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First build suggestions/advice

Seethan
By Seethan
in New Builds and Planning
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Budget (including currency): Around 1500 USD

Country: USA

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: I'm in school for electrical engineering, so I'll need to be able to do 3D modeling and coding. I also want to be able to play games like minecraft, apex, warzone, etc. at high fps (at the absolute least more than 60 fps, preferably above 120) at 1080p for now. I want to be able to do up to 4k at some point, but not yet (I'll upgrade once I have a better budget). This'll be my first pc. I do have a monitor, mouse, and keyboard.

 

 

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Couple of questions before making the build

  1. Can you wait like a month before building your computer, or do you need it within the next week? Next gen GPUs and (more importantly for you) CPUs are releasing in the next couple of weeks (AMD is releasing on September 27th with the motherboards worth considering (B650) releasing sometime in October, Intel is announcing their next gen gear the same day with releases in also sometime in mid October), and given the performance uplifts we're expected to see from these new chips, you're likely much better off waiting for them. Even if you don't go for them, there will likely be some bigger price cuts in last gen hardware that would let you get a higher tier CPU for the same price.
  2. You say you're in school for electrical engineering, do you know what software you need for your degree? Some software doesn't really care what kind of GPU you've got, but others does care a ton. If you're gonna be spending something like $1000 on a GPU, for example, for some software you might be best going for an RTX 3080 Ti, but for some software (Solidworks, for example) you really want to have an RTX A4000 since those programs use instruction sets only present on Quadro-class card (the Quadro name has been more or less deprecated, but that tier of card still exists). Even though the A4000 has a much weaker die, in a lot (but not all) of workstation tasks it will outperform the 3080 Ti, but if you're going to focus on software that doesn't benefit from that the 3080 Ti would come out ahead. Also, some applications just work better on one brand of hardware, whether that be Intel, AMD, or Nvidia, so knowing what the software likes and what it doesn't would be kinda helpful.
  3. What's your stance on used hardware? I just figure there are gonna be a lot of Ryzen 9 5950Xs and AM4 motherboards going to be on eBay soon, and it's probably a good idea to take advantage of them if possible. 
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3 minutes ago, Seethan said:

I don't need it before then, I was in fact gonna wait till the end of the year to potentially snag some deals on parts. The main software would be SolidWorks. As long as I don't get screwed over, I'm completely fine getting used.

If you're gonna wait till the end of the year, then yeah wait for the end of the year before fully deciding on what to get. You're probably gonna want to get a 16 core Zen CPU (probably go for a deal on a 5950X, wouldn't go older, but it depends on how far discounted it is whether or not it would make sense to get over the 7900X or 7950X) and some Quadro, likely either an A4000 or a used Quadro RTX 5000 or, if the budget is tight, Quadro RTX 4000 (all of those cards are still plenty capable of 1080P 60FPS gaming, likely higher depending on the settings you run at), but everything else in the PC space shifts so frequently that making specific recommendations for them is next to impossible this far in advanced. 

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2 minutes ago, Seethan said:

Can I use a gpu that isn't a quadro? A classmate uses a laptop with a 3060 in it and it works fine.

You could, they work and everything, but Quadros and other workstation cards just perform better in Solidwork as their similarly priced GeForce counterparts, even though they are down in raw silicon performance. Basically, do you want a card that's better for gaming (consumer), or a card that's better at modeling and rendering work (Quadro)? For reference, in Solidworks a Quadro RTX 4000 is roughly 45% faster than an RTX 3080 Ti even though in games the RTX 4000 is closest compared to an RTX 2060/2060 Super, while on the used market that aforementioned Quadro is roughly half the cost of said 3080 Ti.

 

As for why, Quadros have a couple different instruction sets that just aren't present on the GeForce cards (double precision and a couple others IIRC, forget the exact ones off the top of my head), and while games never touch those, SolidWorks and some other workstation applications use them extremely frequently, to the point where a GeForce card can be crippled in comparison at point. 

 

Also quote so we get a notification. 

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1 hour ago, RONOTHAN## said:

Basically, do you want a card that's better for gaming (consumer), or a card that's better at modeling and rendering work (Quadro)? 

I guess at present, I would need a card that is for gaming but can handle SolidWorks when I need to use it (which won't be too much). Would, say, a 3060ti be fine?

 

2 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

Also quote so we get a notification. 

😉

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1 minute ago, Seethan said:

I guess at present, I would need a card that is for gaming but can handle SolidWorks when I need to use it (which won't be too much). Would, say, a 3060ti be fine?

 

Yeah, if that's your goal a 3060 Ti is definitely a solid card. Granted, next gen GPUs will be out around the end of the year, so you might be able to step that up to a 3070 on the used market or just go for a 4070 in general, but the 3060 Ti is definitely a solid card for a gaming first, SolidWorks second card.

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1 hour ago, Seethan said:

Ok, cool👍

So what would coding like to have?

It does depend on the compiler and what you're trying to do, but usually it's a lot of cores, a lot of RAM, and if you're doing machine learning stuff a Nvidia GPU (like the aforementioned 3060). Basically a SolidWorks workstation but with much lower GPU requirements. 

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36 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

It does depend on the compiler and what you're trying to do, but usually it's a lot of cores, a lot of RAM, and if you're doing machine learning stuff a Nvidia GPU (like the aforementioned 3060). Basically a SolidWorks workstation but with much lower GPU requirements. 

Hence the much higher grade cpu you suggested (compared to what I was considering)? How much RAM do you think? 

