Case Fans Placement

[EvilGenius]

Hey everyone, 

 

I was just wondering was you guys would do for fan placement in my Fractal Design Define R5 case. I just switched from a Gigabyte GTX 1070ti to a Asus TUF RTX 3060ti and my hotspot gets to 105 degrees celcius. My GPU temp stay between 70 and 80 degrees celcius. 

 

https://www.fractal-design.com/products/cases/define/define-r5/black/

 

I attached a picture of the fan spots of the case also. 

 

Like you can see on the screenshot, I have a filter in the front and at the bottom. Should I use static pressure fans for those? 

 

My fans are all 6-7 years old corsair fans, I don't remember the model. In the front I have 2 x 140mm (intake) not static pressure one, 1 x 120mm on the side panel (intake), 1 x 120mm in the back (exhaust), 2 x 120mm on my CPU aio cooler radiator (exhaust). I find I get a good amount of dust build up also. 

 

Should I put 2 x 140mm static pressure on the front of the case because of the filter? Is the side fan necessary, should I put it as an exhaust instead of intake? 

 

Would it be better to have a 140mm instead of a 120mm in the back for an exhaust? 

 

Should I had some 120mm at the bottom of the case? 

 

I saw some post about repasting my GPU also, but I wanted to try to have the best airflow as possible in my case also. 

 

Thanks to everyone in advance! 

 

 

 

 

[thrasher_565]

its a hot case so adding all the fans to make it a bit better up to you. or live with what you got.

[kitnoman]

Those are really hot for a 3060ti. If the case is the problem, you would also need to check the cpu temps by the way. However personally, I would first check the temps on ambient, like removing the whole pc from the case and put it in an open test bench or just on top of the motherboard box. Run test on it and see what are the temps. Or you can just leave the cover of the case open, while running test. Check if the temps are the same. If it is, then the main issue is your gpu itself and you'll probably need thermal pads/paste to fix it. However if the temps lowers, then yes the main issue is the case and you don't have to do anything with your gpu. Regardless which issue you have, it's still better to fix your pc airflow. 

I would personally replace all those fans, yes preferably sp fans, as for brand and model, I'll leave that to your budget and preference. I would also use every side of the case that I can slap a fan on. My moto is "the more fans you add, the slower the fans needs to spin to maintain the airflow, hence quieter." It's quieter to have 7 fans spinning at 1500rpm than 5 fans spinning at 2000-3000(although there are quiet fans that runs even at 2300rpm). If you like quiet. My advice is, in general, get the fastest fans your budget allows, but set the fan curve so they would only spin at their 70-80% rpm speed(unless they have too). I have the phanteks t30 and it's max is 3000rpm. My fan curve is set to 50% fan speed as the lowest and would increase as the temps increase, but it never does. The highest I've observed was probably around 2100rpm. If you can get 140mm, get those, specially the rear fans. Rear and top fans should be for exhaust. These are the one that doesn't have to be static pressure fans by the way, unless you change to an water cooling. While the front, Bottom and side, are intakes. The reason for this is because hot air naturally rises. So it's easier to push the air up and towards the rear.

[EvilGenius]

6 minutes ago, kitnoman said:

Those are really hot for a 3060ti. If the case is the problem, you would also need to check the cpu temps by the way. However personally, I would first check the temps on ambient, like removing the whole pc from the case and put it in an open test bench or just on top of the motherboard box. Run test on it and see what are the temps. Or you can just leave the cover of the case open, while running test. Check if the temps are the same. If it is, then the main issue is your gpu itself and you'll probably need thermal pads/paste to fix it. However if the temps lowers, then yes the main issue is the case and you don't have to do anything with your gpu. Regardless which issue you have, it's still better to fix your pc airflow. 

I would personally replace all those fans, yes preferably sp fans, as for brand and model, I'll leave that to your budget and preference. I would also use every side of the case that I can slap a fan on. My moto is "the more fans you add, the slower the fans needs to spin to maintain the airflow, hence quieter." It's quieter to have 7 fans spinning at 1500rpm than 5 fans spinning at 2000-3000(although there are quiet fans that runs even at 2300rpm). If you like quiet. My advice is, in general, get the fastest fans your budget allows, but set the fan curve so they would only spin at their 70-80% rpm speed(unless they have too). I have the phanteks t30 and it's max is 3000rpm. My fan curve is set to 50% fan speed as the lowest and would increase as the temps increase, but it never does. The highest I've observed was probably around 2100rpm. If you can get 140mm, get those, specially the rear fans. Rear and top fans should be for exhaust. These are the one that doesn't have to be static pressure fans by the way, unless you change to an water cooling. While the front, Bottom and side, are intakes. The reason for this is because hot air naturally rises. So it's easier to push the air up and towards the rear.

