3900X 3600 C18 memory won't run at speed

[semo]

Hey yall,

 

I recently put together a new rig for myself based on a 3900x - decided to jump the intel ship this year. I am having a hell of a time getting my memory stable at anything other than the default of 2133mhz.

 

Parts:

• AMD 3900X
• Asus Strix X570-E
• G.SKILL TridentZ Neo 3600Mhz C18 (F4-3600C18D-32GTZN)

 

I had it running for a couple of weeks on XMP (DOCP) profile and it randomly froze and will not boot again now unless I reset to defaults. I've taken a pretty large hit on FPS in games like Tarkov.

 

So I've been trying to do as much research as possible, and have tried most of the alternate values that the DRAM calculator gives (especially for procODT). I have also tried a SAFE profile for running it at 3200 and it fails to post in all scenarios. Originally when installing my CPU / RAM it would fail to post until I loosened the CPU cooler a bit. Do I have shitty memory? Shitty CPU? I'm also aware that I'm not the most knowledgeable on memory overclocking, and may have messed up already by getting C18. I admit I am out of my depth here, and was hoping to just slap on the XMP profile and be off. I am willing to purchase a new set at this point if it is what I must do...

 

I am pretty confident that it is Hynix CJR memory based on the taiphoon output (attached) but I have read plenty online about some Trident Z Neo sticks being b-die.

 

I know this can be hard to troubleshoot online, but maybe there is something obvious that I am missing or can try.

 

Any help or tips greatly appreciated,

 

Semo

 

Update: I went from getting about 120-140fps in EFT to about 30-40 today. Not sure if related to above or some windows update.

 

 

G.Skill F4-3600C18-16GTZN.html

[semo]

Any tips? I've been messing with it since Saturday and have not been able to get anything running, even at 3000mhz. I'm starting to give up, not sure if it is the RAM, CPU, or MB.

[Guest]

I want to help. It's a pain in the ass though. Fucking memory CL 18-22-22-22 is just horrible timings at 3600mhz for any platform.

 

The statements on the website are preposterous. 

 

Quote

Engineered and optimized for full compatibility on the latest AMD Ryzen 3000 series processors on AMD X570 chipset motherboards

 

Gimmie an F'n break already. I should be charging companies that advertise this crap in some BS way and watch hoards of people in this very forum get this memory, get crap ass results and I gotta help pull out the other guys hair trying to get a system running with some extra, but most importantly, STABLE memory overclock. 

 

Sigh.

 

Forgive my rant, but the above is why nobody has responded to your request. It's not that you bought the wrong RAM, it's the memory controller that's super picky. For example, even my top B-Die doesn't just post right up XMP profile. Granted it's Zen_+ and not Zen_2, still should be having no issues.

 

_________________

 

For the help part. 

 

enable DOCP.

manually set memory voltage to 1.410v

Set SOC voltage to 1.100v

Disable Gear Down mode.

Disable Power down mode.

Manually set memory target frequency 2666mhz - 3200mhz (we'll start with whatever actually posts and runs, prefer to be a bit above 2133mhz though. 

Leave Infinity Fabric on Auto. It will match the memory frequency, so no need to change it manually unless we notice it doesn't match the effective memory frequency.

 

Give that a go. Once we get you posted and up to 3200mhz, we'll aim for tighter timings and then push for more frequency if it'll let us.

 

Good Luck.

[semo]

On 3/17/2020 at 7:59 PM, ShrimpBrime said:

I want to help. It's a pain in the ass though. Fucking memory CL 18-22-22-22 is just horrible timings at 3600mhz for any platform.

 

The statements on the website are preposterous. 

 

 

Gimmie an F'n break already. I should be charging companies that advertise this crap in some BS way and watch hoards of people in this very forum get this memory, get crap ass results and I gotta help pull out the other guys hair trying to get a system running with some extra, but most importantly, STABLE memory overclock. 

 

Sigh.

 

Forgive my rant, but the above is why nobody has responded to your request. It's not that you bought the wrong RAM, it's the memory controller that's super picky. For example, even my top B-Die doesn't just post right up XMP profile. Granted it's Zen_+ and not Zen_2, still should be having no issues.

 

_________________

 

For the help part. 

 

enable DOCP.

manually set memory voltage to 1.410v

Set SOC voltage to 1.100v

Disable Gear Down mode.

Disable Power down mode.

Manually set memory target frequency 2666mhz - 3200mhz (we'll start with whatever actually posts and runs, prefer to be a bit above 2133mhz though. 

Leave Infinity Fabric on Auto. It will match the memory frequency, so no need to change it manually unless we notice it doesn't match the effective memory frequency.

