XPS 9500 Performance help

[Matt255]

I just bought a brand new xps 9500 and after 15minutes of gaming (DMC V) my frames tank to 30/20 frames. I tried disabling turbo and when i checked throttlestop, I was not getting the throttling warning but my gpu was maxxed at 100%. Any ideas what could be causing this and is there any work around? Even my previous xps 9575 performed better.

[Roswell]

Some kind of power throttling if that processor is maxing out at 26W unless Dell decided to slice its power allowance in half. What wattage is the power brick rated for?

[Matt255]

130w

[unclewebb]

@Matt255 Some Dell computers have a feature that when they start to heat up, instead of normal thermal throttling, they enforce severe power limit throttling well below the 45W TDP rating of your CPU. Not sure why Dell does this but they do.

 

To try to understand what is going on, clear the Disable Turbo box so your CPU is allowed to run at full speed. You can also clear the Speed Shift EPP box. The Windows 10 power slider in the system tray can be used to manage the EPP value.

 

Post screenshots of the FIVR and TPL windows. In the TPL window, check the MMIO Lock box and press Apply.

That option can help with some power limit throttling problems. 

 

 

Turn on the Log File option and go play a game for at least 15 minutes so the log can capture what is going on. When finished testing, exit ThrottleStop so it can finalize the log file. Attach the log file to your next post. It will be in your ThrottleStop / Logs folder.

 

Sadly, some of these throttling problems in Dell laptops can no longer be solved. Usually an embedded controller (EC) has been programmed to lower the turbo power limits internally to absurdly low values. The log file will show this. It will be useful information when contacting Dell. Some of their laptops with 45W processors are being power limit throttled down to only 10W. This kills performance and kills FPS like you are seeing. 

 

 

[Matt255]

On 9/1/2021 at 10:27 AM, unclewebb said:

@Matt255 Some Dell computers have a feature that when they start to heat up, instead of normal thermal throttling, they enforce severe power limit throttling well below the 45W TDP rating of your CPU. Not sure why Dell does this but they do.

 

To try to understand what is going on, clear the Disable Turbo box so your CPU is allowed to run at full speed. You can also clear the Speed Shift EPP box. The Windows 10 power slider in the system tray can be used to manage the EPP value.

 

Post screenshots of the FIVR and TPL windows. In the TPL window, check the MMIO Lock box and press Apply.

That option can help with some power limit throttling problems. 

 

 

Turn on the Log File option and go play a game for at least 15 minutes so the log can capture what is going on. When finished testing, exit ThrottleStop so it can finalize the log file. Attach the log file to your next post. It will be in your ThrottleStop / Logs folder.

 

Sadly, some of these throttling problems in Dell laptops can no longer be solved. Usually an embedded controller (EC) has been programmed to lower the turbo power limits internally to absurdly low values. The log file will show this. It will be useful information when contacting Dell. Some of their laptops with 45W processors are being power limit throttled down to only 10W. This kills performance and kills FPS like you are seeing. 

 

 

The strangest thing is in the morning, i played with no throttling for an hour but tonight its back. Here is the log file and screenshots

2021-09-05.txt

[unclewebb]

9 hours ago, Matt255 said:

throttling

The only throttling that I am seeing in the log file is because you disabled Intel Turbo Boost. Your CPU is capable of running 65% faster if turbo boost is enabled. 

 

The next problem I see are your power limits. If you are going to use 56W and 78W, you need to set PL1 to 56W and PL2 to 78W. You have these backwards. The default turbo time limit is 28 seconds. Not sure why you have this set to 0.0010 seconds.

 

I would check the Speed Shift option. That makes sure that the Speed Shift Min and Max values are being maintained in the CPU. 

[Matt255]

58 minutes ago, unclewebb said:

The only throttling that I am seeing in the log file is because you disabled Intel Turbo Boost. Your CPU is capable of running 65% faster if turbo boost is enabled. 

 

The next problem I see are your power limits. If you are going to use 56W and 78W, you need to set PL1 to 56W and PL2 to 78W. You have these backwards. The default turbo time limit is 28 seconds. Not sure why you have this set to 0.0010 seconds.

 

I would check the Speed Shift option. That makes sure that the Speed Shift Min and Max values are being maintained in the CPU. 

Would you prefer if i send you the log file with stock settings and then you tell me what settings you would suggest?. I currently tried disabling turbo in the bios and limiting the cpu to 4 cores and applying a -300 core clock to the gpu but i am still getting temperature and power limits even at 55 degrees.

[unclewebb]

47 minutes ago, Matt255 said:

I currently tried disabling turbo in the bios and limiting the cpu to 4 cores

This might be making things worse. Go back to default CPU settings and run a ThrottleStop log file. Enable Nvidia GPU in the Options window so this information is included in the log file. Attach a log to your next post or copy and paste the data to http://www.pastebin.com and post a link.

 

The Nvidia GPU throttling at 20W appears to be the main problem. You might need to ask Dell why they think this is a good idea. 

 

Edit - A review at TechRadar hints at the throttling issues this laptop has. ThrottleStop was originally developed because of the severe throttling problems in the XPS lineup. This was 13 years ago. It looks like not much has changed. 