Hey thanks for all this information, I really appreciate it. 

 

Budget is not a problem, so I could get good quality fans. I'm running a water cooler and my radiator only fits 120mm fans on it, so I have 2 on it as exhaust. 

 

My CPU seems fine it's around 45 degrees celsius. 

 

When I open my side panel my GPU temp goes down 6-7 degrees and my hotspot around 10 degrees lower. 

 

But my cousin got the same GPU and while playing the same game and graphic settings, he's around 60 (gpu temp) and 70ish (hotspot). Doesn't have the same setup has me. So even with my side panel off I find my GPU way higher than is. 

 

So if I keep this case I should add static pressure fans or hybrid fans where I have filters and on my water cooler radiator. All the other spot I put air flow 140mm fans? 

[JLssg4]

Negative pressure (exhaust > intake) can* be favorable for cooling...direct hot air removal beats trying to push it out with more ambient intake, the latter results in more mixing and relatively less heat transfer. [*it's mainly about how direct your heat removal is.]
 
Positive pressure is favorable for dust, presuming your intake is all filtered.

Airflow that does anything other than Front+Bottom -> Top+Back is really fighting an uphill battle.  I guess side fans could help, but it's much 'cleaner' when airflow is merging/diverging in just two, same plane directions.  Adding in that third direction adds in more than double the turbulence, so I'd imagine it's effectively less valuable than the same fan added within the 2d flow paths of the other fans. (visually: 2d airflow vs. 3d airflow...though the 2d is an over-simplification in reality, that too would have 3 dimensional flow variations, just more 'coherence'.)

Regarding that side fan, I would think it would have to be used as intake in this case....GPU, mounted normally, should be taking air from below it, pushing through the cooler towards the chip, and then exhausting out the back.  I don't think you'd want to introduce an exhaust so close to the GPU's intake.

I'm not sure about bottom fans here...is there mounting for one towards the front? (kind of already have intake covered there with your front fan...that has to swerve up over and past the PSU shroud.)  is the mounting middle-back where they would effectively only feed the PSU, cables, and maybe a HDD under the shroud?

Bumping up to 140mm exhaust on the back should help....otherwise not really sure I have any suggestions...maybe need some higher RPM fans? are they 100% all the time?
 

[EvilGenius]

10 minutes ago, JLssg4 said:

Negative pressure (exhaust > intake) can* be favorable for cooling...direct hot air removal beats trying to push it out with more ambient intake, the latter results in more mixing and relatively less heat transfer. [*it's mainly about how direct your heat removal is.]
 
Positive pressure is favorable for dust, presuming your intake is all filtered.

Airflow that does anything other than Front+Bottom -> Top+Back is really fighting an uphill battle.  I guess side fans could help, but it's much 'cleaner' when airflow is merging/diverging in just two, same plane directions.  Adding in that third direction adds in more than double the turbulence, so I'd imagine it's effectively less valuable than the same fan added within the 2d flow paths of the other fans. (visually: 2d airflow vs. 3d airflow...though the 2d is an over-simplification in reality, that too would have 3 dimensional flow variations, just more 'coherence'.)

Regarding that side fan, I would think it would have to be used as intake in this case....GPU, mounted normally, should be taking air from below it, pushing through the cooler towards the chip, and then exhausting out the back.  I don't think you'd want to introduce an exhaust so close to the GPU's intake.

I'm not sure about bottom fans here...is there mounting for one towards the front? (kind of already have intake covered there with your front fan...that has to swerve up over and past the PSU shroud.)  is the mounting middle-back where they would effectively only feed the PSU, cables, and maybe a HDD under the shroud?

Bumping up to 140mm exhaust on the back should help....otherwise not really sure I have any suggestions...maybe need some higher RPM fans? are they 100% all the time?
 