 

Give that a go. Once we get you posted and up to 3200mhz, we'll aim for tighter timings and then push for more frequency if it'll let us.

 

Good Luck.

Hey Shrimp thanks for the reply, sorry for the late response things have been a bit nuts around here lately. 

 

That's unfortunate, I'll admit that's why I bought it - sounded like a good fit.

 

I was able to try these settings, and the highest I can get a POST is with the target freq. at 2400mhz with D.O.C.P enabled. So that's what I'm running currently at the timings for the set (18-22-22-42). I did notice that it is running at 2T though, and the settings I've been going for all have recommended 1T.

 

I'm willing to drop money on a new set if that would give me a better chance here, but I'm going to give this a bit more of a try seeing if there's anything I can do to get it higher than 2400mhz. FLCK is matching at 1200. Nothing has worked so far

 

Appreciate the detailed response,

 

Semo

[Guest]

50 minutes ago, semo said:

Hey Shrimp thanks for the reply, sorry for the late response things have been a bit nuts around here lately. 

 

That's unfortunate, I'll admit that's why I bought it - sounded like a good fit.

 

I was able to try these settings, and the highest I can get a POST is with the target freq. at 2400mhz with D.O.C.P enabled. So that's what I'm running currently at the timings for the set (18-22-22-42). I did notice that it is running at 2T though, and the settings I've been going for all have recommended 1T.

 

I'm willing to drop money on a new set if that would give me a better chance here, but I'm going to give this a bit more of a try seeing if there's anything I can do to get it higher than 2400mhz. FLCK is matching at 1200. Nothing has worked so far

 

Appreciate the detailed response,

 

Semo

Hey there Semo. If 2400 really is the best you can get from that memory, the Hynix is not for you.

I'm not usually keen on the idea to get people to purchase new memory because it's spending money that you shouldn't need to.....

 

But on that note, we could spend quite a bit of time trying to manually clock this memory. If you'd like to try instead of buying memory, I'm ok with that. But will take a lot of trial and error.

 

If would rather purchase some decent memory for better odds of running higher clocks,

Here I will list a couple desired memory kits. Given the timing set, likely B-die of some quality. 

 

https://www.gskill.com/product/165/326/1562839473/F4-3600C16D-32GTZN-Overview

https://www.neweggbusiness.com/product/product.aspx?item=9b-20-232-860

https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232196

 

[semo]

18 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Hey there Semo. If 2400 really is the best you can get from that memory, the Hynix is not for you.

I'm not usually keen on the idea to get people to purchase new memory because it's spending money that you shouldn't need to.....

 

But on that note, we could spend quite a bit of time trying to manually clock this memory. If you'd like to try instead of buying memory, I'm ok with that. But will take a lot of trial and error.

 

If would rather purchase some decent memory for better odds of running higher clocks,

Here I will list a couple desired memory kits. Given the timing set, likely B-die of some quality. 

 

https://www.gskill.com/product/165/326/1562839473/F4-3600C16D-32GTZN-Overview

https://www.neweggbusiness.com/product/product.aspx?item=9b-20-232-860

https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232196

 

Thanks for the recommendations - I ordered the F4-3600C16D-32GTZN set ($300 ouch). Hopefully it works out better for me than this set. I'm trying to see if Amazon will take a return for it... Meanwhile I'll give this a few more attempts.

 

Appreciate the help, I got rush shipping and will let you know once that shows up!

 

Semo

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, semo said:

Thanks for the recommendations - I ordered the F4-3600C16D-32GTZN set ($300 ouch). Hopefully it works out better for me than this set. I'm trying to see if Amazon will take a return for it... Meanwhile I'll give this a few more attempts.

 

Appreciate the help, I got rush shipping and will let you know once that shows up!

 

Semo

Part of the price tag is flashy memory and the other part is being 32GB. 

 

 

[semo]

On 3/28/2020 at 2:56 PM, ShrimpBrime said:

Part of the price tag is flashy memory and the other part is being 32GB. 

 

 

Hi again! New RAM just came in, and lo and behold... failure to post with X.M.P (DOCP) - using the same methodology as above I'm still only able to POST at 2400Mhz. 1.4100 on DRAM voltage and 1.100 on SOC. Haven't messed with gear / power down yet... But it's not looking promising. Maybe my CPU is bunk.

 

I am going to try DRAM calculator again I suppose.

 

Edit: When I was originally setting up this PC, I would fail to POST until I loosened the CPU cooler. Maybe that has something to do with it? Back then I also removed it and checked for any bent pins, did not notice anything to the untrained eye. I was able to run XMP profile for a couple weeks at like 1.4 DRAM voltage after that as well, until it randomly crashed and failed to boot.

