Fixall

Concurred. And I don't blame you. I was very disappointed in how LTT neglected to address the Larrabee "situation" and I am very disappointed in how HardOCP handled the 2070 release review. I know Kyle obviously isn't getting along with Nvidia and isn't a big fan of the Youtube tech reviewers/entertainers and holds no allegiance to them... But that's not a good enough reason to screw over the whole industry. I feel the worst for sites like GamerNexus who rely on the deep delving, nitty gritty reviews as opposed to entertainment to get views. Very valid point.

I agree with the vast majority of what you are saying. But wouldn't the same logic apply the Hardocp case? Wouldn't the only person worth hearing from be the person/entity that sold the GPU to Kyle, considering we don't know the specifics of the sale nor the laws? I guess in my mind, I view parts of the two situations as the same. LTT obtained a GPU that many others would love to review but cannot and then released a video for views. Hardocp obtained a GPU that many others would love to review but cannot and then released an article for views. I think both situations are crappy. I will say I prefer Hardocp's being an honest jerk over LTT's silence. The comment from the winning bidder on the Larrabee Youtube video had over 2,500 upvotes before it was mysteriously deleted.

Correct. And to know the release date, you would have to have insider information from the embargo which Kyle wasn't privy to. In the review, Kyle claimed he knew when the embargo would be lifted, not that he knew when the GPU would be released. The date the embargo lifts, is not necessarily the date a GPU would be released. I agree it would be silly to have a release date before the embargo was lifted and I agree that it's a huge stretch to think Kyle didn't know the release date of the 2070. I'm solely speaking from a legal standpoint and the burden of proof. That's not at all the argument I'm trying to make. I would 100% place my bet that Kyle knew exactly when the release date on the 2070 was. Just like I would 100% place my bet that Linus knew that it was illegal for someone to sell a prototype Larrabe GPU on ebay. I would also place my bet that the person from LMG knew they were making an offer on a GPU on ebay that had already been purchased. It's not what you know/think though... It's what you can prove is what I was getting at. You're completely ignoring the point and the reason for my post in the first place (great deflection though). Members here are making a stink about Hardocp releasing the 2070 review early(which I agree was a dick move). I just wanted to know if members here were going to hold LTT to the same standards they hold Hardocp to. The answer seems to be a resounding no.

Correct. That's why I say it's almost impossible that Kyle didn't know. But something being public information doesn't equate to an individual knowing said information... Which is what someone would have to prove. Just like I could say Intel having engineers arrested and prosecuted over selling prototypes on ebay is public knowledge, but it would be hard to prove that Linus knew that... Even if the articles about it were posted on HIS WEBSITE/FORUM back in 2014. https://www.techspot.com/news/46902-engineers-arrested-for-selling-sample-cpus-on-ebay.html https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1260875https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/281796-engineering-samples/ https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/281796-engineering-samples/

Proving that Kyle knew the release date on the 2070 when he didn't have insider information from the embargo is exactly what someone would have to do though. I agree that's it's nearly impossible that Kyle didn't know when the 2070 was supposed to be released. But I also think it's nearly impossible that Linus didn't know that the Larrabee prototype wasn't supposed to be sold on ebay. I'm just curious as to why members hold Hardocp to higher standards than LMG. Hardocp (very likely) purchased a GPU unethically and released a review on it to gain views that other reviewers could not. LTT (very likely) purchased a prototype GPU unethically and released a review on it to gain views that other reviewers could not.

