Sound card solution if i don't want a pci/pcie card?

[Bakgrund]

Hi,

 

I want a sound card but a pci/pcie sound card would clutter up my computer and make the cooling worse, because it either has to sit right over my graphics card, or right under and block the air-flow. Would a usb-soundcard work? Or is that relying on the on-board audio too? Buying a new motherboard is not an alternative.

 

Thanks.

[Volbet]

Filo E10, but it depends on what sound solution you are using. You might be just fine using the onboard audio

[DaftBehemoth]

Linus just posted this video. See what you think.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gnu3wxW7cBI

[OddballMV]

USB solutions are great these days. You can go for a seperate DAC and Amp like the Schiit Modi and Magni and have them both separate or go for a combo unit like the Fiio E10 or O2+ODAC which would just be one unit. Either way is good but it depends on your budget an your headphones really.

[Bakgrund]

 

USB solutions are great these days. You can go for a seperate DAC and Amp like the Schiit Modi and Magni and have them both separate or go for a combo unit like the Fiio E10 or O2+ODAC which would just be one unit. Either way is good but it depends on your budget an your headphones really.

I don't have a huge budget, the sound card i have been looking into is a Xonar Dgx, which is a very cheap one, but should still be an improvement from my  Realtek ALC892 soundchip?

 

Linus just posted this video. See what you think.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gnu3wxW7cBI

See the answer below, is an amp relying on my on board audio?

 

Filo E10, but it depends on what sound solution you are using. You might be just fine using the onboard audio

In another thread i have someone said it doesn't matter if i use a headphone amp if i have bad on board audio. I have a msi z77a-g43 which has the Realtek ALC892 soundchip (bad?). I am running a pair of akg k518 LE's today but will upgrade to Custom One Pro's or Ath-m50's. 

[OddballMV]

I don't have a huge budget, the sound card i have been looking into is a Xonar Dgx, which is a very cheap one, but should still be an improvement from my  Realtek ALC892 soundchip?

 

In another thread i have someone said it doesn't matter if i use a headphone amp if i have bad on board audio. I have a msi z77a-g43 which has the Realtek ALC892 soundchip (bad?). I am running a pair of akg k518 LE's today but will upgrade to Custom One Pro's or Ath-m50's. 

 

I wouldn't get just an amp to use with onboard audio as it won't improve it that much, you are just amplifying whatever quality of signal you already have so if you feel you want an upgrade in sound you need to look at the DAC as well. The DGX is very cheap but wouldn't be suited to your headphones or the two that you are looking out due to the output impedance, and there aren't that many good external solutions for that sort of money.

 

Best two options you have really are to go for a headphone that will be fine driven off your onboard audio, or to go with a headphone that would be more suited to the DGX - something with a higher impedance.

[Volbet]

In another thread i have someone said it doesn't matter if i use a headphone amp if i have bad on board audio. I have a msi z77a-g43 which has the Realtek ALC892 soundchip (bad?). I am running a pair of akg k518 LE's today but will upgrade to Custom One Pro's or Ath-m50's. 

Well, the Filo E10 is a DAC/AMP so you would be getting the best of both worlds. Ans neithe the ATH-M50s or the Custom One Pro's have a very high impendance. You also have to remember that there is a lot of snobbery going on when it comes to audio. You will benefit more from getting a good pair of headphone than from getting a good soundcard in this day and age. As far as I remember your onboard isn't that bad, but if I were you I would look up some comperisons between it and dedicated audio solutions. All of this said you will probably benefit from a soundcard with your setup. I'm sorry for the long post, and if I am unclear I'm sorry

[ShearMe]

In another thread i have someone said it doesn't matter if i use a headphone amp if i have bad on board audio. I have a msi z77a-g43 which has the Realtek ALC892 soundchip (bad?). I am running a pair of akg k518 LE's today but will upgrade to Custom One Pro's or Ath-m50's. 

 

It's not so much which Realtek solution you're using, but how well any given motherboard implements it. At the very least, a soundcard wouldn't be an improvement unless your motherboard's audio circuit is poorly designed/defective.

 

 

See the answer below, is an amp relying on my on board audio?

 

USB solutions are completely independent than any other audio hardware in your computer.

 

I wouldn't recommend spending money on a soundcard, external or internal, unless you hear hiss, pops, crackles, etc. In Sweden the FiiO E10 is pretty expensive, so here's some possibly cheaper options (though I can't speak to their quality): http://www.amazon.co.uk/Creative-Labs-70SB129000002-Sound-Blaster/dp/B0042RUERG/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1379789399&sr=8-10&keywords=usb+soundcard http://www.amazon.co.uk/Creative-70SB109500002-Sound-Blaster-Surround/dp/B0042RUEQW/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1379789399&sr=8-14&keywords=usb+soundcard http://www.amazon.co.uk/Asus-Xonaru3-Mobile-USB-Soundcard/dp/B004ZI5E1S/ref=sr_1_23?ie=UTF8&qid=1379789613&sr=8-23&keywords=usb+sound+card

[DaftBehemoth]

See the answer below, is an amp relying on my on board audio?