 

Semo

[Guest]

Incrementally increase the memory speed up 1 click from 2400 and see if it posts. Give it 120 seconds. Whats next 2466mhz? Try that..

[semo]

5 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Incrementally increase the memory speed up 1 click from 2400 and see if it posts. Give it 120 seconds. Whats next 2466mhz? Try that..

That is what I tried, next step up from 2400mhz is 2666mhz and it fails to POST. With gear / power disabled as well, same result. When it fails, it tries twice, looks like the RAM lights don't even come on and then reboots into BIOS to reset settings.

 

Thanks for the fast responses by the way

[Guest]

Caught me at just the right time on break.

 

So its jammed up jumping the memory divider from 2400.

 

Do you let it do its thing and it posts in safe mode then?

 

[semo]

3 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Caught me at just the right time on break.

 

So its jammed up jumping the memory divider from 2400.

 

Do you let it do its thing and it posts in safe mode then?

 

I press save, it goes and tries to boot twice (both fail starting the RAM i assume), then back into BIOS (misconfiguration caused your computer to fail to POST, reset settings etc).

[Guest]

Generally it will try settings 3 times and the 4th it will dispaly post error safe mode hit F1 to enter bios. The process may take a couple of minutes.

 

Did you change the counter to 2 times???

 

 

[semo]

1 hour ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Generally it will try settings 3 times and the 4th it will dispaly post error safe mode hit F1 to enter bios. The process may take a couple of minutes.

 

Did you change the counter to 2 times???

 

 

I have not changed any other settings, even after setting optimized defaults it seems to be 2 failures before it goes to safe mode (it doesn't actually fail on defaults, I mean its set to 2 failures).

 

Also the boots fail very quickly, within a few (maybe 5) seconds of power on. So the process is relatively quick.

[Guest]

We are missing something here. 

I cant visit the bios on my board for thoughts because I have removed it for a competition for this month.

 

Can you take some bios screen shots maybe?? 

Do the screen shot with settings that Do work and post please.

[rorythedawg]

I think the key to this is hidden in the OPs update

 

"Update: I went from getting about 120-140fps in EFT to about 30-40 today. Not sure if related to above or some windows update."

 

If his ram was running stable at 2133 he should not be getting FPS drops in the hundreds compared to running at 3600 regardless of timings. 

As such I think the issue is with a different part of the system and the RAM is being affected and therefor cannot run on its XMP profiles. Maybe this is power related? 

Can you ensure all your mobo power cables are fully plugged in, I know sounds basic but a 100fps drop is not explainable by slower RAM alone and I bet whatever caused that is causing the RAM issues as well. 

[semo]

32 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

We are missing something here. 

I cant visit the bios on my board for thoughts because I have removed it for a competition for this month.

 

Can you take some bios screen shots maybe?? 

Do the screen shot with settings that Do work and post please.

I've attached "screenshots" (please excuse the quality) of the optimized defaults as well as the working 2400Mhz clock that you suggested above

 

27 minutes ago, rorythedawg said:

I think the key to this is hidden in the OPs update

 

"Update: I went from getting about 120-140fps in EFT to about 30-40 today. Not sure if related to above or some windows update."

 

If his ram was running stable at 2133 he should not be getting FPS drops in the hundreds compared to running at 3600 regardless of timings. 

As such I think the issue is with a different part of the system and the RAM is being affected and therefor cannot run on its XMP profiles. Maybe this is power related? 

Can you ensure all your mobo power cables are fully plugged in, I know sounds basic but a 100fps drop is not explainable by slower RAM alone and I bet whatever caused that is causing the RAM issues as well. 

I should clarify that I am getting better frames than that nowadays, but only 60-80 whereas I used to get around 120-140 like in OP. I'm not sure if that could all be attributed to faster memory speeds...

I just went and checked on every PSU cable in my build, they all seem solid

 

semo

[Guest]

Right see mem overclock fail count? That's what I was talking about. Default is 3. (set this manually to desired count. Seems to be defaulted to 2 for some strange reason??)

 

Posted into windows, let's see a screen shot of Cpu-Z memory and SPD tab please. 

 

I did notice there is a newer bios, but looks to say for performance. Probably wouldn't hurt to clear cmos and update the bios. 

 

Oh and F12 you can save screen shots to a thumb drive so you don't have to pull out the camera or phone.

 

 

 

 

 

[semo]

10 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Right see mem overclock fail count? That's what I was talking about. Default is 3. (set this manually to desired count. Seems to be defaulted to 2 for some strange reason??)

 

Posted into windows, let's see a screen shot of Cpu-Z memory and SPD tab please. 

