Development Linux Workstation - skip the GPU?

[goosebumpss]

Budget (including currency):  around 1500 Euros (flexible, the pre-built workstation from the IT supplier is ~3000 Euros and at some point I said "for half the price")

Country: The Netherlands

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Software development, mostly in python. No games on this system.

• Multiple instances of the IDE

• Analyzing data with python (pandas, matplotlib, scikit-learn, tensorflow, custom packages)

• Productivity apps (email, MS Teams, Firefox)

Other details (existing parts lists, whether any peripherals are needed, what you're upgrading from, when you're going to buy, what resolution and refresh rate you want to play at, etc): 

I want to build a software development and data analysis workstation for work-from-home. Will run Linux (probably Ubuntu).

I am joining a team where other developers are using all the same build, so this is my reference:

• ASUS ROG STRIX B650E-I Gaming WiFi2,3,4

• AMD Ryzen 9 7900 3.7/5.4 GHz Box

• Corsair Vengeance DDR5 5200MHz 64GB 2x32 CL40 Optimised AMD

• WD Black SN850X SSD 2TB M.2 2280 PCIe Gen4 NVMe

• CoolBox IT05 USB 3.0 Mini-ITX Black + Power source 180 W1

• no GPU

However, some complain that it struggles during hot days (I won't have A/C and will work on the top floor), and that it doesn't work well with two screens.

• I will use 2x Dell U2722D monitors (outside of this budget).
• There is no need for a GPU, unless one is needed to use the two displays.
  I plan to connect them with a thunderbolt dock - Dell WD22TB4 (so that I could also use them with personal/work laptops)
• I will (probably) connect to the internet with WiFi
• A quiet system is preferable
• A smaller case is preferable (less than a quiet system)

What would you suggest to change to make this system better suited for these tasks?

 

[brob]

Consider an Intel CPU. It should offer better overall performance.

 

This build suggestion includes a motherboard with two Thunderbolt 4 type-C ports. If they are not needed a less expensive motherboard could be used.

 

I've included a low-end GPU. This will deliver a smother visual interface.

 

PCPartPicker Part List

 

CPU: Intel Core i7-14700K 3.4 GHz 20-Core Processor (€454.95 @ Megekko) 

CPU Cooler: Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE 66.17 CFM CPU Cooler (€38.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 

Motherboard: Asus ROG STRIX Z790-I GAMING WIFI Mini ITX LGA1700 Motherboard (€347.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 

Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws S5 64 GB (2 x 32 GB) DDR5-6000 CL30 Memory (€231.84 @ Azerty) 

Storage: Samsung 980 Pro 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (€176.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 

Video Card: Sapphire PULSE Radeon RX 6500 XT 4 GB Video Card (€172.81 @ Amazon Netherlands) 

Case: Corsair 2000D AIRFLOW Mini ITX Tower Case (€73.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 

Power Supply: Cooler Master V SFX Gold ATX 3.0 850 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply (€163.85 @ Megekko) 

Case Fan: ARCTIC F12 PST 53 CFM 120 mm Fan (€10.49 @ Amazon Netherlands) 

Case Fan: ARCTIC F12 PST 53 CFM 120 mm Fan (€10.49 @ Amazon Netherlands) 

Case Fan: ARCTIC F12 PST 53 CFM 120 mm Fan (€10.49 @ Amazon Netherlands) 

Total: €1689.82

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2024-04-25 23:47 CEST+0200

[igormp]

Do you really need to go ITX? That may be the reason about the heat issues you've heard. mATX would both be cheaper and cooler.

I don't think 180W is a good idea for this build, I'd go for 500W just to be safe.

 

Why not go with 2x48gb sticks? You can get those running at 5600~6000MHz without issues.

1 hour ago, goosebumpss said:

There is no need for a GPU, unless one is needed to use the two displays.
I plan to connect them with a thunderbolt dock - Dell WD22TB4 (so that I could also use them with personal/work laptops)

I do have some worries about compatibility between that mobo's USB4 and your TB4 dock, since none of the AM5 mobos actually announce TB4 support, but if your coworkers already use it like so, then it shouldn't be an issue.