As ShearMe just said, this is a USB DAC that doesn't rely on any hardware in your computer. I, however, disagree with his his opinion that you cannot tell the difference between onboard audio and a soundcard. In my experience, there is a huge improvement between perfectly functional onboard audio and a quality USB DAC or soundcard. I would say that the purchase is worth every penny.

[ShearMe]

I, however, disagree with his his opinion that you cannot tell the difference between onboard audio and a soundcard. In my experience, there is a huge improvement between perfectly functional onboard audio and a quality USB DAC or soundcard. I would say that the purchase is worth every penny.

 

Woah woah woah. I just was assuming he wouldn't want something >$100, and thus wouldn't be getting a "quality USB DAC or soundcard."

 

Ignoring my opinion that no soundcard on the market is of a desirable quality, the OP doesn't want a soundcard anyways - he's specifically asking for something external. If he chooses to ignore my opinion of lower end sound devices vs on board then I have provided cheap solutions for him to do so.

[DaftBehemoth]

Woah woah woah. I just was assuming he wouldn't want something >$100, and thus wouldn't be getting a "quality USB DAC or soundcard."

 

Ignoring my opinion that no soundcard on the market is of a desirable quality, the OP doesn't want a soundcard anyways - he's specifically asking for something external. If he chooses to ignore my opinion of lower end sound devices vs on board then I have provided cheap solutions for him to do so.

I'm not attacking you or anything. This is just my opinion. Going off of what I've listened to personally, spending $50-$80 on a decent soundcard or external DAC is a worthwhile upgrade over onboard audio. You don't have to go strait to the high end $200+ audio equipment to get a jump in sound quality. 

 

If you can't hear the difference yourself, that's ok and I'm not trying to make you look bad for it or anything. I'm just saying that the difference is worth the money to me. Audio is something that differs greatly from person to person.

[Torg73]

I don't have a huge budget, the sound card i have been looking into is a Xonar Dgx, which is a very cheap one, but should still be an improvement from my  Realtek ALC892 soundchip?

 

See the answer below, is an amp relying on my on board audio?

 

In another thread i have someone said it doesn't matter if i use a headphone amp if i have bad on board audio. I have a msi z77a-g43 which has the Realtek ALC892 soundchip (bad?). I am running a pair of akg k518 LE's today but will upgrade to Custom One Pro's or Ath-m50's. 

I have the Asus Xoner DGX sound card and I can tell you its a good cheap card, the problem is its got an amp that will amplify all the sounds from your computer, so if your case is small to medium it will amplify your fan sounds and I can tell you its annoying.  I pulled it out when I upgraded my computer this summer and just used the on board sound drivers till yesterday when I got the Fiio E10 DAC and the Beyer dynamic DT990 headphones.  

 

The sound I get through my speakers is richer then on board sound but the real benefit is when am using the headphones, am listening to stuff like Fleetwood Mac and Joe Bonamassa and its a lot better then it was before.

 

If you follow MKBHD then you will know that Marques loves the Audio Technica ATH-M50.  Either way, the two pair's of headphones are good and you will enjoy them, but you will get better sound via a DAC instead of a sound card.

[Bakgrund]

I have the Asus Xoner DGX sound card and I can tell you its a good cheap card, the problem is its got an amp that will amplify all the sounds from your computer, so if your case is small to medium it will amplify your fan sounds and I can tell you its annoying.  I pulled it out when I upgraded my computer this summer and just used the on board sound drivers till yesterday when I got the Fiio E10 DAC and the Beyer dynamic DT990 headphones.  

 

The sound I get through my speakers is richer then on board sound but the real benefit is when am using the headphones, am listening to stuff like Fleetwood Mac and Joe Bonamassa and its a lot better then it was before.

 

If you follow MKBHD then you will know that Marques loves the Audio Technica ATH-M50.  Either way, the two pair's of headphones are good and you will enjoy them, but you will get better sound via a DAC instead of a sound card.

 

Amplify the fan sounds? Are you serious there? 

 

Edit: So, let's say i decide to buy a sound-card anyway, maybe make a custom back-plate so it removes the clutter and stuff, would i hear a difference if i buy the entry level model?  Like the xonar dgx? Or am i better off saving my money and save up for a usb amp & dac?

[OddballMV]

For the headphones you have and what you mentioned you were looking at, i would keep your money for now. Have you decided on a headphone yet?

[Torg73]

Amplify the fan sounds? Are you serious there? 

