HDR is washed out?

[Lord Szechenyi]

1000th post! NICE

 

With HDR

 

No HDR

 

HDR

 

No HDR

 

 

I don't understand what's wrong...

 

Using an RTX 3070 connected via DP to an LG 32UN500-W, and watching youtube with Chrome on Windows 10.

(I haven't tried using HDMI yet, would that fix the issue?)

[Lord Szechenyi]

This is the video I used for the test 

 

[Noah0302]

Your screens seems to only have 350 nits.

HDR 400 certification is basically no real HDR, just marketing.

 

Before I upgraded my old Samsung Q60R to a new LG G2, HDR also looked like shit and I had to watch in SDR since everything was washed out. It looked like a grey filter over everything.

[Lord Szechenyi]

1 minute ago, Noah0302 said:

Your screens seems to only have 350 nits, which is not enough for real HDR.

HDR 400 is basically no real HDR.

so basically you're telling me

"you done goofed choosing that display"

[mystery_xD]

Did this happen as you started using monitor or has it worked fine before?

 

Could be due to misconfigured settings - and I know it camera isn't as easy to tell for me but it could be just unrealistic expectations of HDR. HDR is on on windows. Right?

[Lord Szechenyi]

Just now, mystery_xD said:

Did this happen as you started using monitor or has it worked fine before?

 

Could be due to misconfigured settings - and I know it camera isn't as easy to tell for me but it could be just unrealistic expectations of HDR. HDR is on on windows. Right?

(of course HDR is on lol)

I was using a 1070 on a different (also Win 10) PC connected via HDMI to the same display, I had lots of problems because VP9 wasn't supported by the 1070 and the CPU would decode the 4k hdr videos which would sometime drop frames, the color wasn't nearly as washed out though.

 

Which is why I'm asking if I should try using HDMI with this 3070.

[Noah0302]

2 minutes ago, Lord Szechenyi said:

so basically you're telling me

"you done goofed choosing that display"

It would seem like that to me.

 

Here is a good Video from Hardware Unboxed about the "fake HDR" aspect of monitors.

Right at that timestamp:

 

[Alvin853]

2 minutes ago, Noah0302 said:

Your screens seems to only have 350 nits, which is not enough for real HDR.

HDR 400 is basically no real HDR.

 

Before I upgraded my old Samsung Q60R to a new LG G2, HDR also looked like shit and I had to watch in SDR since everything was washed out. It looked like a grey filter over everything.

I agree the screen is not really HDR capable, but the peak brightness should not cause the image to look washed out. This is some really bad tone mapping from LG or Youtube, not sure at what part of the process the tone mapping is applied. Basically the display can't represent all of the HDR colors, so different shades of a color that exceed the native dynamic range of the display would all look the same, the color can't get more saturated than 100% saturation. So to keep differences between shades of a color, all other colors will be reduced in saturation during the tone mapping process making them look washed out. 

 

It's just that usually higher peak brightness screens also have better color coverage, making them a much better HDR experience.

[Andrewtst]

18 minutes ago, Lord Szechenyi said:

1000th post! NICE

 

With HDR

 

No HDR

 

HDR

 

No HDR

 

 

I don't understand what's wrong...

 

Using an RTX 3070 connected via DP to an LG 32UN500-W, and watching youtube with Chrome on Windows 10.

(I haven't tried using HDMI yet, would that fix the issue?)

Because your monitor LG 32UN500-W spec is not meet the HDR requirement, it only support but not meet the requirement. 

 

Your screen brightness is only 350 cd/m² which is not even reach the minimum requirement of HDR 400 where already not good.

This kind of spec will have wash out in HDR.

 

For HDR to work in good, following requirement should be meet.

• HDR 600 and above
• Local Dimming (Not a must but recommended)
• 1.07B colors (10-bit or 8-bit+FRC)

For the best experience with perfect HDR, your monitor should meet below requirement.

• HDR 1000 and above
• Mini LED with 1000+ local dimming zone in VA/IPS panel or OLED panel
• 1.07B colors (10-bit or 8-bit+FRC)

[Lord Szechenyi]

15 minutes ago, Alvin853 said:

I agree the screen is not really HDR capable, but the peak brightness should not cause the image to look washed out

Yes, the other people in this thread are telling me my monitor isn't HDR capable, I get that it won't attain "true" HDR but even then it shouldn't look nearly this bad.

[Andrewtst]

Just now, Lord Szechenyi said:

Yes, the other people in this thread are telling me my monitor isn't HDR capable, I get that it won't attain "true" HDR but even then it shouldn't look nearly this bad.

It will be look that bad and nothing can do about it but only accept the reality. 

[Lord Szechenyi]

19 minutes ago, Alvin853 said:

This is some really bad tone mapping from LG or Youtube

It could be youtube, which is why I'm going to "Totally not pirate the movie" and look if maybe Youtube (or rather the uploader) did something wrong.

