PSU recommendation, ~250$

[Szynek]

Hello,

 

Got a surprise gift card for 1000PLN (~250$) for Christmas, and as I already upgraded my GPU recently, I decided to spend it on PSU; preferably all of it (it can even be an overkill, especially given future upgrades), unless you have better ideas to upgrade, based on my spec. Note, that I'm not sure when it is due and how many times it can be split, so I'm planning to spend it all in one go (perhaps with some additional cost from my wallet, without getting too crazy of course).

 

Current/future spec:

* MSI B450M MORTAR MAX

* AMD Ryzen 3700X (stock cooling); planned upgrade to 5800X3D at some point

* 4x8GB DDR4-3200

* 1xSATA HDD

* 1xSATA SSD

* 1xM2 SSD

* 3x case fans (stock, included in be quiet 802 case)

* Sapphire 6950 XT Nitro+

 

I don't know a lot about PSUs, but here are 2 that seem fairly popular:

* Seasonic Prime GX-1000 1000W --> https://allegro.pl/oferta/zasilacz-seasonic-prime-gx-1000-80plus-gold-13746799660

* be quiet! Straight Power 12 1500W --> https://allegro.pl/oferta/zasilacz-be-quiet-straight-power-12-1500w-80-plus-platinum-atx-3-0-14761326792#

 

Now, I know that the 2nd one is a crazy overkill (though the hope is, that it would have been enough for the next decade or so), but considering the price/differences ratio (500W more, ATX 3.0, platinum instead of gold) + the fact that I would effectively pay fraction of its price anyway, I think it may not be a bad choice (?). Then again, I don't know much about PSUs, so I'm opened to suggestions. Of course I could find 900-1000W PSU for ~800PLN but that only makes sense if there's any idea as to how to spend the rest. Also, I could maybe do a stretch and buy Ryzen 5800X3D right now (instead of PSU that is), but I'd be afraid to run it with current GPU on 750W (theoretically could work, but way too risky for me, I had some suggestions that I'm already cutting it too close as it is).

 

Also some general questions:

1. I remember reading couple years ago, that it is generally advised to have separate cable/connector per GPU socket. Is this still true for 2.5 connectors (8+8+6) on 6950XT (or was it ever true for that matter)? I'm asking, because eg. be quiet! one seems to have only 2 physical cables (each of them splits to 2x8), so I'm wondering if that's not ideal:

 

2. I have a "only" 900W PSU atm, but I assume that it isn't dangerous to use them together? I mean the way I see it, worst-case scenario (only when/if 900W gets exceeded) is that the UPS will stop serving its purpose in that moment, but it does not mean that either it or PC will get physically damaged (it will just turn off during such outage). Of course preferably it would be better to have UPS functioning all the time, but tbh my power outages usually last for couple of seconds, so I find it extremely unlikely that I would just happen to have such huge spike in that exact moment (if ever).

[emosun]

why are you buying a power supply if the one you have works

[8tg]

13 minutes ago, Szynek said:

I remember reading couple years ago, that it is generally advised to have separate cable/connector per GPU socket. Is this still true for 2.5 connectors (8+8+6) on 6950XT (or was it ever true for that matter)? I'm asking, because eg. be quiet! one seems to have only 2 physical cables (each of them splits to 2x8), so I'm wondering if that's not ideal:

A lot of this is intentionally generalized to steer people who arent interested in getting super involved in PSU design from pushing a PSU too hard. Thinner gauge cables you dont want to run super high wattage gpus through using the split off dual 8 pins on one cable. Since if youre pulling 300 watts effectively through 6 lines turned into 3 lines, thinner cable can get extremely hot and potentially fail.

This isnt an issue at all for higher end power supplies that use thicker gauge cables. Its more of an issue if you were to like, try and run a 300 watt Sapphire R9 280x Toxic on a thermaltake TR2 using the split 8+8 pin, which could (and for me literally did) cause the cable to melt.

On a high end PSU, use the split 8+8's if you want, its not a concern, the cable can handle it.

17 minutes ago, Szynek said:

I have a "only" 900W PSU atm, but I assume that it isn't dangerous to use them together? I mean the way I see it, worst-case scenario (only when/if 900W gets exceeded) is that the UPS will stop serving its purpose in that moment, but it does not mean that either it or PC will get physically damaged (it will just turn off during such outage). Of course preferably it would be better to have UPS functioning all the time, but tbh my power outages usually last for couple of seconds, so I find it extremely unlikely that I would just happen to have such huge spike in that exact moment (if ever).

I presume you mean a 900 watt UPS? You dont want your UPS to have a lower load rating than the psu you have plugged into it. It will just fail if you surpass that wattage. 

If you never surpass that wattage, its not really a concern. But lets say you do, and run 6950xt crossfire in a benchmark, pull 1200 watts from the wall in a spike and yes that will likely overcurrent the UPS, which will shut off or blow a fuse. 