They are not on 100% all the time, not often. Even if I out them all at 100%, doesn't change much the gpu temps, maybe 1-2 degrees. My front fans are connected to my case switch instead of my motherboard. So I will probably change that, put them on the motherboard to have more control. So I should have the side fan as an intake to push air on my gpu? Or it will interrupt the flow from the front to the back/top? 

 

I will change the back one to a 140mm air flow fan and what kind of 140mm fans should I get for the front if I keep my filter on? I feel the difference in air flow from the front if I put my filter on, less air coming in. 

 

Any fans that you would recommend? Should I use a fan controler? 

[JLssg4]

2 minutes ago, EvilGenius said:

So I should have the side fan as an intake to push air on my gpu? Or it will interrupt the flow from the front to the back/top?

Honestly I'd have to test/see a test done...
Pros: You're feeding more air in the proximity of the gpu
Cons: Added flow is perpendicular to both GPU intake and exhaust as well as the general case intake and exhaust flow.  Which means more turbulence and less coherent general flow = definitely less effect on cooling than any other single fan in the system...potentially pushing some GPU heat onto the mobo/M.2/memory? (idk can't tell those exact orientations from those pics).  I can't say it would be detrimental, just that it'll definitely be the lowest single-fan contribution to the system's cooling.

[EvilGenius]

13 hours ago, JLssg4 said:

Honestly I'd have to test/see a test done...
Pros: You're feeding more air in the proximity of the gpu
Cons: Added flow is perpendicular to both GPU intake and exhaust as well as the general case intake and exhaust flow.  Which means more turbulence and less coherent general flow = definitely less effect on cooling than any other single fan in the system...potentially pushing some GPU heat onto the mobo/M.2/memory? (idk can't tell those exact orientations from those pics).  I can't say it would be detrimental, just that it'll definitely be the lowest single-fan contribution to the system's cooling.

OK perfect thank you very much. Finally I decided to buy a new case, a Corsair 4000D and 6 new fans. 

 

Just a little question if you would know, I have one argb header on my motherboard that I know of. If I want to plug 6 fans so I can control all of them. Is it possible just with that header? I guess if I put a certain color it will be the same everywhere. 

 

What would I need so I can control all my fan speed and colors? A hub, controller or something else? My 2 fans on my radiator will also be argb so not sure if my CPU fan header can control argb fans? I also want my CPU fans to check the CPU temp and not go at the same speed as all the other case fans. 

 

Trying to figure out how to plug all 6 fans. 

 

Here's my motherboard layout below. 

[JLssg4]

Unfortunately I'm no help there...it could require a hub, and ideally you're looking closely at compatibility with Asus aura sync to end up with everything working together with the rest of the system lighting. (my system came with a fan hub for the case fans...and I can't get it to aura sync with the rest of my aRGB...supposed to be compatible, but there's something down this rabbit hole I'm not really understanding, so I'll refrain from any ill-thought-out advice .) 

[Ralfi]

7 hours ago, EvilGenius said:

Corsair 4000D and 6 new fans

If it's the Airflow version, you've done well.

 

I have it & my fan setup (post-extensive testing) can be found in my sig for reference.

 

Found 5 fans were best (3 intake, 2 exhaust + a spare as intake that only gets used when temps are very high - Summer).

 

I have my 3 intake fans daisy-chained to one Fan Header ("System 6 Pump") & also 1 of 2 motherboard ARGB Header.

 

& my CPU fan + 2 exhaust fans daisy-chained to the CPU Fan Header & 2 of 2 motherboard ARGB Header.

 

(The spare intake fan is on its own another Fan Header as it's a different brand to the others. It's not RGB, so no header needed for that).

 

I just use my motherboard's fan control software to set what temp sensor each Fan Header is governed by.

 

I use my motherboard's RGB software to control the fan/motherboard lights.

[TPCEA]

For the lights, the aRGB header should be enough for 6, probably more. The rest, if plugged into one PWM header will change speeds according to the setting for that header and their RPM  range. If you don't see that the header is being used in BIOS, that means you've attached too many fans, overdrawing the current, which can eventually damage something. When in doubt, use 2 or more headers which will also give you greater control. 

You could get a control hub. If it draws power separately from the psu, you can plug in however many it can handle. If it has a lighting node like on my 5000x, however, that draws power from the header and can't handle over probably 1 Amp draw total (the documentation is useless).