Ryzen 7700x or Intel 13700k

[Gauzl]

Buy the 7700X now or wait for the 13700k for gaming performance. Thoughts?

[Mister Woof]

Impossible to tell based on only having data for one.

But, wait for both to be tested to make a choice. Don't buy anything now.

[PDifolco]

IMO the 7900X and 7950X are good choices for hi end/productivity builds

But below that, the 13600K value just demolishes the 7600X and 7700X, now that Intel put 8 Ecores on it they keep the single core advantage and compensate productivity loads with ecores

And the price is similar to a 7600X...

[Xii-Nyth]

Motherboards and drr5 are pricey, and ur likely gpu bound. 7000 series vcache would probably make other things "obsolete" for gaming if you dont ned over 8 cores (a single ccx with cache all in one palce would be better for games)

 

I seemed crazy for pairing a 1600 with a 1080 ti back in the day, was gpu bound at 1440 and the 1600 with fast ram now beats the 7700k in largely threaded new games.

 

Will get a 5600 non x for pairing with a rx 7800xt for 4k, unless the 5800x3d drops in price to a reasonable amount

[jaslion]

10 minutes ago, Gauzl said:

Buy the 7700X now or wait for the 13700k for gaming performance. Thoughts?

For gaming the 5800x3d makes the most sense.

[Mister Woof]

7 minutes ago, Xii-Nyth said:

Motherboards and drr5 are pricey, and ur likely gpu bound. 7000 series vcache would probably make other things "obsolete" for gaming if you dont ned over 8 cores (a single ccx with cache all in one palce would be better for games)

This. Currently, you can get Z690 boards with flashback for cheap, like $150, unlike AM5 boards.  Additionally, Newegg already has preorders up for Z790 boards that are modestly priced under $300. Also, the pre-order price for the i5-13600KF is up.

 

i5-13600KF $310

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i5-13600kf-core-i5-13th-gen/p/N82E16819118417?Description=13600kf&cm_re=13600kf-_-19-118-417-_-Product&quicklink=true

 

MSI Z790-P $249

https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813144571?Description=z790&cm_re=z790-_-13-144-571-_-Product

 

MSI Z690 with flashback $159

https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813144504?Description=msi z690&cm_re=msi_z690-_-13-144-504-_-Product

 

My overall guess: 

 

12th gen and Zen4 IPC seems very close. I'm talking within a handful of points in CBr23 single thread. In multi-core performance, Intel loses presently because after 8 P-cores, they supplement performance with E-cores whereas AMD uses all full power cores. In gaming, the 12900K and new Zen4 chips are almost identical. In multi-core workloads, the e-cores don't keep up with AMD's full power cores.

 

13th gen has a small IPC uplift as well as frequency uplift. They claim 15% single threaded performance uplift and 41% multi-core uplift. Most of the single threaded performance uplift is going to be from frequency, a bit from refinement and cache increases. Most of the multi-threaded improvement is going to be from loading up more E-cores.

if I had to guess, then I would say that 13th gen will have slightly better single-threaded performance and thus, gaming and other lightly-threaded apps. It will try to make up ground in multi-thread from only having 8 P-cores by adding a buttload more E-cores, which will help close the gap with the 7900x and 7950x's more full-power cores, but probably come up short, despite the increase in E-core frequency and cache.

 

You'll not lose either way, probably.

 

Don't pre-order. This is just for reference.

[Xii-Nyth]

2 minutes ago, jaslion said:

For gaming the 5800x3d makes the most sense.

too expensive rn imo, if u want max gamign performance and lots of money get the 7800x3d and pay high prices for am5 in in feburary (ces announcement). DO not pay mroe than 300$ for a motherboard or I will explode

[Xii-Nyth]

2 minutes ago, Shimmy Gummi said:

This. Currently, you can get Z690 boards with flashback for cheap. Additionally, Newegg already has preorders up for Z790 boards that are modestly priced under $300.

 

My overall guess: 

 

12th gen and Zen4 IPC seems very close. In multi-core performance, Intel loses presently because after 8 P-cores, they supplement performance with E-cores whereas AMD uses all full power cores. In gaming, the 12900K and new Zen4 chips are almost identical. In multi-core workloads, the e-cores don't keep up with AMD's full power cores.

