FSR 3 on GTX cards ?

[Mikey89]

So i just saw AMD's FSR 3 announcement and presentation and gamescom and they said FSR 3 will work on old GPUs.

 

My question is will FSR 3 work even on older GPUs like my GTX 1660 SUPER ?

 

I can't really find a lot of accurate info on this except that a lot of people agree that it will work on old cards too but nothing specific.

[Levent]

TIL. I knew there was some sort of limitation but there it is.

https://www.pcgamer.com/amd-fsr-3-and-fluid-motion-frames/

[Mikey89]

3 minutes ago, Levent said:

TIL. I knew there was some sort of limitation but there it is.

https://www.pcgamer.com/amd-fsr-3-and-fluid-motion-frames/

But i saw a few videos earlier that said the upscaling works on GTX cards but the frame gen doesn't.

 

I'll link one

 

Skip to 12 min in his video - i also saw a lot of his older videos, he seems pretty good tech-wise.

 

He explained that upscaling and frame gen are separate and they DO NOT have to be enabled at the same time, there are even 2 images in 1 which said GTX 10 supported.

[Levent]

Just now, Mikey89 said:

But i saw a few videos earlier that said the upscaling works on GTX cards but the frame gen doesn't.

 

I'll link one

Skip to 12 min in his video - i also saw a lot of his older videos, he seems pretty good tech-wise.

Yeah that is the case, frame generation is what makes FSR3 most distinctly differ from FSR2. So in theory everything else should work on that card (as far as I know) 

[mMontana]

12 minutes ago, Mikey89 said:

My question is will FSR 3 work even on older GPUs like my GTX 1660 SUPER ?

How on earth the're gonna make more money if they backport functions to older devices?

[YoungBlade]

3 minutes ago, Levent said:

Yeah that is the case, frame generation is what makes FSR3 most distinctly differ from FSR2. So in theory everything else should work on that card (as far as I know) 

From my understanding, the tech isn't likely to work on GTX 10 series and older cards, because it uses the GPU's asynchronous compute capabilities, which 10 series lacked. However, the 16 series is just 20 series cards without RTX features, and so have the capability to run async compute tasks.

 

So in theory, if that is how it works, the GTX 16 series cards should be able to use FSR 3 Fluid Motion Frames in supported games. Also, the old RX 400 and RX 500 series should technically be able to as well.

 

That said, it could be like running FSR 2 on really old cards - the overhead makes it a net loss in performance sometimes. So it might be that a GTX 1650 owner who turns on FSR 3 actually sees a reduction in framerate. I'd be willing to bet that will happen for RX 550 owners in some games if they try it.

[Mikey89]

5 minutes ago, mMontana said:

How on earth the're gonna make more money if they backport functions to older devices?

Here's a thought - maybe just maybe AMD isn't as GREEDY as NVIDIA.

 

I still remember back in 2018 how pissed off people were when nvidia said the GTX 1080 couldn't do DLSS and other youtuber actually demonstrated those cards were capable of DLSS but nvidia chose not to implement it because of marketing BS of RT.

 

Shadow of the Tomb Raider released and the 2080 couldn't do shit - not even 30 FPS with RT ON.

[Mikey89]

7 minutes ago, YoungBlade said:

From my understanding, the tech isn't likely to work on GTX 10 series and older cards, because it uses the GPU's asynchronous compute capabilities, which 10 series lacked. However, the 16 series is just 20 series cards without RTX features, and so have the capability to run async compute tasks.

 

So in theory, if that is how it works, the GTX 16 series cards should be able to use FSR 3 Fluid Motion Frames in supported games. Also, the old RX 400 and RX 500 series should technically be able to as well.

 

That said, it could be like running FSR 2 on really old cards - the overhead makes it a net loss in performance sometimes. So it might be that a GTX 1650 owner who turns on FSR 3 actually sees a reduction in framerate. I'd be willing to bet that will happen for RX 550 owners in some games if they try it.

Fluid motion frames won't work because they are implemented through the driver from what they said and it's only for AMD GPUs.

 

Daniel also explaned in his video that the 10 series will do upscaling without issues but he is not sure about frame gen.

[YoungBlade]

3 minutes ago, Mikey89 said:

Fluid motion frames won't work because they are implemented through the driver from what they said and it's only for AMD GPUs.

 

Daniel also explaned in his video that the 10 series will do upscaling without issues but he is not sure about frame gen.

I didn't mean Radeon Fluid Motion Frames, I meant FSR 3 "frame generation" or whatever it's supposed to be called. The part of FSR 3 that interpolates frames, as opposed to the part of FSR 3 that does upscaling, or the part of FSR 3 that's just for anti-aliasing.

 

I'm not sure what the correct term to use is. I believe Nvidia's DLSS 3 Frame Generation is technically their term, so I don't think AMD is going to be calling the frame interpolation tech "Frame Generation" for that reason. The marketing around this is very confusing.

 

But, if Daniel's explanation is correct, and it just needs the card to support async compute, then a GTX 1660 Super should be able to run FSR 3 with frame interpolation.

[Mikey89]

2 minutes ago, YoungBlade said:

I didn't mean Radeon Fluid Motion Frames, I meant FSR 3 "frame generation" or whatever it's supposed to be called. The part of FSR 3 that interpolates frames, as opposed to the part of FSR 3 that does upscaling, or the part of FSR 3 that's just for anti-aliasing.

 

I'm not sure what the correct term to use. I believe Nvidia's DLSS 3 Frame Generation is technically their term, so I don't think AMD is going to be calling the frame interpolation tech "Frame Generation" for that reason. The marketing around this is very confusing.