[Lord Szechenyi]

2 minutes ago, Andrewtst said:

It will be look that bad and nothing can do about it but only accept the reality. 

Then why wasn't it that bad with the previous config, which used the SAME MONITOR?

[Andrewtst]

5 minutes ago, Lord Szechenyi said:

Then why wasn't it that bad with the previous config, which used the SAME MONITOR?

For SDR, your monitor brightness is far than enough but not for HDR.

 

This is what I get using the sample video you provide, in actual it is even better but very hard to capture to be exact using mobile phone camera.

[Lord Szechenyi]

5 minutes ago, Lord Szechenyi said:

It could be youtube, which is why I'm going to "Totally not pirate the movie" and look if maybe Youtube (or rather the uploader) did something wrong.

Yeah no it's identical

(then again the pirate I MEAN THE PUBLISHER could have messed up in the reencoding)

[Lord Szechenyi]

1 minute ago, Andrewtst said:

For SDR, your monitor brightness is far than enough but not for HDR.

But on the previous config I also used HDR...

[Andrewtst]

1 minute ago, Lord Szechenyi said:

But on the previous config I also used HDR...

"because VP9 wasn't supported by the 1070" - in this case it is software render and it is auto convert to SDR when you playback the movie.

[xg32]

4 minutes ago, Lord Szechenyi said:

.

no matter what you do the monitor will look worse in hdr, if it look worse on the 3070 than the 1070 it can just be different setting in windows with the cards

 

Looking at the picture brightness is too high, contrast is too low, try messing around in NVCP, either way it'll be limited by the monitor itself.

 

[Lord Szechenyi]

16 minutes ago, Andrewtst said:

"because VP9 wasn't supported by the 1070" - in this case it is software render and it is auto convert to SDR when you playback the movie.

It wasn't converted to SDR, it's just that the CPU did the decoding and it wasn't powerful enough to handle 4k hdr and would drop about 1 frame per second (which is disturbing when you watch something at 24fps)

[Lord Szechenyi]

16 minutes ago, xg32 said:

contrast is too low

it's at maximum lol

[BetteBalterZen]

Just to add; 

Most monitors really just suck a** when it comes to HDR. You kinda need either some type of OLED or a monitor with FALD. 

My own CRG9 with 1000 nits, the HDR performance sometimes look kinda good but mostly bad because of the 10 dimming zones, you need hundreds to make it actually usable in HDR. That said, some games lets you tweak midpoints in HDR and this actually make it look really good, a lot better than SDR. Take FH5 for example, the way you can tweak HDR in that game, that's good and works well with the CRG9. But then again, it can display a 1000 nits compared to yours with 3/400 nits. 

As other have stated, your monitors HDR400 certification is just pure marketing. And a REMUX 2160p HDR movie won't change anything. 

[Andrewtst]

33 minutes ago, Lord Szechenyi said:

It wasn't converted to SDR, it's just that the CPU did the decoding and it wasn't powerful enough to handle 4k hdr and would drop about 1 frame per second (which is disturbing when you watch something at 24fps)

Nor-matter what, the hardware is way too low for HDR playback in it suppose output. Believe it or not, no one can help you but yourself need to accept the fact. HDR 400 certification already is bad and your monitor is not even in the range of 400.

[Lord Szechenyi]

52 minutes ago, BetteBalterZen said:

Just to add; 

Most monitor really just suck a** when it comes to HDR. You kinda need either some type of OLED or a monitor with FALD. 

My own CRG9 with 1000 nits, the HDR performance sometimes look kinda good but mostly bad because of the 10 dimming zones, you need hundreds to make it actually usable in HDR. That said, some games lets you tweak midpoints in HDR and this actually make it look really good, a lot better than SDR. Take FH5 for example, the way you can tweak HDR in that game, that's good and works well with the CRG9. But then again, it can display a 1000 nits compared to yours with 3/400 nits. 

As other have stated, your monitors HDR400 certification is just pure marketing. And a REMUX 2160p HDR movie won't change anything. 

So just to be sure, you recommend me to just turn off HDR altogether?

[BetteBalterZen]

Just now, Lord Szechenyi said:

So just to be sure, you recommend me to just turn off HDR altogether?

For most content, yes, I would. But I'd still experiement with HDR in games with good HDR tweakable settings. You may be able to get an okay-ish HDR experience in some games, if you can tweak the HDR properly - like in FH5 for example. 

[Lord Szechenyi]

Just now, BetteBalterZen said:

But I'd still experiement with HDR in games

I mostly play older (5+ or more years) games, only game that has HDR option that I play is Hitman 3, and that one had issues (game's fault, lots of people reported this) with HDR.