Peltier (TEC) And Radiator

[KingOfSoldiers]

Is it possible to attach a Peltier to a radiator to help cool the liquid and also have the Peltier controlled by a 12v dial so the temp can be controlled to prevent the liquid from freezing in the radiator?

[Administrator]

There are many problems with this - I'm sorry that i can't go too far into detail - I was just doing a bit of mod work before bed when i saw this post

among others one big problem is that you still have to cool the hot side of your TEC

[ThatCrazyIrishGuy]

Slick is correct, the problem with TEC is while one side gets very cold the other heats up ( due to the fundamentals of this architecture, i wont bore you with the details) so you would need to put a massive heat sink or a water block on the hot side of the TEC, essentially counteracting itself. I have looked into this as well, there is really no practical way to implement a Peltier into your rig. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news

[facuxt]

you should simply use a phase changer, and that's it...

[Ghost]

I have re-read your phrasing and you seem to have gotten your knowledge of peltiers mixed up. It is not a cooling device.

It is a heat pump.

That means as others have correctly said one side gets hot while the other gets cold. So you would HAVE to provide cooling to the other side.

Peltiers seem to be most logical to put at the cpu block, however, they probably produce so much heat on the other side than they take away that it would just overheat a water cooling system if run for long amounts of time

[1337_SP33K]

I have to agree with the others. TEC's are heat pumps you have to cool the TEC as well. Also as far as TEC's go they are pretty mediocre at best. I am currently running 4x40mm TEC at 15v and the temps are -10 idle ish. Honestly phase change is the way unless you want to chill water and deal with condensation over every tube you have....

[LeSLeeve]

I have thought about this as well and have figured out a way, it would be possible:

 

I would use a second CPU cooling block in your loop and mount it on the peltier chip. On the other (hot) side of the TEC one could mount a regular, but still powerful heatsink (Silver Arrow or something). The only problem is, that at least the last mentioned heatsink has to be outside of your case. You could run the tubing out the back, mount the TEC with a heatsink there and run the tubing back inside. Of course all this will require some serious case modding to look good.

 

Also, I would use some kind of cotroller to keep the fluid temperature above environment temps to prevent condensation.

[Ghost]

I have thought about this as well and have figured out a way, it would be possible:

 

I would use a second CPU cooling block in your loop and mount it on the peltier chip. On the other (hot) side of the TEC one could mount a regular, but still powerful heatsink (Silver Arrow or something). The only problem is, that at least the last mentioned heatsink has to be outside of your case. You could run the tubing out the back, mount the TEC with a heatsink there and run the tubing back inside. Of course all this will require some serious case modding to look good.

 

Also, I would use some kind of cotroller to keep the fluid temperature above environment temps to prevent condensation.

By that time you would be spending so much money phase change is cheaper and looks much better.

[LeSLeeve]

By that time you would be spending so much money phase change is cheaper and looks much better.

 

It's not so bad. CPU Blocks go for $50, Peltier Chips are really cheap with $10-20, and even if you have to buy the heatsink $50 for that should be enough. With some screws and small parts one could say $150 and some work should keep your loop temps around 20-30 degrees depending on your rig and environment temps. Also, this will create no additional noise.

[Ghost]

It's not so bad. CPU Blocks go for $50, Peltier Chips are really cheap with $10-20, and even if you have to buy the heatsink $50 for that should be enough. With some screws and small parts one could say $150 and some work should keep your loop temps around 20-30 degrees depending on your rig and environment temps. Also, this will create no additional noise.

A fan cooled heat-sink would be very loud when cooling a peltier cooler. Remember you still can't let the actual heatsink go above ~80C or so or the fans would start to melt.

[LeSLeeve]

To reach temps even near to 80°C, I think you would need a really powerful peltier chip. My plan would be to use a regular water cooling loop to keep CPU temps at maybe 50-60°C and then use the extra cooling of the peltier (how much extra cooling would be anybodys choice) to drop temps even lower or overclock more.

Watercooling can only get the loop temps that close to environmental temps. With a peltier it would be much easier to push the temperature even more down. Personally, I would keep temps a couple degrees above environent at idle to prevent condensation and max out the peltier chip, if the system is under heavy load.

 

The dimension of the heatsink mounted to the hot side of the peltier can be easyly choosen according to the maximal wattage of the peltier chip. Units under 100W can be even cooled passively with a good heatsink.

 

EDIT: Just to be clear: I am not talking about cooling your system by TEC alone. You will need a functioning water cooling loop and just add the peltier chip to that to achieve an additional drop in temps by some degrees depending on the wattage of the TEC.

[Ghost]

To reach temps even near to 80°C, I think you would need a really powerful peltier chip. My plan would be to use a regular water cooling loop to keep CPU temps at maybe 50-60°C and then use the extra cooling of the peltier (how much extra cooling would be anybodys choice) to drop temps even lower or overclock more.

Watercooling can only get the loop temps that close to environmental temps. With a peltier it would be much easier to push the temperature even more down. Personally, I would keep temps a couple degrees above environent at idle to prevent condensation and max out the peltier chip, if the system is under heavy load.

The dimension of the heatsink mounted to the hot side of the peltier can be easyly choosen according to the maximal wattage of the peltier chip. Units under 100W can be even cooled passively with a good heatsink.

EDIT: Just to be clear: I am not talking about cooling your system by TEC alone. You will need a functioning water cooling loop and just add the peltier chip to that to achieve an additional drop in temps by some degrees depending on the wattage of the TEC.

100W of cooling is like running an overclocked CPU (quite a high overclock mind you) at full load. So you would need loud air cooling. Also; I imagine Peltier is pretty in-efficient so it would be adding a lot of extra heat to the other side, so again; not passively.

[m3Zz]

Digitalstorms' "Aventum" has TEC cooling implemented as far as i know(in this config it costs 10k Bucks though...).

[Ghost]

Digitalstorms' "Aventum" has TEC cooling implemented as far as i know(in this config it costs 10k Bucks though...).

The coolermaster V10 has a peltier cooler in it but look at how big it is.

 

 

[LeSLeeve]

I knew about the Coolermaster V10. The problem with that is, the additional heat is still exhausted inside your case.

[Ghost]

I knew about the Coolermaster V10. The problem with that is, the additional heat is still exhausted inside your case.

That's why all 3 fans near any CPU heat sink should be blowing air out of the case. There is nothing the heat up in that region from the extra heat; in fact most things would benefit from incidental air flow and as long as the warm air isn't pushed back down at the back of the graphics card nothing should be warmed up.

[LeSLeeve]

I have looked further into this and have actually ordered several peltier chips and some scrapped intel box coolers.

There are two things I know now for shure:

 

1. With enough money it would be possible to cool your CPU via peltier. The best option is to mount the peltier directly on the cpu and underneath the waterblock. peltier/cpu temp shall not go lower than ambient because of condensation. The watercooling loop will operate more efficient that way because the delta temperature between water and ambient will be higher. With enough power it would be possible to keep any overclocked CPU at slightliy over ambient temp. Problems: Power draw of the peltier (insane), regulating the temps to prevent condensation, more powerful water cooling solution needed (peltier wattage added to TDP).

 

 

The second thing I know is that I now have a really awesome portable fridge at low cost that runs off a car battery to take cold beer anywhere. ^^

[Ghost]

Peltier coolers are a dead concept. A compressor cooler (like a fridge) is much more efficient. You can put it in-line in your water cooling loop and it can be outside your case. Good cooling with a controllable temperature and relatively cheap to run.