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Mercedes-Benz wants hydrogen fuel cells mainstream, kinda

So, MercedesBenz wants fuel cells to become mainstream,

they have announced a electronic and hydrogen fuel cell hybrid.

im sorry but i thought this whole hydrogen fuel cell died like 2-3 years ago???,

Persoanlly, I dont think they are worth it. I would much prefer a fully electronic car.

 

https://www.engadget.com/2017/09/13/mercedes-benz-GLC-f-cell-hybrid/

 

What do you guys think of Mercedes-Benz doing this???

 

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The GLC F-Cell will carry 4.4 kilograms of hydrogen onboard, in addition to its 147 kilowatt lithium-ion battery. The automaker says that the the F-Cell's range can hit 437 kilometers (roughly 271 miles) with a governed top speed of 99 MPH, and that it'll charge in about 1.5 hours.

 

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Yeah, they suck, first you need to convert the hydrogen and oxygen into electricity, then store that electricity, then convert that electricity into motion...

Just stick to batteries.

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1 minute ago, BlazingBlob said:

So, MercedesBenz wants fuel cells to become mainstream,

they have announced a electronic and hydrogen fuel cel hybrid.

im sorry but i thought this whole hydrogen fuel cell died like 2-3 years ago???,

Persoanlly, I dont think they are worth it. I would much prefer a fully electronic car.

 

https://www.engadget.com/2017/09/13/mercedes-benz-GLC-f-cell-hybrid/

 

What do you guys think of Mercedes-Benz doing this???

 

 

I rather prefer Hydrogen over pure electric because it fits the lifestyle of today, the only difference is the fuel. Electric cars take too long to charge even with a super charger. Filling up a tank of Hydrogen is as easy as filling up a tank of gas. Electric cars are only viable for daily commutes. Once you go on a road trip, it's a huge hassle having to find electric power stations and waiting half an hour or more just to charge up. 

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5 minutes ago, BlazingBlob said:

So, MercedesBenz wants fuel cells to become mainstream,

they have announced a electronic and hydrogen fuel cel hybrid.

im sorry but i thought this whole hydrogen fuel cell died like 2-3 years ago???,

Persoanlly, I dont think they are worth it. I would much prefer a fully electronic car.

 

https://www.engadget.com/2017/09/13/mercedes-benz-GLC-f-cell-hybrid/

 

What do you guys think of Mercedes-Benz doing this???

 

 

i am currently in the proses of convertihng a van to run on Hydrohyn and oxygen and it is really good i have so far converted a lawn mower to run with a high preasure tank of verry eplosive gas my parents are not to keen on the tanks being kept in the house my large ones are 20 L and i use smaller tanks for the  tests untill i am done with the modds

 

 

soz spelling im in class and teacher keeps looking over to me

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1 minute ago, _Dr_Eye_ said:

i am currently in the proses of convertihng a van to run on Hydrohyn and oxygen and it is really good i have so far converted a lawn mower to run with a high preasure tank of verry eplosive gas my parents are not to keen on the tanks being kept in the house my large ones are 20 L and i use smaller tanks for the  tests untill i am done with the modds

 

 

soz spelling im in class and teacher keeps looking over to me

i allready caused 5 explosions my nabours hate me 

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1 minute ago, _Dr_Eye_ said:

i allready caused 5 explosions my nabours hate me 

Imagine filling out the insurance forms for that.

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1 minute ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

I rather prefer Hydrogen over pure electric because it fits the lifestyle of today, the only difference is the fuel. Electric cars take too long to charge even with a super charger. Filling up a tank of Hydrogen is as easy as filling up a tank of gas. Electric cars are only viable for daily commutes. Once you go on a road trip, it's a huge hassle having to find electric power stations and waiting half an hour or more just to charge up. 

yes, i agree, at the moment, they take a whole to charge, however, tesla has developed a system where that literally take out the old battery and put in a fully charged one, they showed off this concept sometime this year or late last year, takes less than 4 mins

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Just now, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

Imagine filling out the insurance forms for that.

i did not damage anything i lost one eyebrow and most of my arm hair i wore a bandana for this exact reason

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1 minute ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

Imagine filling out the insurance forms for that.

i am alos under 18 so lol

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1 minute ago, BlazingBlob said:

yes, i agree, at the moment, they take a whole to charge, however, tesla has developed a system where that literally take out the old battery and put in a fully charged one, they showed off this concept sometime this year or late last year, takes less than 4 mins

Still not viable unless every charging point has over 100 stockpiled over the course of the day. And imagine the amount of space they would need to store that many batteries. (Even then 100 may not be enough considering how many customers petro station gets every day)

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Just now, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

Still not viable unless every charging point has over 100 stockpiled over the course of the day. And imagine the amount of space they would need to store that many batteries. 

yea i guess thats why thy havnt rolled it out at all, they need to figure out a way of being able to charge the batteries at a really high rate, maybe at this oint they should not have a massive compartment for the batteries but more of a modular system, 

where they have the battery area split up into like 20 sections, all of which can be taken out and put in, 

maybe it would be easer to only fill up some of these 'modules' instead of the whole battery compartement

either way

i think they will come to a solution by the end of next year

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store them kile one of those tape drive arraays that would let every batterie charge and then wen you need one you get a robotic arm to grab the batterie and take it to the car

6 minutes ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

Still not viable unless every charging point has over 100 stockpiled over the course of the day. And imagine the amount of space they would need to store that many batteries. (Even then 100 may not be enough considering how many customers petro station gets every day)

 

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1 minute ago, _Dr_Eye_ said:

store them kile one of those tape drive arraays that would let every batterie charge and then wen you need one you get a robotic arm to grab the batterie and take it to the car

 

they are kinda doing that

here is a clip of what they showed off, it was a long time a go though

 

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2 minutes ago, BlazingBlob said:

they are kinda doing that

here is a clip of what they showed off, it was a long time a go though

 

that is prety ku=akin kewk

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I'll just leave this here...

