Building a programmer PC with upgradeability in mind

[tfrascaroli]

 

1. Budget & Location Around 750€, it can go above that but it would have to be very much needed. Otherwise lowest price is prefered

2. Aim

I'm a professional programmer, would use this machine to work from home. I need it for work, I'd like to game on it, but I don't usually (never, really) play AAA titles. Mostly Cities: Skyline, Minecraft, esports titles, that sort of stuff. 
As a programmer I mostly compile stuff, but usually debug a lot of stuff in Chrom (webdev), so I need a good amount of RAM, I think 16Gb min. I also work a bit with Blender and Unity, thus needing CPU cores and GPU. Basically everything....

Now, my main goal is to not limit myself with stupid purchases, in order to upgrade later to better components/add new components, probably through next year.

Having WIFI in the motherboard is pretty much a necessity, unless there's a motherboard + wifi card that's better value. I will eventually wire it, but right now it is needed.

3. Monitors

two monitors is absolutely needed. Three would be awesome, although not needed.

4. Peripherals

I don't care much for this right now. I'm used to crapy keyboard and mouse, I can keep using them for now.

5. Why are you upgrading?

Because I have a 10 yo laptop right now. Imagine working with that...

 

Again, just to enmphasize, the system doesn't have to do everything right now, just provide the basics so that I don't have to upgrade the entire thing down the line.

I was thinking motherboard + case + power supply + storage + RAM SHOULD be defined now, so I don't have to change them later.

Then going for a Zen2 APU for now and upgrading to a discrete GPU later, and then upgrading the CPU later.

 

This is what I came up with, but I'm pretty sure I'm being stupid somewhere because it's too expensive https://es.pcpartpicker.com/list/VvPLQq

 

Thank you!

 

[tfrascaroli]

3 minutes ago, NZgamer said:

The build you have right now is alright although I would make a few changes

- You don't need an aftermarket cooler, the 3400G has a decent stock cooler

- You don't need an X570 motherboard, B450 will work fine

Thanks for the quick repply. Sure, I don't need an X570, I wanted a B550 (they don't have any at that site) 'cause I was thinking of upgrading to Zen3 next year. Does that make any sense?

[ki8aras]

you can ditch the x570 mobo for a b450 or b550 and get something like more memory or storage

[Infernomoonsault]

1 minute ago, NZgamer said:

B450 Will be compatible with Zen 3

Yeah I agree. But a 'Beta BIOS' is never the best option because of stability and stuff like that. Also, adding support for Zen3 is upto the manufacturer really so it would be nicer to be on the safer side.

[ki8aras]

Just now, Infernomoonsault said:

Yeah I agree. But a 'Beta BIOS' is never the best option because of stability and stuff like that. Also, adding support for Zen3 is upto the manufacturer really so it would be nicer to be on the safer side.

yeah b550 is a much safer bet

[marmour]

You could save money in a few areas:

-Dont get a Samsung SSD. Could save €90 and get  twice the storage from another drive, with only a minimal performance dip in most workflows.

-B550 would be better if you can find a decent €150-180 board in your region. If you do go X570, look for the new MSI tomohawk board.

-Could get the 3200G if you want to save a bit more

-if you care about aesthetics you can get the black edition of the 212 for very little extra

 

Edit: read the pricing wrong on that Samsung drive. Can still get twice the capacity for that price though.

[Mateyyy]

PCPartPicker Part List: https://es.pcpartpicker.com/list/HpqXcq

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor  (€176.15 @ Amazon Espana) 
Motherboard: Asus PRIME X570-P ATX AM4 Motherboard  (€188.85 @ PC Componentes) 
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory  (€193.78 @ Amazon Espana) 
Storage: Kingston A2000 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive  (€125.97 @ LIFE Informatica) 
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 1650 SUPER 4 GB SC ULTRA GAMING Video Card  (€179.90 @ Amazon Espana) 
Case: Phanteks Eclipse P300A Mesh ATX Mid Tower Case  (€61.24 @ PC Componentes) 
Power Supply: be quiet! Pure Power 11 CM 500 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply  (€85.83 @ PC Componentes) 
Total: €1011.72

 

or

 