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3 minutes ago, Seethan said:

Hence the much higher grade cpu you suggested (compared to what I was considering)? How much RAM do you think? 

To be fair, you can get by with a much lower end CPU than the aforementioned 5950X, I just figured that for a budget of $1500 at the top end you could probably afford one, especially when they go on clearance around the end of the year, and it should help a fair bit compared to something more reasonable like a 12600K or 5700X. 

 

RAM I would want at the very minimum 32GB with the potential to upgrade to 64GB (basically get a board with 4 DIMM slots and get a 2x16GB kit), though if you'd prefer to never think about it again 64GB should be plenty for everything you're realistically gonna do in school. 

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52 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

RAM I would want at the very minimum 32GB with the potential to upgrade to 64GB (basically get a board with 4 DIMM slots and get a 2x16GB kit), though if you'd prefer to never think about it again 64GB should be plenty for everything you're realistically gonna do in school. 

Sounds good. I'll wait to settle on a cpu and mobo (and probably gpu) till later in the year, once the new stuff comes out. If anything, 32 gb should be plenty.

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17 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

you might be able to step that up to a 3070 on the used market or just go for a 4070 in general, but the 3060 Ti is definitely a solid card for a gaming first, SolidWorks second card.

Would a 3070 at $320 something be worth it?

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2 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

I'd say it is, that's roughly where I'd expect the prices to end up by the end of the year, and you'll bypass all the potential shortages with 40 series releases.

What would you say is the max price to pay for used?

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7 minutes ago, Seethan said:

What brand would you suggest/trust when it comes to gpus (as in msi, sapphire, etc.)? Or is a founder's edition better?

For a 3070 it really doesn't matter. I've used pretty much all of them (only cards I haven't had in the past IIRC is Galax and Sapphire), and they're all pretty similar in overall quality. When you start looking at more top end cards (3080s, 6900 XTs, etc.) then the actual specific card starts to matter a bit more (I.E. for a 6900 XT I'd really want to get an OC Formula or Gaming Z if they aren't absurdly expensive), same if you're planning on doing extreme overclocking, but brand by itself isn't really an indicator for anything other than what the warranty service will be (IIRC EVGA is the only one that has a transferrable warranty if you're buying used, so keep that in mind). 

 

The founders cards are about on par with the other custom PCBs. 3070s aren't really difficult cards to deal with or anything, and they're pretty hard to screw up. I personally wouldn't pay extra for an FE, but I wouldn't avoid it either. Realistically, a 3070 is a 3070, and whatever you get will be just fine. 

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On 9/16/2022 at 7:06 PM, RONOTHAN## said:

For a used 3070 at the moment, $400.

I got my hands on a 3070 for $390. I'm gonna start ordering the rest of the parts now, but before I green light it, here's the final list:

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 3.4 GHz 16-Core Processor  ($537.88 @ Amazon) 
CPU Cooler: Fractal Design Lumen S24 RGB 56 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler  ($146.99 @ Amazon) 
Motherboard: ASRock B550M Steel Legend Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard  ($114.99 @ Newegg) 
Memory: Corsair Vengeance RGB RT 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory  ($124.99 @ Corsair) 
Storage: Crucial P2 500 GB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive  ($39.99 @ Adorama) 
Storage: Crucial P2 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive  ($76.75 @ Amazon) 
Case: Fractal Design Meshify C ATX Mid Tower Case  ($112.27 @ Amazon) 
Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA P5 750 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  ($89.99 @ EVGA) 
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 Home OEM - DVD 64-bit  ($99.99 @ Newegg) 
Total: $1343.84
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2022-09-23 19:52 EDT-0400

(Not including the gpu) I do have a question about the AIO, though. I know I'm going with a pretty beefy cpu and gpu, so I'm wondering if the AIO is sufficient. What do you think?

I'm also just going to wait to go with the new gun stuff until further down the road. My budget just wouldn't permit the extra money from that stuff, and what I have chosen will be plenty in my case for at least a few years.

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1 hour ago, Seethan said:

I do have a question about the AIO, though. I know I'm going with a pretty beefy cpu and gpu, so I'm wondering if the AIO is sufficient. What do you think?

A 240mm AIO is enough for a 5950X, though you a much cheaper dual tower air cooler is also enough, and if you do want an AIO for looks, The Arctic Liquid Freezer II 240 is $40 cheaper and a better AIO. 

 

1 hour ago, Seethan said:

I'm also just going to wait to go with the new gun stuff until further down the road. My budget just wouldn't permit the extra money from that stuff, and what I have chosen will be plenty in my case for at least a few years.

Fair enough, though I might still wait a little bit to see if the last gen gear does come down a bit more in price, or if you can get a used 5950X from an enthusiast when they upgrade immediately to a 7950X. It's just a week so might as well just wait and see. 

 

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/zNTmW4

 

If you aren't though, I'd probably go for a slightly cheaper RAM kit and a different cooler (also get the Windows key from a reseller, don't pay full price for it)

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45 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

The Arctic Liquid Freezer II 240 is $40 cheaper and a better AIO.

When looking at AIOs, is it pretty much based off of the cfm?

45 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

Fair enough, though I might still wait a little bit to see if the last gen gear does come down a bit more in price, or if you can get a used 5950X from an enthusiast when they upgrade immediately to a 7950X. It's just a week so might as well just wait and see. 

I was planning on doing just that.

45 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

(also get the Windows key from a reseller, don't pay full price for it)

Is there one you know of or would recommend?

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