 

I did notice there is a newer bios, but looks to say for performance. Probably wouldn't hurt to clear cmos and update the bios. 

 

Oh and F12 you can save screen shots to a thumb drive so you don't have to pull out the camera or phone.

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah I was taking a look at that. I'll set it higher manually. I've attached cpu-z screenshots running at 2400Mhz. I think it was running 15-15 something on optimized defaults @ 2133Mhz. I can grab those too if that helps.

 

I'll go and update the bios (I did once, maybe this is pretty new). Thanks for the protip about the screenshots haha, I guess I should have looked closer at the hotkeys.

[Guest]

Lets do Typhoon Burner on your new sticks really quick.

Do this with everything back to set all defaults. 

Also maybe a screen shot of SPD tab in bios. 

Gotta check out the timings everywhere to be sure we all match.

[semo]

39 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Lets do Typhoon Burner on your new sticks really quick.

Do this with everything back to set all defaults. 

Also maybe a screen shot of SPD tab in bios. 

Gotta check out the timings everywhere to be sure we all match.

Okay, everything at optimized defaults. Here's my SPD report from typhoon. And a screenshot of DRAM calc saying what the current vals are.

 

SPD tab in BIOS - would that just be the timing control page? Forgive my ignorance 

 

G.Skill F4-3600C16-16GTZN.html

[Guest]

OK, perhaps Trfc we need to loosen Trfc. Looks pretty tight, try 550 with the DOCP profile. Start at good 2400mhz, then try 2666mhz. 

[semo]

1 hour ago, ShrimpBrime said:

OK, perhaps Trfc we need to loosen Trfc. Looks pretty tight, try 550 with the DOCP profile. Start at good 2400mhz, then try 2666mhz. 

Reporting back: Trfc set to 550 works at 2400Mhz, and fails at 2666Mhz. I then tried to up the voltage to 1.41. No go. SOC to 1.1. No go. Gear / power disabled. No go.

 

1.45 on DRAM voltage also no go in combination with above. I was able to increase the fail count, but it still boots and shuts off within a few seconds 3 times.

[rorythedawg]

21 hours ago, semo said:

I should clarify that I am getting better frames than that nowadays, but only 60-80 whereas I used to get around 120-140 like in OP. I'm not sure if that could all be attributed to faster memory speeds...

I just went and checked on every PSU cable in my build, they all seem solid

Were still talking about almost doubling your FPS due to ram, unless your RAM kit is literally broken in some way I cannot imagine this is possible solely from slower RAM. FPS differences for different RAM speeds should be closer to ~5% FPS impact one way or the other than doubling or halving your FPS. 

 

As such I am still fairly confident the is a larger issue at play. Do you have any other kits of RAM to test in this mobo? Failing that if you try to use just one stick do you get any improvement? (try this with both sticks individually so ensure one in particular is not causing the issue) 

 

Also take some compressed air and blow out your DIMM slots and ram sticks to ensure there isn't something physically causing an issue. 

 

Also ensure that your mobo does not have a preferred DIMM slot for dual channel sticks, for example the mobo I use requires that the ram be slotted in DIMM slots 2 and 4 in order for D.O.C.P to be applied, putting my RAM in DIMM slots 1 and 3 results in it failing to work with its D.O.C.P profile.

[semo]

1 hour ago, rorythedawg said:

Were still talking about almost doubling your FPS due to ram, unless your RAM kit is literally broken in some way I cannot imagine this is possible solely from slower RAM. FPS differences for different RAM speeds should be closer to ~5% FPS impact one way or the other than doubling or halving your FPS. 

 

As such I am still fairly confident the is a larger issue at play. Do you have any other kits of RAM to test in this mobo? Failing that if you try to use just one stick do you get any improvement? (try this with both sticks individually so ensure one in particular is not causing the issue) 

 

Also take some compressed air and blow out your DIMM slots and ram sticks to ensure there isn't something physically causing an issue. 

 

Also ensure that your mobo does not have a preferred DIMM slot for dual channel sticks, for example the mobo I use requires that the ram be slotted in DIMM slots 2 and 4 in order for D.O.C.P to be applied, putting my RAM in DIMM slots 1 and 3 results in it failing to work with its D.O.C.P profile.

Well, I am using a different set of sticks right now. I went from the C18 to the C16 version of the TridentZ Neo 3600Mhz. So that's two sets both failing to POST above 2400Mhz.

 

I believe I am already using the preferred DIMM slots, 2 and 4 on the X570-E from the manual (they might be called something else)

 

PC posts up fine on one stick, I'll do a bit of performance comparison. Also, the pressure issue I had originally when using the stock cooler it ONLY worked with one stick in.