Smart Plug Suggestions

[Oshino Shinobu]

Hi, honestly not even sure where this would fall under as there's no smart home kind of subforum, so networking it is.

 

So I'm looking for a smart plug (UK Outlet) that allows for remote management outside of the local network. Doesn't need to be anything fancy, literally just need to be able to turn on the outlet or turn it off from a mobile device from outside the network. 

 

I've bought a Ubiquiti G3 Flex to use as a pet cam for when everyone's out of the house. I don't like the idea of having a camera always accessible inside the house and as much as I like Ubiquiti's products, UniFi Protect is seriously lacking in basic features and you cannot turn cameras on and off through the built in software, so a smart plug is the remaining option.

 

Ideal option would be to have the plug itself only communicate locally with a controller (preferably that can be run on your own hardware), then the mobile app communicates with the controller as a relay. That way I can lock down the VM running the controller and have better control over it in terms of security. Looking at other pet cam type options, multiple have 2 year old critical security flaws that have never been fixed, hence going down this route instead. 

 

[Lurick]

Look into a Vera controller and Zwave or Zigbee gear, I'm not 100% sure what they have on the UK side of things but they should have UK variants of wall plugs.

[Falcon1986]

@Oshino Shinobu

 

Isn’t the G3 Flex a PoE camera? You want to be able to cut PoE power?

[Oshino Shinobu]

11 minutes ago, Falcon1986 said:

@Oshino Shinobu

 

Isn’t the G3 Flex a PoE camera? You want to be able to cut PoE power?

It's USB C, though I can get a 802.3af adaptor to power it over PoE. I'd go down that route and just cut PoE via my UniFi controller normally, however it's not only me who needs to be able to access this, so it needs to be simple with basically a single button to turn it off and on. And again, as much as I like UniFi stuff, it's seriously lacking in features for detailed permission management so you basically have to give access to all of it or none of it and I don't trust others to not accidently turn off PoE to an access point or the outdoor cameras or something. If I had it my way I'd be using a VPN to go into the network to control stuff, which is how I currently manage my UniFi controller as I'm the only one who needs access to it.

 

 

15 minutes ago, Lurick said:

Look into a Vera controller and Zwave or Zigbee gear, I'm not 100% sure what they have on the UK side of things but they should have UK variants of wall plugs.

From what I've seen on Zwave, the support is pretty poor in the UK. I'm considering home assistant, though I've seen talk of needing to flash them to a different OS in order to use them properly. Honestly I kind of hate smart home stuff that basically all insist on calling home in order to function. 

 

I know TP-Link have some smart plugs, which is at least a known brand that I have at least a little level of trust in. I'd have to see how much I can lock it down though as I'd want any IoT device with direct internet access as little access to the rest of the network as possible. Might experiment with creating a separate SSID and cutting it off from everything but the router for internet access.

[Falcon1986]

@Oshino Shinobu

 

And why not use UniFi Protect through the cloud?

 

33 minutes ago, Oshino Shinobu said:

I don't like the idea of having a camera always accessible inside the house

But in order to access the Controller, you still need login credentials whether it’s for the local Controller or a cloud-based Controller, correct?

[Oshino Shinobu]

Just now, Falcon1986 said:

And why not use UniFi Protect through the cloud?

I do... I don't have the controller accessible through the cloud but protect is. 

 

1 minute ago, Falcon1986 said:

But in order to access the Controller, you still need login credentials whether it’s for the local Controller or a cloud-based Controller, correct?

Yes, you need login credentials. Accessing the camera isn't a problem. I'm also not particularly worried about unauthorised access (though Ubiquiti's handling of the recent data breach doesn't inspire confidence. Big reason I have don't have the controller directly accessible via the cloud when it doesn't need to be). The issue for me is having the camera always on and accessible by those with access when it doesn't need to be. I want it to be turned off when people are home and only be turned on when outside the house with the dog left alone. 

[Falcon1986]

@Oshino Shinobu

 

OK, I get what you’re saying.

 

So the “other user” is allowed to access your UniFi Protect to see your camera but you don’t want them to have access when your family is at home?

 

I was looking through the Protect documentation and don’t see any ability to fine-tune which specific users have access to and during what times of day. That would have been the more elegant way of doing this, but I guess you can request it in future versions.

 

As for smart plugs with remote access, I found this TP-Link Kasa Mini (1-unit) that doesn’t require a separate hub. It will connect to your existing WiFi for on/off control through the app whether you’re at home or away. Seems to have good reviews.

[Oshino Shinobu]

38 minutes ago, Falcon1986 said:

@Oshino Shinobu

 

OK, I get what you’re saying.

 

So the “other user” is allowed to access your UniFi Protect to see your camera but you don’t want them to have access when your family is at home?

 

I was looking through the Protect documentation and don’t see any ability to fine-tune which specific users have access to and during what times of day. That would have been the more elegant way of doing this, but I guess you can request it in future versions.

 

As for smart plugs with remote access, I found this TP-Link Kasa Mini (1-unit) that doesn’t require a separate hub. It will connect to your existing WiFi for on/off control through the app whether you’re at home or away. Seems to have good reviews.

Kind of. Only my family has access to it, but I want it to be off unless it's deliberately turned on. It's not a permissions issue in Protect, though there are plenty of them already, such as not being able to separate the permissions to view live cameras and recordings, a feature which was present in the EoL UniFi Video. It's honestly not a system ready for production environments and certainly not for business use. Hell, the lack of ability to lock down recordings access makes it outright illegal for business use in some countries with laws regarding live view and recordings permissions without purchasing their live view video output devices.

 

I'm looking at those TP-Link plugs you mentioned. Might be the way to go for simplicity, though I'm still not a fan of them requiring direct internet access and essentially phoning home in order to function. I've just installed Home Assistant on a VM and I'm playing around with it. Looks like these can be flashed and used in local only mode with HA, meaning I can basically put them on a super restrictive WLAN and have everything route through the HA VM.

 

This isn't a matter of permissions or restricting access, it's just being able to turn the camera on and off on demand. I have access to the camera already configured and working. I don't want it on when anyone is home. The end goal is basically the achieve the same thing as unplugging the camera when home and only plug it in when everyone has left the house, though obviously people forget to do this, so being able to manage it remotely is the best solution.

 

Bit of a tangent, but here's my reasoning for this: It's a privacy issue for me. I'm against having a camera in the house at all but this is basically me coming to a compromise with others I live with. The outside cameras are always on and accessible and will record on motion, which is good, but having a camera on in the house makes it very easy and tempting for a user to check the live view on that camera as it's all in the same app. I want to separate it so in order to do that you have to deliberately turn the camera on, which would serve as a bit of a phycological barrier to prevent that kind of behaviour. It's not even that I don't trust others with it, I just think it's too tempting. I almost always have the outdoor live views active on one of my monitors and it's been helpful for deliveries and even spotting when the dog's escaped to the front drive. I feel like having the same ease of access to a camera inside the house crosses a line without having to deliberately turn the camera on first.

[Oshino Shinobu]

@Falcon1986 @Lurick

 

Opted to go for the TP-Link Kasa Mini in the end. Figured since it always needs to go through the internet to work, I've set up a separate WLAN that is completely isolated from the rest of the network and only has internet access. Still would like to look into Home Assistant in the future, but it's a bit more complex when trying to secure it while still allowing remote and local access at the same time, Figured having IoT stuff with zero access to the local network means I don't have to worry about anything on there, though it's literally going to be a single device on there.