PCPartPicker Part List: https://es.pcpartpicker.com/list/tNRhHB

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3400G 3.7 GHz Quad-Core Processor  (€145.90 @ Amazon Espana) 
Motherboard: Asus PRIME X570-P ATX AM4 Motherboard  (€188.85 @ PC Componentes) 
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory  (€193.78 @ Amazon Espana) 
Storage: Kingston A2000 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive  (€125.97 @ LIFE Informatica) 
Case: Phanteks Eclipse P300A Mesh ATX Mid Tower Case  (€61.24 @ PC Componentes) 
Power Supply: be quiet! Pure Power 11 CM 500 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply  (€85.83 @ PC Componentes) 
Total: €801.57

 

A B550 board would've been ideal here, but apparently there are none in stock in Spain yet, and they're also not compatible with Ryzen 3000 (Zen+) APUs.

The X570 board you selected is mediocre at best. At around the €200 mark you're looking at either the Prime X570-P or the X570 Aorus Elite (or the TUF X570-Plus but that's priced at around €230 currently).

Edited July 10, 2020 by Mateyyy
apparently the 3600 is €30 cheaper because 2020

[tfrascaroli]

2 minutes ago, Mateyyy said:

A B550 board would've been ideal here, but apparently there are none in stock in Spain yet, and they're also not compatible with Ryzen 3000 (Zen+) APUs.

The X570 board you selected is mediocre at best. At around the €200 mark you're looking at either the Prime X570-P or the X570 Aorus Elite (or the TUF X570-Plus but that's priced at around €230 currently).

Oh, wow, I might have been shortsided there. Didn't care to check compatibility with the actual APU I wanted to use. So it seems that X570 is the only option if I want the APU -> CPU + GPU route, is it?

Also thanks for the X570 recomendations.

[tfrascaroli]

12 minutes ago, marmour said:

You could save money in a few areas:

-Dont get a Samsung SSD. Could save €90 and get  twice the storage from another drive, with only a minimal performance dip in most workflows.

-B550 would be better if you can find a decent €150-180 board in your region. If you do go X570, look for the new MSI tomohawk board.

-Could get the 3200G if you want to save a bit more

-if you care about aesthetics you can get the black edition of the 212 for very little extra

 

Edit: read the pricing wrong on that Samsung drive. Can still get twice the capacity for that price though.

Yes, you're right, the Samsung one I didn't really search for better options. It looks like 3000 APUs are not compatible with B550, so I'll have to go X570 if I want to upgrade to Zen3 next year.

The 3200G is a great suggestion.

No Fs given about aesthetics

[Mateyyy]

Just now, tfrascaroli said:

Oh, wow, I might have been shortsided there. Didn't care to check compatibility with the actual APU I wanted to use. So it seems that X570 is the only option if I want the APU -> CPU + GPU route, is it?

Yes, either X570 or B450, but if you can fit a good B550/X570 board in your budget then I'd definitely go that route instead.

 

There will be Zen 2 APUs coming out (including the exciting 8-core 4700G) later this year when Zen 3 launches, but if you need to build the system now then I guess waiting for that isn't really an option.

[tfrascaroli]

2 minutes ago, Mateyyy said:

There will be Zen 2 APUs coming out (including the exciting 8-core 4700G) later this year when Zen 3 launches, but if you need to build the system now then I guess waiting for that isn't really an option.

Yes, I pretty much need it within the next month. Maybe, just maybe, I can manage with my existing laptop, but that might be a royal pain. But if those APUs don't get delayed then that might be a real option, that 4700G looks very juicy for what I need, I might not even need to upgrade CPU after that!

[eGetin]

I would start with 16Gb of RAM for now, and buy some more later when you have budget for that. Also just buy the cheapest sticks with the right specs and forget the RGB that you have in there

 

Also buy the cheapest NVMe drive with necessary capacity and don't pay extra for Samsung branding. Even if there is a slight difference on paper you are not going to notice it in real life use. Same thing goes with power supply; paying 100e for a 550W PSU is just too much unless there are absolutely no cheaper options available currently. Corsair has cheaper options available as well, and with a tight budget, I would actually stick with a non-modular one and use the money where it really matters.