That wont damage the PC, current will be cut off before the PC, it would be like unplugging it from the wall. Not great for it but it wont cause any real damage.

 

I would go with the Prime GX1000, its a really nice power supply overall, highly rated, highly recommended. And since you dont really need the wattage so much as its nice to have, 1000w will be plenty. I wouldnt consider 1200w or higher power supplies unless you intend to go with a 4090 and 14900k overclocked to the moon later.

[8tg]

4 minutes ago, emosun said:

why are you buying a power supply if the one you have works

This is another thing as well to consider. Would that money be better spent elsewhere in the system if the psu you have is fine?

Just the same though as anything else, if you just want to upgrade the PSU for the sake of upgrading, theres no harm in that. Having excessive or overkill parts sometimes can be nice. 

I speak as someone powering an intel N100 with a Corsair RM1000x, granted thats more because its funny, but its also like, i will never have to worry about that PSU for as long as im alive.

[Szynek]

42 minutes ago, emosun said:

why are you buying a power supply if the one you have works

 

36 minutes ago, 8tg said:

This is another thing as well to consider. Would that money be better spent elsewhere in the system if the psu you have is fine?

Just the same though as anything else, if you just want to upgrade the PSU for the sake of upgrading, theres no harm in that. Having excessive or overkill parts sometimes can be nice. 

I speak as someone powering an intel N100 with a Corsair RM1000x, granted thats more because its funny, but its also like, i will never have to worry about that PSU for as long as im alive.

As mentioned in the OP:

1. I'm cutting it close atm. Just because something technically works, doesn't mean it is safe. Note, that for 6950XT, 850W is recommended.

2. I'm planning to upgrade to 5800X3D at some point in the future. I can't start with new CPU though (as this PSU would not be enough, IMO), so I'm starting with PSU.

3. If you have better suggestions on what to upgrade withing that budget, I'm opened to them.

[emosun]

6 minutes ago, Szynek said:

1. I'm cutting it close atm. Just because something technically works, doesn't mean it is safe. Note, that for 6950XT, 850W is recommended.

you do understand that your machine doesn't use 850 watts yeah? not even at 100% load

[Szynek]

41 minutes ago, 8tg said:

I presume you mean a 900 watt UPS? You dont want your UPS to have a lower load rating than the psu you have plugged into it. It will just fail if you surpass that wattage. 

If you never surpass that wattage, its not really a concern. But lets say you do, and run 6950xt crossfire in a benchmark, pull 1200 watts from the wall in a spike and yes that will likely overcurrent the UPS, which will shut off or blow a fuse. 

That wont damage the PC, current will be cut off before the PC, it would be like unplugging it from the wall. Not great for it but it wont cause any real damage.

Yup, I meant UPS, characters' order got confused there

 

Anyway, thanks for the response, that is the answer I was hoping for.

 

44 minutes ago, 8tg said:

I wouldnt consider 1200w or higher power supplies unless you intend to go with a 4090 and 14900k overclocked to the moon later.

Well, that's true today, but this is a product with 10 years warranty + generally I'd say that PSU is something that you should be able to future-proof (?). I mean the way I see it, if today's card like 4090 can draw over 650W, then ~5 years from now it *could* become a TDP standard for mid-range cards.

 

On the other hand though, it is possible that at that point some completely new standard/technology *could* emerge, which would make my current purchase obsolete.

[8tg]

11 minutes ago, Szynek said:

Note, that for 6950XT, 850W is recommended.

What they recommend is again, an instance of covering all bases. Much like how forums like this wont recommend using split 8 pins, its a good generalization that avoids giving super situational advice.

Same applies to those PSU recommendations, nvidia recommends a 300w psu for the 20 watt ddr4 GT 1030

GeForce GT 1030 | Specifications | GeForce (nvidia.com)

 

Most metrics of the 6950xt show it pulling sub 600 watts of total system power under load with a 5800x.

AMD Radeon RX 6950 XT Review | TechSpot

Youd need to OC it pretty hard, and OC the 5800x3D, to maybe hit the sustained 750-800 watts under synthetic load that would be questionable but not out of the capabilities of a decent 900w psu.

Needed? No

But having the extra headroom doesnt hurt, if you want to have an excessive PSU you absolutely can, theres no harm in doing so. Its just worth looking at preparing for better future options, and if a higher wattage PSU is good preparation for that then go for it.

[8tg]

4 minutes ago, Szynek said:

he way I see it, if today's card like 4090 can draw over 650W, then ~5 years from now it *could* become a TDP standard for mid-range cards.

This is a whole separate thing on consumer ethics, should that hypothetical become the case, and the RX 7060 Super or whatever is a 600 watt gpu, ill still be buying extra 750ti's out of spite.