 

13th gen has a small IPC uplift as well as frequency uplift. They claim 15% single threaded performance uplift and 41% multi-core uplift. Most of the single threaded performance uplift is going to be from frequency, a bit from refinement and cache increases. Most of the multi-threaded improvement is going to be from loading up more E-cores.

if I had to guess, then I would say that 13th gen will have slightly better single-threaded performance and thus, gaming and other lightly-threaded apps. It will try to make up ground in multi-thread from only having 8 P-cores by adding a buttload more E-cores, which will help close the gap with the 7900x and 7950x's more full-power cores, but probably come up short, despite the increase in E-core frequency and cache.

 

You'll not lost either way, though.

yep, I dont trust e cores, (in rare occasions hyperthreading even), but intel is a good value esp with ddr4. Would be even cheaper after 13th gen launch if you happen to live in the states and can go to microcenter in store (I dont)

[Xii-Nyth]

15 minutes ago, Gauzl said:

Buy the 7700X now or wait for the 13700k for gaming performance. Thoughts?

completely missed you specified gaming performance, for sure the 7800x3d if you really actually need that. I dont understand 1080p gaming though

[Mister Woof]

1 minute ago, Xii-Nyth said:

yep, I dont trust e cores, (in rare occasions hyperthreading even), but intel is a good value esp with ddr4. Would be even cheaper after 13th gen launch if you happen to live in the states and can go to microcenter in store (I dont)

missed some edits, but you can pair an i5-13600KF (preorder price up on newegg, $310) with a cheap MSI Z690 DDR5 Wifi for $160.

 

It has flashback, and it looks like it's already got an update as of July with new chip support.

 

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/PRO-Z690-A/support#bios

[Gauzl]

2 minutes ago, Xii-Nyth said:

completely missed you specified gaming performance, for sure the 7800x3d if you really actually need that. I dont understand 1080p gaming though

Won't that cost much more than the standard version? The 13700k will cost me $820 and the 7700x will cost $690 Australian dollars, I'm maxing out my budget at the $820 for the CPU.

[Xii-Nyth]

2 minutes ago, Gauzl said:

Won't that cost much more than the standard version? The 13700k will cost me $820 and the 7700x will cost $690 Australian dollars, I'm maxing out my budget at the $820 for the CPU.

yes it will, buit the motherboards on that platform are like 600$ for a gaming pro carbon which was 173$ on x370, so I assumed u had infinite money

[Mister Woof]

3 minutes ago, Gauzl said:

Won't that cost much more than the standard version? The 13700k will cost me $820 and the 7700x will cost $690 Australian dollars, I'm maxing out my budget at the $820 for the CPU.

if you're just gaming, chances are you're better off with a 13600KF or the 7600X than the other chips for the money - but the price of AM5 motherboards make the 6 core AMD chips not a good value taken in tandem 

[Xii-Nyth]

2 minutes ago, Shimmy Gummi said:

if you're just gaming, chances are you're better off with a 13600KF or the 7600X than the other chips for the money - but the price of AM5 motherboards make the 6 core AMD chips not a good value taken in tandem 

agreed, in value for money what the other guy mentioned about z690 boards getting support for 13th gen seems the best option, I assumed they were compatible. Maybe thats drr5 only? If it is id jsut go with 12 gen ot 5th gen with ddr4 for vlaue for money in games

[Mister Woof]

Just now, Xii-Nyth said:

agreed, in value for money what the other guy mentioned about z690 boards getting support for 13th gen seems the best option, I assumed they were compatible. Maybe thats drr5 only? If it is id jsut go with 12 gen ot 5th gen with ddr4 for vlaue for money in games

They seem to have support for both. Although since DDR5 is getting cheaper I just put the DDR5 in there as it seems it's finally starting to help when extremely CPU limited.

 

The reviews this time said they had a hell of a time even GETTING a CPU limitation.....might have to wait for 4000 series graphics cards to be out to really see the differences between 13th gen and Zen4

[Gauzl]

15 minutes ago, Shimmy Gummi said:

if you're just gaming, chances are you're better off with a 13600KF or the 7600X than the other chips for the money - but the price of AM5 motherboards make the 6 core AMD chips not a good value taken in tandem 

I'm not really worried about best value, but I have to draw a line at spending more than $820 for a 13700K, I'm also getting either a 4080 16GB or similar from AMD.