 

Edit: So, let's say i decide to buy a sound-card anyway, maybe make a custom back-plate so it removes the clutter and stuff, would i hear a difference if i buy the entry level model?  Like the xonar dgx? Or am i better off saving my money and save up for a usb amp & dac?

External sound cards and DAC/AMP's mostly use USB to connect to the computer, so you by pass your motherboard for a source of the sound process.  This can give you a a warm rich sound you will not get from just a cheap sound card, you will get better sound performance with the DAC with the two headphones you are looking as you will be using SPDIF which gives a better connection all round for what you what.

 

With the Amplify the fan sounds, my problem is I use Logitech Z623 speakers and I was getting the sounds from the fan's.  I would boot up a game and play hearing the fan's of the gpu and the cpu cooler, which is annoying but I could use other sounds (in game sounds and play music to drown it out), but the real problem is when finish playing the game, the sounds became louder and the only way to stop it was to restart the computer every time.

 

The problem got worst when I upgraded from Windows 7 to Windows 8, the drivers would crash sometimes too, never managed to fix that problem either.  This problem is not unique to me either as a simple Google search found many people in the same boat.

 

IF your not sure, and there's a place you can try different headphones with and without the use of a DAC then I would recommend doing that.

[TheProfosist]

Oops thought u wanted a pci-e one for a second there. What are you trying to do and what's your budget? I mean for external my essence one is amazing but to many there quite the sticker shock.

[Bakgrund]

External sound cards and DAC/AMP's mostly use USB to connect to the computer, so you by pass your motherboard for a source of the sound process.  This can give you a a warm rich sound you will not get from just a cheap sound card, you will get better sound performance with the DAC with the two headphones you are looking as you will be using SPDIF which gives a better connection all round for what you what.

 

With the Amplify the fan sounds, my problem is I use Logitech Z623 speakers and I was getting the sounds from the fan's.  I would boot up a game and play hearing the fan's of the gpu and the cpu cooler, which is annoying but I could use other sounds (in game sounds and play music to drown it out), but the real problem is when finish playing the game, the sounds became louder and the only way to stop it was to restart the computer every time.

 

The problem got worst when I upgraded from Windows 7 to Windows 8, the drivers would crash sometimes too, never managed to fix that problem either.  This problem is not unique to me either as a simple Google search found many people in the same boat.

 

IF your not sure, and there's a place you can try different headphones with and without the use of a DAC then I would recommend doing that.

Will i actually be using spdif? The headphones i'm thinking of all have a standar 3,5mm jack.

 

For the headphones you have and what you mentioned you were looking at, i would keep your money for now. Have you decided on a headphone yet?

 

I'll probably go for the m50's if they go on sale, which they do pretty often, or custom one pro, but i have to make a bit more research about them.

 

Also, i can probably get someone that i know in the us, that comes to Sweden soon to bring a Fiio E11, the price would be 52$, is it worth buying if i get if for that price? Or should i go for the fiio e11 for 61$? Amps and dac's aren't something that breaks that often, right? So i don't have to worry about rma stuff. The price in Sweden for it is 155$, yes onehundred and fiftyfive buckaroons.

[OddballMV]

I'll probably go for the m50's if they go on sale, which they do pretty often, or custom one pro, but i have to make a bit more research about them.

 

Also, i can probably get someone that i know in the us, that comes to Sweden soon to bring a Fiio E11, the price would be 52$, is it worth buying if i get if for that price? Or should i go for the fiio e11 for 61$? Amps and dac's aren't something that breaks that often, right? So i don't have to worry about rma stuff. The price in Sweden for it is 155$, yes onehundred and fiftyfive buckaroons.

 

Are they for home use? I still think the M50 aren't that great a choice, i've owned them and they were good but in my opinion a lot of better stuff has come out since then. The custom one pro are nice for a closed option but probably wouldn't be good with a Fiio E11, E10 may be okay. I would still look into open backed headphones if they are for home use gaming or music.

 

If you really want something closed back i would take a look at the AKG K550 or 551 as well.

[Bakgrund]

Are they for home use? I still think the M50 aren't that great a choice, i've owned them and they were good but in my opinion a lot of better stuff has come out since then. The custom one pro are nice for a closed option but probably wouldn't be good with a Fiio E11, E10 may be okay. I would still look into open backed headphones if they are for home use gaming or music.

 

If you really want something closed back i would take a look at the AKG K550 or 551 as well.

 

Yeah they are for music home use, but i don't want to annoy the people in my surroundings, i'll look into the K550's. I don't know much about amps, so why would an E10 or E11 not be a bad option for them? Also, does anyone know if the impedance matters? The custom one pro's are just 16 ohms, and the ath-m50 38 ohms.

 

also, damn the white cop's are sexy

 

[h264]

Will i actually be using spdif? The headphones i'm thinking of all have a standar 3,5mm jack.

 

 

I'll probably go for the m50's if they go on sale, which they do pretty often, or custom one pro, but i have to make a bit more research about them.

