicalDrm]

Isn't this pretty much what they did with some made-for-order product? Since if you don't have full production in-house, it will either be minimum order (cheaper) or smaller batch of made-for-order (more expensive and sold at 100%).

[ToboRobot]

2 hours ago, manikyath said:

afaik the "prototype run" scale of LTTstore is in the range of "singular items", because items they arent entirely sure about will likely be a minimum order size production run anyways..

Yes, this isn't a replacement for single unit testing, but a smaller than full production run, after initial internal testing is complete.

This would be an optional, additional step in the process, allowing the team to seek external validation of the product concept, etc.

 

[ToboRobot]

1 minute ago, LogicalDrm said:

Isn't this pretty much what they did with some made-for-order product? Since if you don't have full production in-house, it will either be minimum order (cheaper) or smaller batch of made-for-order (more expensive and sold at 100%).

No, made to order is different.

What I am suggesting, is a small production run of products, obviously at a higher price.

I recently contacted a small maker of MTB bikes asking for a laptop case, because I am thrilled with their products quality.  They don't make them, as there core market just wants bike gear.  So I had the idea of connecting LTT with highabove.net to do a small run of laptop bags, with the hope that the idea would be successful enough for a large production run at scale, or just a small niche product well made for the people who care about that.  

 

I think this system has worked well for outlier.nyc and would love to see something similar with tech focused gear.

[manikyath]

1 hour ago, ToboRobot said:

Yes, this isn't a replacement for single unit testing, but a smaller than full production run, after initial internal testing is complete.

that's the point.. that would be "the first production run", because very often there is no "smaller" when you're already planning to order minimum quantity.

[ToboRobot]

6 minutes ago, manikyath said:

that's the point.. that would be "the first production run", because very often there is no "smaller" when you're already planning to order minimum quantity.

You can get a single test unit from a factory.  Or you can order a larger amount to leverage economies of scale for production.  

 

It absolutely is possible to meet somewhere in the middle.  

The minimum production quantity isn't a hard limit, as we know you can already get a single unit or very small order to test fit, etc.

It's generally a question of cost.

[manikyath]

1 minute ago, ToboRobot said:

The minimum production quantity isn't a hard limit, as we know you can already get a single unit or very small order to test fit, etc.

except that it is a hard limit in a lot of cases. test units are disproportionally more expensive, and the minimum production run is usually a given "volume" because of packaging, and because it makes no sense for them to spool up the machines for less than that volume, because let's be honest.. you arent gonna be paying 60 bucks for a shirt that'll cost 20 bucks in a month or two. the increased cost per unit of going below "minimum order quantity" doesnt make sense compared to just ordering more units. that's why there is a minimum order quantity. if it would make sense to offer that, the factory would offer that.

 

--

 

case in point.. a while back i was shopping for a specific organizing box to potentially use in our handling process at work. trough their consumer-facing outlet individual units cost 2 bucks.

 

now.. going past individual units at 2 bucks a pop, the minimum order quantity was something around 500-ish (it wasnt a round figure) - because that is how many they can fit in the smallest unit their wholesale shipper will handle. at this quantity, the cost per unit was around 20 cents.

from there on, if you buy at enough scale, they *will* poop out an entire container worth of these sorting boxes for 2 cents a piece.

now tell me that it makes sense to have an option between 50 units for 100 bucks, or a box of 500-ish for 100 bucks. external factors (set cost of the machines, shipping container sizes, the cost of handling the order) determine that this is where the low end of economy of scale stops. shipping half a box of units costs just as much as shipping a full box, handling the quote costs the same, setting the machines costs the same, etc.

 

besides.. the test units LTTstore have - as far as i've understood it - go to staff members.

[LogicalDrm]

15 hours ago, ToboRobot said:

You can get a single test unit from a factory.  Or you can order a larger amount to leverage economies of scale for production.  

Yes, and they do this all the time to verify quality of new designs. But those are really small samples, really only enough to do validation. And cost of those units is baked in to final price of the product. As for latter part, thats what made to order essentially is. And what they are also doing currently.

 

15 hours ago, ToboRobot said:

It absolutely is possible to meet somewhere in the middle.  

The minimum production quantity isn't a hard limit, as we know you can already get a single unit or very small order to test fit, etc.

It's generally a question of cost.

The main problem isn't just cost of what you as customer will pay. But all the designing and testing to keep that quality you like. To achieve smaller test run that can be sold out, even with all the cautions and asterisk about it being test run and not full quality, it will still be more than just pure production cost.

[ToboRobot]

7 hours ago, LogicalDrm said:

Yes, and they do this all the time to verify quality of new designs. But those are really small samples, really only enough to do validation. And cost of those units is baked in to final price of the product. As for latter part, thats what made to order essentially is. And what they are also doing currently.

 

The main problem isn't just cost of what you as customer will pay. But all the designing and testing to keep that quality you like. To achieve smaller test run that can be sold out, even with all the cautions and asterisk about it being test run and not full quality, it will still be more than just pure production cost.

unlesss you work for linus its all just speculation.

[LogicalDrm]

39 minutes ago, ToboRobot said:

unlesss you work for linus its all just speculation.

Partly speculation. Some from extensive BTS content.

[ToboRobot]

18 minutes ago, LogicalDrm said:

Partly speculation. Some from extensive BTS content.

Unless you are in the room when negotiations are happening, it's hard to know the truth.

 

Let's just say I have personal experience that order limits are negotiable.  And this market seems to have some people who are price insensitive that supports limited runs.