 

I'm a web software developer myself as well and I just can't stress enough the importance of a good CPU. Although, lots of cores doesn't make sense if you aren't specifically developing multi-threaded server software, so I would probably in your case buy 3300X and source a cheap used GPU for getting the picture on the screen. 16Gb of RAM will be enough for pretty much all scenarios and it's really easy to expand later on if necessary. Just going from 32Gb to 16Gb of RAM enables you to buy either the cheapest new GPU there is available or buying a decent used one. Given all the other cost cuts you might even be able to buy some sort of GTX 1660 variant.

 

Edit: Holy cow the 3300X is expensive right now. Given that, it might actually be wise to go with the 3400G and upgrade it immediately after Zen 3 launch.

 

Edit 2: https://es.pcpartpicker.com/list/Cv6dRk this is what I came up with.

[tfrascaroli]

58 minutes ago, eGetin said:

I would start with 16Gb of RAM for now, and buy some more later when you have budget for that. Also just buy the cheapest sticks with the right specs and forget the RGB that you have in there

 

Also buy the cheapest NVMe drive with necessary capacity and don't pay extra for Samsung branding. Even if there is a slight difference on paper you are not going to notice it in real life use. Same thing goes with power supply; paying 100e for a 550W PSU is just too much unless there are absolutely no cheaper options available currently. Corsair has cheaper options available as well, and with a tight budget, I would actually stick with a non-modular one and use the money where it really matters.

 

I'm a web software developer myself as well and I just can't stress enough the importance of a good CPU. Although, lots of cores doesn't make sense if you aren't specifically developing multi-threaded server software, so I would probably in your case buy 3300X and source a cheap used GPU for getting the picture on the screen. 16Gb of RAM will be enough for pretty much all scenarios and it's really easy to expand later on if necessary. Just going from 32Gb to 16Gb of RAM enables you to buy either the cheapest new GPU there is available or buying a decent used one. Given all the other cost cuts you might even be able to buy some sort of GTX 1660 variant.

 

Edit: Holy cow the 3300X is expensive right now. Given that, it might actually be wise to go with the 3400G and upgrade it immediately after Zen 3 launch.

 

Edit 2: https://es.pcpartpicker.com/list/Cv6dRk this is what I came up with.

Wow that's very detailed, thank you a lot. I didn't pick the rgb ram for the rgb, it was the cheapest option within the first search results. I actually don't want RGB in my build, anywhere :D. The "ditch Samsung" recommendation is something pretty much everyone said, so I'll definitely do that.

16Gb I think is pretty OK for now. Maybe if I have to develop something crazy for Unity I'll need more, but that's highly unlikely really.

I still believe the 3400G -> Zen3 makes the most sense. This way I can drop a serious CPU and GPU in a few months, once I get more cash for it.

The power supply, I thought it helped a great deal with future OC (not right now, future) to have at least silver certified PSU, even if it is "little". Maybe I'm wrong here? I don't want to "cheap out" in stupid corners, but I really don't know if my assumptions here are valid.

[koptr]

17 minutes ago, tfrascaroli said:

Wow that's very detailed, thank you a lot. I didn't pick the rgb ram for the rgb, it was the cheapest option within the first search results. I actually don't want RGB in my build, anywhere :D. The "ditch Samsung" recommendation is something pretty much everyone said, so I'll definitely do that.

16Gb I think is pretty OK for now. Maybe if I have to develop something crazy for Unity I'll need more, but that's highly unlikely really.

I still believe the 3400G -> Zen3 makes the most sense. This way I can drop a serious CPU and GPU in a few months, once I get more cash for it.

The power supply, I thought it helped a great deal with future OC (not right now, future) to have at least silver certified PSU, even if it is "little". Maybe I'm wrong here? I don't want to "cheap out" in stupid corners, but I really don't know if my assumptions here are valid.

If it is a good PSU, it can be just 80+ Bronze. You may spend a little more money for it, take a look at the PSU Tier List or search a Corsair RXm/CXm power supply.

[tfrascaroli]

Thanks! One more thing, I really don't know how to measure if a mid tower ATX case is going to have enough room, can you ellaborate on how would I go about finding that out? I'm pretty sure that, as long as the motherboard fits, that's enough, but I'm absolutely clueless if this is the case.