 

Other than that, there shouldn't be any need for a GPU for those displays.

1 hour ago, goosebumpss said:

• A smaller case is preferable (less than a quiet system)

Would mATX instead of ITX be that much of an issue?

 

1 minute ago, brob said:

Consider an Intel CPU. It should offer better overall performance.

 

OP mentioned that they're working with data, specifically python, so that likely implies numpy, pandas and whatnot, so Intel is actually worse in this case due to the lack of AVX-512.

[goosebumpss]

8 hours ago, igormp said:

Do you really need to go ITX? That may be the reason about the heat issues you've heard. mATX would both be cheaper and cooler.

I don't think 180W is a good idea for this build, I'd go for 500W just to be safe.

No, I don't really need an ITX motherboard, this is just what my colleagues are using.

I thought of a smaller case since I will already have another tower under the desk - the hardware our costumers get from us. But now watching https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BL4DCEp7blY (I'm still only half way), I realized that a smaller case usually means louder fans.

8 hours ago, igormp said:

Why not go with 2x48gb sticks? You can get those running at 5600~6000MHz without issues.

I guess I could but at my current position I am doing similar things using VMs and I never rescaled it to more that 64Gb of memory.

8 hours ago, igormp said:

I do have some worries about compatibility between that mobo's USB4 and your TB4 dock, since none of the AM5 mobos actually announce TB4 support, but if your coworkers already use it like so, then it shouldn't be an issue.

They don't use that dock, I asked for it since I knew I will be swapping worknig between this workstation, a work laptop and a private laptop.

Would replacing the motherboard to an mATX one with thunderbolt could solve both the cooling and video output? Any recommendations?

8 hours ago, igormp said:

OP mentioned that they're working with data, specifically python, so that likely implies numpy, pandas and whatnot, so Intel is actually worse in this case due to the lack of AVX-512.

Yes, we use numpy everywhere, pandas quite often and sometimes ML models on scikit-learn or tensorflow.

 

If I stick to the AMD Ryzen, I could change the motherboard, case, and power supply, right? any recommendations that would work well together?

[igormp]

10 hours ago, goosebumpss said:

I guess I could but at my current position I am doing similar things using VMs and I never rescaled it to more that 64Gb of memory.

18 hours ago, igormp said:

Yeah, then there isn't much need indeed.

10 hours ago, goosebumpss said:

They don't use that dock, I asked for it since I knew I will be swapping worknig between this workstation, a work laptop and a private laptop.

Oh, but do you live nearby any, or do you have a friend with a USB 4 mobo? I've seen some reports of TB4 docks working, but I'd rather err on the cautious side.

10 hours ago, goosebumpss said:

Would replacing the motherboard to an mATX one with thunderbolt could solve both the cooling and video output? Any recommendations?

19 hours ago, igormp said:

The point is that (afaik) there are no AM5 mobos with official thunderbolt support, even though they actually have a TB4 controller. Another weird fact is that it seems that there are only 2 small mobos that have proper USB4, one being a really high end Asus Strix Gene, and the other being the x670 version of the ITX mobo you picked.

I'm not sure how well the dock would go with USB 3.2, I think it should be fine since your two displays are not that hard to push and 20Gbps should be more than enough, but I can't be sure since I've never tried it myself.

11 hours ago, goosebumpss said:

If I stick to the AMD Ryzen, I could change the motherboard, case, and power supply, right? any recommendations that would work well together?

After double checking the USB4 stuff I said above, I guess it'd be better to just go with a larger-ish case and try out the dock to see if you really need some specific motherboard, or if any USB 3.2 one will do (in which case your selection becomes way easier).

[goosebumpss]

15 hours ago, igormp said:

Oh, but do you live nearby any, or do you have a friend with a USB 4 mobo? I've seen some reports of TB4 docks working, but I'd rather err on the cautious side.

The closest is in Spain. but ill ask them how their setup is.

15 hours ago, igormp said:

I'm not sure how well the dock would go with USB 3.2, I think it should be fine since your two displays are not that hard to push and 20Gbps should be more than enough, but I can't be sure since I've never tried it myself.

