4090 degrees zero (0c)

[Ali Mahmoud]

Does it make a difference in overclocking, will I get a satisfactory performance?

in game like warzone2 4k ultra 

How much performance increase will I get if I can make the card to zero temperature and then overclock it?

Is it important to cool vrm and momery well, does it affect a large percentage?

[Shimejii]

 You will not be able to go below ambient temp on an air cooler and most liquid coolers (unless you have one in a chiller). Unless you live in a really cold place, and you have the components being cooled by that freezing air but then there is potential for other issues like condensation and such. Generally just keeping it at 40-68C is more then fine for performance.

 

Generally you will already be getting satisfactory performance even at 65c, theres no real benefit of going to 0c unless you are trying to do something specific for a short time like OC world record stuff, but you wont be doing that. 

 

 

[RONOTHAN##]

1 minute ago, Ali Mahmoud said:

Does it make a difference in overclocking

Yes, but not that much of a difference, and there are a lot of other things you need to do at the same time to get something remotely noticeable. To get anything more than just ~50-100MHz extra compared to ambient, you will need to modify the card to get an unlocked power limit and manual voltage control. That also means that you need to have a rather high end 4090 so that you won't have to worry about the VRM blowing up when trying to run 800W through it (plus it's a good idea to also solder on a second power connector if you get a board that supports it). 

 

9 minutes ago, Ali Mahmoud said:

Is it important to cool vrm and momery well, does it affect a large percentage?

Yes and no. Yes, they both need to be cooled so some sort of aftermarket cooling solution is required if you want to do this, but neither of them like going below ~20C ambient. That is the biggest issue with taking 4090s on LN2, the core clocks scale all the way down to full pot, but as memory temps get below ~15-20C (this happens because the cold spreads through the PCB to cool the memory) it clocks worse and worse, resulting in overall worse performance compared to something closer to -120C on the core and a board heater to keep the memory above -20. So yes, you want to keep them cool, but no you don't want to get them sub ambient. 

 

14 minutes ago, Ali Mahmoud said:

How much performance increase will I get if I can make the card to zero temperature and then overclock it?

 

if you're lucky, maybe 10%? It's ton of effort to go through for a performance difference that would be barely noticeable. 

 

Doing something like this more for just the fun of it/competitive benchmarking rather than something that would actually be a good idea to daily. You basically have to sacrifice a 4090 to be able to do this, the power draw of the cooling system would be unreal, you'd get barely any performance advantage, and it would take a miracle to take it from breaking down on you within a month or two if you try to actually daily it. If you've got the money and the time to do it, knock yourself out, odds are it would be very fun to do for the right type of person, but there are so many things that go wrong with this that it just doesn't make sense to do, and if you just want to do this for the fun of it, you'd be better off trying to take the card on LN2/DICE than try to setup a makeshift chiller for 24/7 operation. 

[Ali Mahmoud]

9 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

Yes, but not that much of a difference, and there are a lot of other things you need to do at the same time to get something remotely noticeable. To get anything more than just ~50-100MHz extra compared to ambient, you will need to modify the card to get an unlocked power limit and manual voltage control. That also means that you need to have a rather high end 4090 so that you won't have to worry about the VRM blowing up when trying to run 800W through it (plus it's a good idea to also solder on a second power connector if you get a board that supports it). 

I know all the difficulties that will face me and the problems and I know how to solve them, but after all this I will get only 10%

After cooling with peltier and chiller i will get only 10% ?

[RONOTHAN##]

2 minutes ago, Ali Mahmoud said:

I know all the difficulties that will face me and the problems and I know how to solve them, but after all this I will get only 10%

After cooling with peltier and chiller i will get only 10% ?

If you're lucky. On LN2 those cards only get maybe another 500MHz on average (Source: HWBot), so at 0C you would probably be more in the neighborhood of 200-300MHz at best, so about ~8-10%. Those cards just don't really scale all that much. 