Nope. I'm saying you don't have any more proof that Kyle knew the 2070 wasn't allowed to be purchased until the embargo date as I do that the purchaser from LMG knew that the Larrabee protype was unethically sourced from Intel and was then unethically purchased from ebay after it had already been sold. Assumptions and incomplete evidence... That's it. Nope. I asked Sazrocks if he holds LTT to the same standards that he holds Hardocp to. That's it. Then you butted in. Nope. Instead I sent a message to gtech on ebay and he was the one who said he was contacted on ebay by a member of LMG. Pretty easy to figure out the card was purchased by LMG from ebay though... Because LTT says so IN THE VIDEO. You said for me to compare the situations, I would have to know that LMG knew they were purchasing the card unethically. And then proceeded to offer up the fact that many people post things for sale on ebay and other sites at the same time, breaking ebay's TOS... Was this supposed to be a form of supporting evidence? LMG purchased the card from ebay (as stated in the video). LMG made the offer on ebay for the Larrabee GPU after the auction had ended and someone else had won. LMG offered an amount higher than the winning bid for the Larrabee GPU. This is enough evidence for me that the LMG employee knew they were making an unethical purchase. To take things further... Intel policy says the Larrabee GPU should not have left their property and was illegally sold. I find it laughable that LMG didn't know this. I find it equally laughable that Kyle didn't know he couldn't post the review early (but equally hard to prove). The message was sent and the deal was made AFTER the auction had ended and the buyer had already paid the money for the GPU. It's pretty freaking obvious on ebay when a item has sold considering they pull the page. Are you trying to claim that LMG could have sent the buyer a message before the auction ended, offering them ~$400 and asking them to pull it... And then the seller proceeding to let the auction continue until it ended. Accepted the money from the buyer... And then refunded the money to the buyer and proceeded to sell to Linus instead? That could be a possibility, but then how did LMG not see that the auction had ended with a winning bidder when they messaged the seller to set up payment arrangements? We know for sure Linus knew the PROTOTYPE card he bought was not meant to be sold (that sounds familiar). No arguments here. I didn't claim it changes anything and I'm not sure where you got that. I am not holding Linus to one set of standards and Kyle to a different set of standards. Read my first post. I asked Sazrocks if HE/SHE was going to hold LTT to the same standards that he seems to hold Hardocp. That's it. You're the one who got all riled up and assumed I was ok with Hardocp releasing the 2070 review early. As far as I'm concerned, I think what Hardocp AND LinusTechTips did was scummy. For what it's worth, the winning bidder said he was happy Linus got the card solely because it would result in at least SOME information about it coming to light instead of it sitting in a collectors safe.

You have as much proof that Kyle obtained the 2070 unethically as I do that LMG obtained Larrabee prototype unethically. Kyle didn't sign the NDA and is out of the loop. Go ahead and prove that he knew that he was obtaining the 2070 unethically. Considering you're not him... That might be hard to do. It is against Intel's company policies for the Larrabee protype to have ever left the Intel facility, let alone be posted for sale on ebay. Linus at the very least knows this and hints at it in the Larrabee video. If Intel decided to trace this GPU back to an Intel employee, the individual would be fired and likely prosecuted. Sounds pretty unethically obtained to me. The message from LMG was also sent to the Larrabee seller THROUGH ebay and happened moments after the ebay auction ended. That may not be enough proof for you, but it is for me. Just because something happens, doesn't mean it isn't against ebay's terms of service that both buyers and sellers have to agree to. This is all covered in my previous replies, so I'll leave it at that... Other than the fact that I posted a link to the Hardforum thread. I avoided posting it at first, so I could go read the LTT ToS. Many sites don't like you linking to other forums. Also... It's nice of you to fight his battles for him, but I was addressing Sazrocks, and I certainly don't remember bringing your name into the conversation.