 

No, you'll be using a USB DAC and an AMP all in one, powered by the USB port.  Windows will pass the digital audio signal across the USB cable and the E10's DAC will decode it and amplify it using the USB port's power.  There is a 3.5mm jack on the E10 to plug your headphone's into the amp portion.  The O2+ODAC works the same way except it uses external AC power from the wall for the amp portion.

 

I'd be hard pressed to give a definitive answer on the Custom vs M50 debate.  Those headphones are just too similar.  The main differences are the Custom One's shorter cable length and the fact that the M50 has a more complicated headband since it's a DJ headphone.  Whichever is cheaper, I guess.

[OddballMV]

Yeah they are for music home use, but i don't want to annoy the people in my surroundings, i'll look into the K550's. I don't know much about amps, so why would an E10 or E11 not be a bad option for them? Also, does anyone know if the impedance matters? The custom one pro's are just 16 ohms, and the ath-m50 38 ohms.

 

also, damn the white cop's are sexy

 

 

That's fair enough, closed back are still good. A Fiio E11 is just an amp so you would be using your onboard audio as a DAC and then amping a pair of headphones that don't really need amping. Also one of the features on the E11 people like is the bass boost but you probably won't need that with either of those two headphones. The Fiio E10 is a reasonably good DAC for the money with an amp built in (just not that powerful a one, which is good because you don't really need it) so if you can get that for a good price from your friend then it may be a good way to go.

 

The impedance is one of the specifications that determines how hard the headphone is to drive, but once you get down to the 30s and below it doesn't really make much difference, the will be fine driven off pretty much anything.

 

Also you're right the COP do look very nice in white.

[Torg73]

Will i actually be using spdif? The headphones i'm thinking of all have a standar 3,5mm jack.

 

 

 

Yes you will, the E10 uses SPDIF so if you do get one you will know what to look for in your windows sound setup.

 

and if you what to see how complicated how to work out Headphone Impedance then take at look at this you tube video

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BNUddFMxB6Y

 

If you can follow it then great if not then don't worry most of us here on the forum will probably not either. :huh:

 

The 2 headphones will work without a DAC but you will get better over all sound with one instead of a sound card, where as I went for the DT990 250 OHM for better over sound I needed a DAC to drive my headphones.  Both headphones you are looking atm will work ok without a portable device I think if you don't what to spend the extra money for a DAC.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbyuSFyYOVs what this one too

 

 

[Aphexx]

the E11 is a purely portable amp you can only run it while it is running off the rechargeable battery.

 

 

 you cannot charge it and play sound thru it at the same time 

[Bakgrund]

the E11 is a purely portable amp you can only run it while it is running off the rechargeable battery.

 

 

 you cannot charge it and play sound thru it at the same time 

Oh, didn't knew that, but i'll probably don't buy an amp in the first place, if i'm not happy with the sound i'm getting from the headphones i end up going for i'll probably throw in a dac, soundcard or amp, still haven't understood exactly what they does.  :wacko:

 

Yes you will, the E10 uses SPDIF so if you do get one you will know what to look for in your windows sound setup.

 

and if you what to see how complicated how to work out Headphone Impedance then take at look at this you tube video

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BNUddFMxB6Y

 

If you can follow it then great if not then don't worry most of us here on the forum will probably not either. :huh:

 

The 2 headphones will work without a DAC but you will get better over all sound with one instead of a sound card, where as I went for the DT990 250 OHM for better over sound I needed a DAC to drive my headphones.  Both headphones you are looking atm will work ok without a portable device I think if you don't what to spend the extra money for a DAC.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbyuSFyYOVs what this one too

 

Couldn't understand a squat of the first one, haha. But the second video was kind of good tho, so you can compare the impedance if the headphones are the same, but not if they are completely different pairs? Let's say that i go for the custom one pro's, would i loose audio quality because they are just 16 ohms?

 

That's fair enough, closed back are still good. A Fiio E11 is just an amp so you would be using your onboard audio as a DAC and then amping a pair of headphones that don't really need amping. Also one of the features on the E11 people like is the bass boost but you probably won't need that with either of those two headphones. The Fiio E10 is a reasonably good DAC for the money with an amp built in (just not that powerful a one, which is good because you don't really need it) so if you can get that for a good price from your friend then it may be a good way to go.

 

The impedance is one of the specifications that determines how hard the headphone is to drive, but once you get down to the 30s and below it doesn't really make much difference, the will be fine driven off pretty much anything.

 

Also you're right the COP do look very nice in white.

 

So the impedance has nothing to do with the sound quality? I think i will go for the white Custom one pro's, but i'm not totally sure yet, i'll see if i can find a place to try them first. But they look very sharp, and who knows, maybe i'll use them outside too in the future. 

 

Also, i really appreciate everyone's help i've got, you guys are awesome.