5 minutes ago, Szynek said:

On the other hand though, it is possible that at that point some completely new standard/technology *could* emerge, which would make my current purchase obsolete.

This is important, and its why you never really want to focus hard on the concept of future proofing. Having a higher wattage psu in case you need it really isnt that, at least not for most purchases and what people are usually looking at. But consider several changes from years and years prior.

AGP to Pcie, entire new psu standards? GPUs going from 20 watts to 70 watts to 150 watts within a few years? That stupid 12vhpwr whatever its called from nvidia? The launch of ryzen, the coffee lake counterplay, increasing core counts, P+E cores, etc

Nobody really sees that coming on a timescale that matters. Plenty of people bought early LGA 775 motherboards with DDR400 and AGP and within 3 months 925x came out and suddenly theres PCIe and ECC DDR2 in play, and they have to get a whole new type of gpu and psu.

You wont really know, trying to be ready for something potentially 5 years away isnt worth worrying about.

[Szynek]

4 minutes ago, emosun said:

you do understand that your machine doesn't use 850 watts yeah? not even at 100% load

You may (or may not) be right, opinions (including the ones I got outside of t his forum) seem to have been split, even though my own testing shown that it was likely to be ok-ish but possibly close --> https://linustechtips.com/topic/1540478-6950-xt-power-usage-psu/ 

 

Also, please do not forget about the other points that I have made.

[Szynek]

9 minutes ago, 8tg said:

What they recommend is again, an instance of covering all bases. Much like how forums like this wont recommend using split 8 pins, its a good generalization that avoids giving super situational advice.

Same applies to those PSU recommendations, nvidia recommends a 300w psu for the 20 watt ddr4 GT 1030

GeForce GT 1030 | Specifications | GeForce (nvidia.com)

I agree with that to some extent. That plus probably want to be super-cautious, plus when giving such recommendation they don't really have a context of the rest of the PC (so they probably take worst-case scenario into account).

 

That said, 6950XT is still quite power-hungry, supposedly can spike to even 500W+ on its own --> https://www.igorslab.de/en/radeon-rx-6950xt-rx-6750xt-and-rx-6650xt-review-with-the-energetic-crowbar/9/

 

If you add 5800X3D on the top of that (which will probably mean more GPU utilization as well, as currently I'm CPU limited), and then possibility to switch to OC BIOS on the top of that, and then the fact that you should have at least some breathing room in terms of wattage, it seems dangerously close to me.

 

Let me put it this way: I probably wouldn't consider it, if it weren't for the fact that it really is "free money" (mostly) at this point, and that way my hands won't be tied in the future.

9 minutes ago, 8tg said:

But having the extra headroom doesnt hurt, if you want to have an excessive PSU you absolutely can, theres no harm in doing so. Its just worth looking at preparing for better future options, and if a higher wattage PSU is good preparation for that then go for it.

Hah, read that too late, that is exactly what I meant to convey.

 

[emosun]

16 minutes ago, Szynek said:

You may (or may not) be right, opinions (including the ones I got outside of t his forum) seem to have been split, even though my own testing shown that it was likely to be ok-ish but possibly close -->

why are you trying to guess the power usage and not actually measuring the power usage

[Szynek]

16 minutes ago, 8tg said:

This is important, and its why you never really want to focus hard on the concept of future proofing. Having a higher wattage psu in case you need it really isnt that, at least not for most purchases and what people are usually looking at. But consider several changes from years and years prior.

AGP to Pcie, entire new psu standards? GPUs going from 20 watts to 70 watts to 150 watts within a few years? That stupid 12vhpwr whatever its called from nvidia? The launch of ryzen, the coffee lake counterplay, increasing core counts, P+E cores, etc

Nobody really sees that coming on a timescale that matters. Plenty of people bought early LGA 775 motherboards with DDR400 and AGP and within 3 months 925x came out and suddenly theres PCIe and ECC DDR2 in play, and they have to get a whole new type of gpu and psu.

You wont really know, trying to be ready for something potentially 5 years away isnt worth worrying about.

I generally agree, though I thought that things like PSU are exceptions to this rule (though again, I'm kind of contradicting myself here, because those new 12V connectors came out fairly recently). Then on the other hand, cost difference is really low here (for much more albeit redundant for me atm). I think I'm gonna gather some more opinions and maybe sleep on it.

[Szynek]

I eventually bought `be quiet! Straight Power 12 1200W` AKA still overkill, but not that crazy (fwiw, still ATX 3.0). It was ~950PLN for that + I added cheap PC fan for my home server box (old was getting loud).

 

Word of caution though, be careful with gift cards, not sure how common that is, but it seems like my platform really wanted me to not use it "by accident". Basically what happened was, that it would automatically un-assign my gift card every time I changed anything else in the order (like changing an address, or even ticking "invoice" checkbox) without any warning or anything. Idk, maybe it was just bad design, but I smelled dark pattern.