PAL/NTSC, flicker?

Emillionaire · October 13, 2018

Hi, just got myself a Panasonic g7. (g70K, to be precise.)

Bought in Germany, so its on PAL; Therefore i can only record 4k 24p, and 1080p with 50p. (instead of 4k 30p and 1080 60p)

I am building quite an interest in video, and will over time invest in proper lightning and etc.
I have heard, and experienced "flicker" on a old camera, when using some lights. I was wondering, if i would experience that again - filming with 50p, with lights running off the 50hz grid? (Denmark/Germany).
I've read about some "hacks" to change the camera to NTSC, would that prevent me from running into the problem, as the camera and lights are not running the same hz? Or opposite, would changing the settings to 60p, on 50hz grid result in flickering?

Thx.

October 13, 2018

I don't think digital camera's use PAL and NTSC anymore, that's analog only.

It's probably fine, I think it's also able to do 60p, but not sure. The only way to know is to try. But I can say that I have had my camera in lot's of country's, and have never had issues with lights.(I don't think camera's really have that issue anymore)

Emillionaire · October 13, 2018

1 minute ago, timl132 said:

I don't think digital camera's use PAL and NTSC anymore, that's analog only.

It's probably fine, I think it's also able to do 60p, but not sure. The only way to know is to try. But I can say that I have had my camera in lot's of country's, and have never had issues with lights.(I don't think camera's really have that issue anymore)

Sadly the camera can only record 1080 at 50p, as the german electrical grid is 50hz.
I had the problem with flickering a few years ago on a different camera, but the camera i just bought also came out around that time so i sadly think that this is still a reality.
If i suspect right, that if i change the camera to 60p (through service mode), the framerate and frequency of the lights will not match, and will result in flickering. But i am not sure if this is correct, or opposite.

vanished · October 14, 2018

8 hours ago, L0gic said:

Sadly the camera can only record 1080 at 50p, as the german electrical grid is 50hz.

Those have nothing to do with each other.

Regardless though, that just doesn't seem right. I know our D7200 can shoot 60p, 50p, 30, 25, 24 etc - every common option, depending on the resolution you pick. There's no reason for them to not offer some, especially if there's another model of the camera that can do it. They're just locking away the top tier of performance which makes no sense.

Additionally, you shouldn't have to worry about flicker at any framerate (unless you're going really fast), and if you do, there's an issue with your lights, or they're poor quality.

Emillionaire · October 14, 2018

2 hours ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

Those have nothing to do with each other. Regardless though, that just doesn't seem right. I know our D7200 can shoot 60p, 50p, 30, 25, 24 etc - every common option, depending on the resolution you pick. There's no reason for them to not offer some, especially if there's another model of the camera that can do it. They're just locking away the top tier of performance which makes no sense.

Again, i have the camera in my hands - and the camera does not offer 1920x1080 with 60p - only 50p...
The same goes for 4k video, where the camera does not offer 4k 30p - and only 24p.
The only way is through a "service" feature to change the cameras software to the version from the US versions. Of course, not intended to be possible for consumers.

I was finally able to find an article which explained flickering lights, and fps in a way that i could understand it.

"The camera’s eye (its sensor) can still see this flicker. The sample footage below was shot in PAL, 1080i50, 1/50 shutter speed, at a school in Edmonton, Canada with 60Hz florescent lighting. While our camera operator was seeing a clean, flicker-free image, the camera itself was seeing something entirely different"

"The hertz is a unit of frequency that defines cycles per second. So, if the lighting in the school is running at 60Hz, this is just a fancy way of saying that the electricity flowing into the fluorescent lighting is cycling ON-OFF 60 times per second. While the human eye does not detect it, there is a subtle dimming of the light during each of these ON-OFF cycles. It is this dimming that our camera is seeing, and recording."

for others who might be interested:

http://urbanvideo.ca/avoid-video-flicker

So, the conclusion is that if i chose to record with 60p, in Europe under 50hz lightning, i will see flicker unless i change the shutter speed.

They provided this table, which i believe can be interesting to others wondering the same.