After double checking the USB4 stuff I said above, I guess it'd be better to just go with a larger-ish case and try out the dock to see if you really need some specific motherboard, or if any USB 3.2 one will do (in which case your selection becomes way easier).

I think that should be fine, the most complex video the displays are going to show are Teams video calls and most of the time it will be text and images.

 

I had a go as picking parts but I don't really know what i'm doing here.

Would that work? Is there any glaring mistake I made?

 

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 7900 3.6 GHz 12-Core Processor  (€372.95 @ Megekko)
CPU Cooler: *be quiet! Pure Rock 2 Black CPU Cooler  (€44.85 @ Azerty)
Motherboard: *Asus TUF GAMING B650M-PLUS WIFI Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€199.00 @ Amazon Netherlands)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws S5 64 GB (2 x 32 GB) DDR5-5600 CL28 Memory  (€230.85 @ Alternate)
Storage: *Samsung 980 Pro 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€176.00 @ Amazon Netherlands)
Case: Cooler Master Q300L V2 MicroATX Mini Tower Case  (€58.90 @ Paradigit)
Power Supply: SeaSonic B12 BC 750 W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply  (€70.42 @ Amazon Netherlands)
Total: €1152.97
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
*Lowest price parts chosen from parametric criteria
Generated by PCPartPicker 2024-04-27 10:42 CEST+0200

[brob]

3 hours ago, goosebumpss said:

The closest is in Spain. but ill ask them how their setup is.

I think that should be fine, the most complex video the displays are going to show are Teams video calls and most of the time it will be text and images.

 

I had a go as picking parts but I don't really know what i'm doing here.

Would that work? Is there any glaring mistake I made?

 

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 7900 3.6 GHz 12-Core Processor  (€372.95 @ Megekko)
CPU Cooler: *be quiet! Pure Rock 2 Black CPU Cooler  (€44.85 @ Azerty)
Motherboard: *Asus TUF GAMING B650M-PLUS WIFI Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€199.00 @ Amazon Netherlands)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws S5 64 GB (2 x 32 GB) DDR5-5600 CL28 Memory  (€230.85 @ Alternate)
Storage: *Samsung 980 Pro 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€176.00 @ Amazon Netherlands)
Case: Cooler Master Q300L V2 MicroATX Mini Tower Case  (€58.90 @ Paradigit)
Power Supply: SeaSonic B12 BC 750 W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply  (€70.42 @ Amazon Netherlands)
Total: €1152.97
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
*Lowest price parts chosen from parametric criteria
Generated by PCPartPicker 2024-04-27 10:42 CEST+0200

 

Consider a higher performance CPU cooler. Perhaps https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/product/GpbRsY/thermalright-phantom-spirit-120-se-6617-cfm-cpu-cooler-ps120se.

 

The memory kit is intended for Intel CPU. Consider instead a kit with EXPO profiles.

 

[igormp]

4 hours ago, goosebumpss said:

The closest is in Spain. but ill ask them how their setup is.

I think that should be fine, the most complex video the displays are going to show are Teams video calls and most of the time it will be text and images.

 

I had a go as picking parts but I don't really know what i'm doing here.

Would that work? Is there any glaring mistake I made?

 

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 7900 3.6 GHz 12-Core Processor  (€372.95 @ Megekko)
CPU Cooler: *be quiet! Pure Rock 2 Black CPU Cooler  (€44.85 @ Azerty)
Motherboard: *Asus TUF GAMING B650M-PLUS WIFI Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€199.00 @ Amazon Netherlands)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws S5 64 GB (2 x 32 GB) DDR5-5600 CL28 Memory  (€230.85 @ Alternate)
Storage: *Samsung 980 Pro 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€176.00 @ Amazon Netherlands)
Case: Cooler Master Q300L V2 MicroATX Mini Tower Case  (€58.90 @ Paradigit)
Power Supply: SeaSonic B12 BC 750 W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply  (€70.42 @ Amazon Netherlands)
Total: €1152.97
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
*Lowest price parts chosen from parametric criteria
Generated by PCPartPicker 2024-04-27 10:42 CEST+0200

Looking good! Just keep in mind the cooler as said above. Maybe you could also fit a 7950x in there, if you make use of multiple cores that often.