 

https://www.techradar.com/reviews/dell-xps-15-2020

 

And, while the GTX 1650 Ti is technically a gaming GPU, the Dell XPS 15 is definitely not a gaming laptop, and the thin and light chassis design doesn't really extend itself to extended gaming sessions where heat could potentially cause performance issues. 

[Matt255]

1 hour ago, unclewebb said:

This might be making things worse. Go back to default CPU settings and run a ThrottleStop log file. Enable Nvidia GPU in the Options window so this information is included in the log file. Attach a log to your next post or copy and paste the data to http://www.pastebin.com and post a link.

 

The Nvidia GPU throttling at 20W appears to be the main problem. You might need to ask Dell why they think this is a good idea. 

 

Edit - A review at TechRadar hints at the throttling issues this laptop has. ThrottleStop was originally developed because of the severe throttling problems in the XPS lineup. This was 13 years ago. It looks like not much has changed. 

 

https://www.techradar.com/reviews/dell-xps-15-2020

 

 

 

https://pastebin.com/h8dqGmBu

In reviews i see the cpu throttling to 15 w but the gpu sustains 40w so idk what is happening with mine

[unclewebb]

3 hours ago, Matt255 said:

In reviews i see the cpu throttling to 15 w

I have seen some Dell laptops with 45W CPUs throttle down to 10W or 15W. The log file does not show this type of throttling. 

 

   DATE       TIME    MULTI   C0%   CKMOD  BAT_mW  TEMP   NVIDIA GPU     VID   POWER
2021-09-06  11:56:14  38.06   78.1  100.0       0  100    1350    80   1.0864   57.2   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:15  37.31   86.8  100.0       0  100    1350    80   1.0457   58.0   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:16  37.38   84.2  100.0       0  100    1350    81   1.0132   57.0   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:17  37.18   86.5  100.0       0  100    1350    81   1.0220   56.0   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:18  36.95   88.4  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.0361   55.7   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:19  36.92   87.2  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.0596   54.9   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:20  36.63   87.1  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.0575   54.4   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:21  37.22   80.7  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.1060   53.7   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:22  37.09   88.5  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.0491   55.3   TEMP

 

Do you see all those TEMP messages in the far right column of the log file? Your CPU is reaching 100°C and it is thermal throttling. You need better cooling so your CPU can maintain its full rated speed.

 

The log file shows lots of TVB throttling. This slows the CPU down 100 MHz when it gets over 70°C. For your laptop, with its inadequate cooling, some TVB throttling is not such a bad thing. If you want to disable TVB throttling, clear the Thermal Velocity Boost box in the ThrottleStop FIVR window. 

 

CPU performance when you were logging data does not look that bad. Any throttling is minor. Were you having any problems while you were logging that data? It is probably the GPU that is causing problems. Try logging your Nvidia GPU with GPU-Z. Maybe it is GPU power limit throttling that is killing your FPS.

 

 

[Matt255]

4 hours ago, unclewebb said:

I have seen some Dell laptops with 45W CPUs throttle down to 10W or 15W. The log file does not show this type of throttling. 

 

   DATE       TIME    MULTI   C0%   CKMOD  BAT_mW  TEMP   NVIDIA GPU     VID   POWER
2021-09-06  11:56:14  38.06   78.1  100.0       0  100    1350    80   1.0864   57.2   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:15  37.31   86.8  100.0       0  100    1350    80   1.0457   58.0   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:16  37.38   84.2  100.0       0  100    1350    81   1.0132   57.0   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:17  37.18   86.5  100.0       0  100    1350    81   1.0220   56.0   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:18  36.95   88.4  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.0361   55.7   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:19  36.92   87.2  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.0596   54.9   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:20  36.63   87.1  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.0575   54.4   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:21  37.22   80.7  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.1060   53.7   TEMP
2021-09-06  11:56:22  37.09   88.5  100.0       0  100    1350    82   1.0491   55.3   TEMP

 

Do you see all those TEMP messages in the far right column of the log file? Your CPU is reaching 100°C and it is thermal throttling. You need better cooling so your CPU can maintain its full rated speed.

 

The log file shows lots of TVB throttling. This slows the CPU down 100 MHz when it gets over 70°C. For your laptop, with its inadequate cooling, some TVB throttling is not such a bad thing. If you want to disable TVB throttling, clear the Thermal Velocity Boost box in the ThrottleStop FIVR window. 

 

CPU performance when you were logging data does not look that bad. Any throttling is minor. Were you having any problems while you were logging that data? It is probably the GPU that is causing problems. Try logging your Nvidia GPU with GPU-Z. Maybe it is GPU power limit throttling that is killing your FPS.

 

 

Alright i checked, my gpu is being throttled down from 40w to 20w, i tried undervolting in afterburner but i am stilling throttling. Do I have any other options?

[unclewebb]

2 hours ago, Matt255 said:

options

I do not know why your GPU is power limit throttling so much. If this is a brand new laptop, contact Dell. Tell them that you want a full refund and send it back.