[Xii-Nyth]

10 minutes ago, Shimmy Gummi said:

They seem to have support for both. Although since DDR5 is getting cheaper I just put the DDR5 in there as it seems it's finally starting to help when extremely CPU limited.

 

The reviews this time said they had a hell of a time even GETTING a CPU limitation.....might have to wait for 4000 series graphics cards to be out to really see the differences between 13th gen and Zen4

I mean even at 1080p people were gpu limited (I blame "rtx" for people forgetting more efficient lighting techniques light a good old frame buffer copy baked onto a surface and moving around at the angle u look at it. Now a 3060 beats a 1080 ti just bc its better at one thing and worse at everthing else). In my option 1080 gaming kinda sucks, but newer games forget about texture detail alot anyways, but 1440p is minimum for even old games with no lighting im making texture packs for, or you barely notice a difference between the original 64x textures after the blur gets applied, when at a distance (at 1080) and theres a big uplift going to 4k.

Then again in new games like saints row for example even up close the faces are mostly just a ssolid colour with sun shining on them.

 

Got off topic here, but in general I think 1080 gaming is just bad if oyu actually care about visuals.. Just seems odd to target max settings at 1080p when you can barely tell the difference from low from more than a meter away

[Xii-Nyth]

6 minutes ago, Gauzl said:

I'm not really worried about best value, but I have to draw a line at spending more than $820 for a 13700K, I'm also getting either a 4080 16GB or similar from AMD.

can I ask what resolution you plan to play at?

 

[Mister Woof]

6 minutes ago, Gauzl said:

I'm not really worried about best value, but I have to draw a line at spending more than $820 for a 13700K, I'm also getting either a 4080 16GB or similar from AMD.

where are you getting $820 anyway?

 

if you're in the USA, you can get them for $429 for the KF

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i7-13700kf-core-i7-13th-gen/p/N82E16819118415?Description=i7-13700kf&cm_re=i7-13700kf-_-19-118-415-_-Product&quicklink=true

 

and a new Z790 DDR5 motherboard for $249

https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813144571?Description=z790&cm_re=z790-_-13-144-571-_-Product

 

or a Z690 with flashback for $160.

[Gauzl]

Just now, Xii-Nyth said:

can I ask what resolution you plan to play at?

 

3440x1440p

[Gauzl]

Just now, Shimmy Gummi said:

where are you getting $820 anyway?

 

if you're in the USA, you can get them for $429 for the KF

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i7-13700kf-core-i7-13th-gen/p/N82E16819118415?Description=i7-13700kf&cm_re=i7-13700kf-_-19-118-415-_-Product&quicklink=true

 

and a new Z790 DDR5 motherboard for $249

https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813144571?Description=z790&cm_re=z790-_-13-144-571-_-Product

 

or a Z690 with flashback for $160.

Australian dollars. Check out pccasegear.com.au as that's where I buy from.

[Xii-Nyth]

16 minutes ago, Gauzl said:

Australian dollars. Check out pccasegear.com.au as that's where I buy from.

yeah in the same boat in canada, terrible prices

[Xii-Nyth]

17 minutes ago, Gauzl said:

3440x1440p

I would not worry about the cpu whatsoever, in fact is its only for gaming and nothing else, and you want to play at high/max in the newest and future games you would get better performance buying ryzen 3000 on the used market with a bundle with a motherboard or something, and with the money you saved get a 4090 or 7970 xt or whatever it ends up being called or a mystery 7990 for old times sake?

[Xii-Nyth]

Just now, Xii-Nyth said:

I would not worry about the cpu whatsoever, in fact is its only for gaming and nothing else, and you want to play at high/max in the newest and future games you would get better performance buying ryzen 3000 on the used market with a bundle with a motherboard or something, and with the money you saved get a 4090 or 7970 xt or whatever it ends up being called or a mystery 7990 for old times sake?

well ok with a 7990 dual gpu or something crazy (0.1% chance this exists) you would be bottlenecked by a 3000 series at that point lol