[Ali Mahmoud]

7 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

If you're lucky. On LN2 those cards only get maybe another 500MHz on average (Source: HWBot), so at 0C you would probably be more in the neighborhood of 200-300MHz at best, so about ~8-10%. Those cards just don't really scale all that much. 

not worth it

And if you do it with a processor too

what i will get

What are LN2 cards? i want use 4090 asus strix 

[RONOTHAN##]

1 minute ago, Ali Mahmoud said:

And if you do it with a processor too

CPUs scale a bit more, Der8auer has done a bit of temperature performance scaling with both AMD and Intel parts if you want to see how they scale. Still not really gonna notice it in a gaming system unless you play at 1080P (which why would you want to with a 4090?), so it's still not really worth it, but its still more likely to work on a CPU than on a GPU. 

 

5 minutes ago, Ali Mahmoud said:

What are LN2 cards? i want use 4090 asus strix 

LN2 cards are GPUs that are taken on Liquid Nitrogen. There are cards that are more designed for it than others (referred to as the XOC cards), the K|NGP|N lineup was famous for this (RIP EVGA's GPU division), same with the Galax HOF lineup, ASUS's Matrix lineup, MSI's Lightning lineup, etc., though the only ones still being made today that qualify as XOC cards are the HOF cards. Any card is capable of LN2, all that's required is that the VRM on the card can handle how much power the GPU can pull when sub zero, but the non-LN2 cards are missing features to make LN2 easier and will require a lot more soldering and modifications to the PCB in order to get it prepped for LN2. 

 

The Strix card is about 1 step removed from an XOC card, it's very capable of it (again, as evidenced by Der8auer's card on LN2), but it doesn't have the same factory modifications to it like the other cards do, where the only things you have to do to prepare the card for LN2 is insulate the card and flash the XOC BIOS, with a Strix you would also have to volt mod it. 

[Ali Mahmoud]

19 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

CPUs scale a bit more, Der8auer has done a bit of temperature performance scaling with both AMD and Intel parts if you want to see how they scale. Still not really gonna notice it in a gaming system unless you play at 1080P (which why would you want to with a 4090?), so it's still not really worth it, but its still more likely to work on a CPU than on a GPU. 

 

LN2 cards are GPUs that are taken on Liquid Nitrogen. There are cards that are more designed for it than others (referred to as the XOC cards), the K|NGP|N lineup was famous for this (RIP EVGA's GPU division), same with the Galax HOF lineup, ASUS's Matrix lineup, MSI's Lightning lineup, etc., though the only ones still being made today that qualify as XOC cards are the HOF cards. Any card is capable of LN2, all that's required is that the VRM on the card can handle how much power the GPU can pull when sub zero, but the non-LN2 cards are missing features to make LN2 easier and will require a lot more soldering and modifications to the PCB in order to get it prepped for LN2. 

 

The Strix card is about 1 step removed from an XOC card, it's very capable of it (again, as evidenced by Der8auer's card on LN2), but it doesn't have the same factory modifications to it like the other cards do, where the only things you have to do to prepare the card for LN2 is insulate the card and flash the XOC BIOS, with a Strix you would also have to volt mod it. 

https://www.techpowerup.com/300541/galax-geforce-rtx-4090-hof-pcb-pictured-with-two-16-pin-power-inputs

Will this be ok do I need it with my use

pelttier and chiller

Or is a normal version enough like 4090 asus strix

Will it give me a difference

[RONOTHAN##]

1 hour ago, Ali Mahmoud said:

https://www.techpowerup.com/300541/galax-geforce-rtx-4090-hof-pcb-pictured-with-two-16-pin-power-inputs

Will this be ok do I need it with my use

pelttier and chiller

Or is a normal version enough like 4090 asus strix

Will it give me a difference

A normal version would be OK, the HOF card is better but good luck getting one, they're limited editions almost exclusively sold in Asia, and for the most part Galax sends them to XOC guys first, so only a few of them ever make it to retail. 

 

Though remember, the chiller really doesn't make sense. It's such a little performance improvement that it just doesn't make sense for a daily system. Sub zero on a 4090 is only really worthwhile for competitive benchmarking and that's about it.