 

But, if Daniel's explanation is correct, and it just needs the card to support async compute, then a GTX 1660 Super should be able to run FSR 3 with frame interpolation.

I'm not exactly a tech wizard, i know some stuff but not a "master" at this domain.

 

However i did watch a lot of Daniel's videos in the past, especially the ones for gaming - he seems to know his stuff when it comes to tech, honestly i think he could give Jay and Linus a good run for their money if he starts making PC builds on his channel because he already does benchmarking for games.

[mMontana]

IMO, RT until 3000 was a gimmick only. Too thin the toolset, not optimized games, a huge marketing stunt for telling customers "we are in the future".

 

Anyway: AMD sells GPU. This kind of release is made for make become more interesting its products. They are less greedy than nGreedia: a lot of AMD technologies are available without the same request of money (licensing) than the green evil.

However... Decisions like these are made for increase the resonance and the marketing. If AMD was not so low in the market share.. won't take the same decisions.

[Mikey89]

3 minutes ago, mMontana said:

IMO, RT until 3000 was a gimmick only. Too thin the toolset, not optimized games, a huge marketing stunt for telling customers "we are in the future".

 

Anyway: AMD sells GPU. This kind of release is made for make become more interesting its products. They are less greedy than nGreedia: a lot of AMD technologies are available without the same request of money (licensing) than the green evil.

However... Decisions like these are made for increase the resonance and the marketing. If AMD was not so low in the market share.. won't take the same decisions.

Only difference is that now DLSS has become a gimmick - like FFS now games actually have to RELY on freakin DLSS to get 60 FPS, look at Remnant 2 for example and even Immortals of Aveum.

 

DLSS was supposed to be more of a "luxury" - like if you got 90 FPS in your game you could activate DLSS and get 120 or 130 FPS.

 

Instead it has become something too reliant and a necesity - it was never supposed to be a NECESITY.

 

Developers seem to be using DLSS and FSR as crutches for their games - it's no secret that 2023 has seen a pretty big bump in games system requirements and all because so they can call them "next-gen".

[mMontana]

2 minutes ago, Mikey89 said:

Instead it has become something too rely and a necessity - it was never supposed to be a NECESSITY.

I can agree to you, however for developers using FSR and DLSS is... a cheaper way than optimize the game or design a better game engine.

 

And now there's a ginormous moneylust.

[Agall]

58 minutes ago, Mikey89 said:

Here's a thought - maybe just maybe AMD isn't as GREEDY as NVIDIA.

 

I still remember back in 2018 how pissed off people were when nvidia said the GTX 1080 couldn't do DLSS and other youtuber actually demonstrated those cards were capable of DLSS but nvidia chose not to implement it because of marketing BS of RT.

 

Shadow of the Tomb Raider released and the 2080 couldn't do shit - not even 30 FPS with RT ON.

I don't think it has to do with greed, I just think AMD's Radeon department is more dependent on sales from gamers than Nvidia with Geforce, who's profits seem to be primarily driven by AI sales now.

 

From my understanding, it's just simple capitalism. Radeon needs their gaming department to succeed and therefore care more about that consumer base than Nvidia, who could likely care less about gamers at this point. Both are faceless corporations controlled by a board whose sole purpose is to increase profits for shareholders, being a legal obligation for them. Nvidia probably doesn't need Geforce at this point at all to drive most of their profits.

 

NVIDIA Announces Financial Results for Second Quarter Fiscal 2024 | NVIDIA Newsroom

 

"Second-quarter revenue was $2.49 billion, up 11% from the previous quarter and up 22% from a year ago."

 

"Second-quarter revenue was a record $10.32 billion, up 141% from the previous quarter and up 171% from a year ago."

 

Take a guess which one was gaming, and which one was datacenter/AI.

 

"The company’s invention of the GPU in 1999 sparked the growth of the PC gaming market, redefined computer graphics, ignited the era of modern AI and is fueling industrial digitalization across markets. NVIDIA is now a full-stack computing company with data-center-scale offerings that are reshaping industry."

 

AMD Reports Second Quarter 2023 Financial Results :: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. (AMD)

[mMontana]

Neverthless... Gaming industry is currenly.. mature. There's no "next big thing" incoming that could increase by 30-50% market size (except prices rising)

[Agall]

14 minutes ago, mMontana said:

Neverthless... Gaming industry is currenly.. mature. There's no "next big thing" incoming that could increase by 30-50% market size (except prices rising)

I agree, and a company like Nvidia probably sees that. Especially considering that most of gaming is console sales relative to Nvidia vs AMD, something that AMD dominates in with everything but the Nintendo Switch using custom AMD SoCs. Nvidia's Tegra hasn't gotten any real love, so its not like they can take over the mobile gaming scene with that chip like they could've.

 

1 hour ago, Mikey89 said:

So i just saw AMD's FSR 3 announcement and presentation and gamescom and they said FSR 3 will work on old GPUs.

 

My question is will FSR 3 work even on older GPUs like my GTX 1660 SUPER ?

 

I can't really find a lot of accurate info on this except that a lot of people agree that it will work on old cards too but nothing specific.

For OP, I wouldn't expect it to work natively, and be kludgey or buggy if you can get it to work.

 

Worth considering an RX 6000 series card. Even the lowest end actual gaming card, the RX 6600, is better than the 1660S. Considering how dense the lower RX 6000 series stack is between $150-$400 without much competition between it, it's likely to stick around If TSMC keeps letting them use the fab time.