I think maybe you don't understand the situation I am talking about... Or I am having trouble following what you are trying to say. Sazroc claimed that Hardocp obtained the 2070 unethically and then released the review early for clicks, thus screwing over the reviewers who signed the Nvidia NDA and were required to wait for the embargo to lift. I asked him if he held LMG/LTT to an equal ethical standard that he seems to hold Hardocp to. Here's a summary of that situation in case you are unfamiliar: A member of Hardocp WON an ebay auction for an Intel Larrabee prototype and paid the seller $310 +$20 shipping. By winning the auction the buyer and seller entered a contractual agreement and the seller was obligated to ship the card to the hardocp member. Instead the seller received a message moments after the auction ended from someone at LMG offering nearly $400 for the GPU (as quoted in the LTT Larrabee video) and he decided to sell to LMG and refunded the hardforum member's money. Thus, LTT obtained the card unethically, screwing over a fellow GPU enthusiast and then produced the Larrabee video for clicks. Since LTT has not responded the issue (and the comment with hundreds of upvotes about it on Youtube from the original buyer has mysteriously been deleted), I can only assume that LMG lost the auction and then made the backdoor offer on the GPU. There's a five page thread about it over at Hardforum spelling out the situation with all the evidence if you're interested. *Edited with a link from the thread at Hardforum. https://hardforum.com/threads/intel-larrabee-a-prototype.1948986/

Are you just as pissed off at Linus Tech Tips for the bullcrap they pulled to produce the Intel Larrabee video? A forum member from Hardforum won auction on ebay fair and square only to have Linus Media Group contact the buyer and talk him into selling to LMG instead. Seems like a case of LTT screwing over a fellow GPU enthusiast for views to me. I don't see you throwing a fit about that. Shill.

If you can... I would wait just a tiny bit longer. Asus, MSI, ASRock etc... Have all had their H370, H310, and B360 motherboards leaked recently, so I imagine the low cost Intel boards are just right around the corner. On top of that, Wal~Mart just listed the soon to be released i5-8500 and Celeron G4920 with a release date of 3/21. If that date is correct, I highly suspect the new motherboards will also be out at or around that time. It might give you a little more to think about once the prices on the new motherboards are released.

Looks like Wal~Mart has the Intel i5-8500 and Celeron G4920 listed online with both prices and availability date (no word on clock speed). The i5-8400 is listed at $221.36 (save $3 with in store pickup) with an availability date of 3/21. https://www.walmart.com/ip/Intel-Core-i5-8500-Processor/504378797 The Celeron G4920 is listed at $65.75 (save $1 with in store pickup) also with an availability date of 3/21. https://www.walmart.com/ip/Intel-Celeron-G4920-Processor/902479286 I've been waiting for Intel to release the i5-8500 (as well as the cheaper itx motherboards) so I could decide if it would be worth picking up over an i5-8400 for the secondary rig. If Wal~Mart is pricing the i5-8500 correctly, and not gouging... At $40 more than an i5-8400 the price of the i5-8500 is rather disappointing to me. There's not a lot of wiggle room between the i5-8400 (2.8Ghz base, 4Ghz turbo) and the i5-8600k (3.6Ghz base, 4.3Ghz turbo) for Intel to add both an 8500 and 8600 (non k) so I don't expect to see anything more than a couple hundred mhz boost on the i5-8500 over the i5-8400. I just don't see how that justifies an extra $40. Most sites were expecting a $10 - $20 increase over the i5-8500 which would make a lot more sense. Here's hoping the lower cost H370, B360, and B310 motherboards will be released at or around the same time.

You'd be fine.

The Core 500 is like 65% larger than the M1. That's pretty significant. I'd go with the Corsair sf450. It will be plenty powerful enough for a 970 and and Ryzen 2/9th Gen i7 and reviews actually tend to favor it over the sf600 most of the time (quieter). I actually just ordered an sf450 myself after reading a ton of reviews (hardocp, jonnyguru, and kitguru all had great reviews). It's quiet, has an excellent 12v rail, seven year warranty, and has a max output that's a bit over 500w. I love Silverstone (I'll be using an Argon aR06 in that same build I mentioned) but there hasn't been much of a reason to purchase an sfx power supply from them since Corsair released their sf line. The Corsair's are more efficient, have better build quality, have a better warranty, have better cables, are competitively priced, and (in my opinion) look better.

Yup. A drop of 15 - 20 degrees is seen on a regular basis. Don't expect to get anymore overclocking headroom out of it though. It's pretty damn nice seeing your CPU temps hovering around your GPU temps though (I'm on water).