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8 minutes ago, ARikozuM said:

I'll just leave this here...

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Seems she was struggling

Something is wrong with this world.

 

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Why did you come to this world?

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

The blood is on your hands.

 

The blood is on your hands!

 

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34 minutes ago, Eaglerino said:

I'd rather hydrogen so it doesn't take an hour to charge my freaking vehicle

I have to agree, even though I still prefer gasoline over electric.

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Well Toyota has Mirai for quite some time, hydrogen stations are available (at least in Tokyo) and I don't see why it should be a problem. Also refueling them takes almost the same amount of time as regular gasoline car.

 

Speaking about ecology. Thanks to Tesla and their great PR team everyone thinks that electric cars are completely eco-friendly but they are NOT. Well cars themselves are until we start to speak what to do with the old batteries. The main problem is that you are moving pollution from city streets somewhere else. Electricity needed to charge them does not come from the thin air. Talking about renewable energy sources we have the following:

-wind turbines are fine but their power output is quite low

-solar power plants require huge area for collection

-dams are fine as long as you don't mind acres upon acres of destroyed land 

 

Talking about other power plants we are basically left with coal/fossil ones which are extreme pollutants and nuclear ones. Although nuclear ones produce quite clean energy, there is a possibility of nuclear hazard and super long construction period (~ 20 years minimum).  

 

To conclude, electric cars are not as good for the environment as their manufacturers are trying to persuade us. Hydrogen fuel cells are much better in the long run.

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1 hour ago, Niksa said:

Well Toyota has Mirai for quite some time, hydrogen stations are available (at least in Tokyo) and I don't see why it should be a problem. Also refueling them takes almost the same amount of time as regular gasoline car.

 

Speaking about ecology. Thanks to Tesla and their great PR team everyone thinks that electric cars are completely eco-friendly but they are NOT. Well cars themselves are until we start to speak what to do with the old batteries. The main problem is that you are moving pollution from city streets somewhere else. Electricity needed to charge them does not come from the thin air. Talking about renewable energy sources we have the following:

-wind turbines are fine but their power output is quite low

-solar power plants require huge area for collection

-dams are fine as long as you don't mind acres upon acres of destroyed land 

 

Talking about other power plants we are basically left with coal/fossil ones which are extreme pollutants and nuclear ones. Although nuclear ones produce quite clean energy, there is a possibility of nuclear hazard and super long construction period (~ 20 years minimum).  

 

To conclude, electric cars are not as good for the environment as their manufacturers are trying to persuade us. Hydrogen fuel cells are much better in the long run.

most electricity comes form natural gas or renewable energy which is much cleaner than gas. energy companies are investing more and more into renewable energy mostly because it is more economical in many cases so as time goes on electric cars will only become more and more environmentally friendly. the biggest issue with hydrogen fuel cells is that they are basically a bomb on wheels so although I think it is a cool concept I don't think it is safe enough to use in cars.

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Don't forget that the massive collection of batteries in fully electric vehicles is very dirty business as well. The materials are mined in Canada, destroying a lot of land, then shipped to China to be made into batteries, then shipped to wherever you are to be put into a car. The chemicals in those batteries are also some seriously dangerous stuff in an accident. And, lest we forget the reminder Samsung gave us all last year, batteries also explode.

 

imo fuel cells are the future for now. We just need better ways to store the hydrogen. Just a quick 5 min fill up is much less disturbing to our current way of life than the 30 minute to hours long charging cycle of batteries. Less expensive as well in the end, cause batteries ain't cheap.

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3 minutes ago, TigerHawk said:

Don't forget that the massive collection of batteries in fully electric vehicles is very dirty business as well. The materials are mined in Canada, destroying a lot of land, then shipped to China to be made into batteries, then shipped to wherever you are to be put into a car. The chemicals in those batteries are also some seriously dangerous stuff in an accident. And, lest we forget the reminder Samsung gave us all last year, batteries also explode.

 

imo fuel cells are the future for now. We just need better ways to store the hydrogen. Just a quick 5 min fill up is much less disturbing to our current way of life than the 30 minute to hours long charging cycle of batteries. Less expensive as well in the end, cause batteries ain't cheap.

you act like there isn't an inherent pollution involved with the manufacturing of any product. stating the pollution involved in producing components of one solution without stating the ones involved with the other is not a comparison at all but you just trying to skew the fact to support you view.

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Pardon my bias but this would be good news if it came from volvo or audi or any car brand other than Mercedes.  Any company that tries to lay claim to inventing the car can't be trusted.

 

 

Grammar and spelling is not indicative of intelligence/knowledge.  Not having the same opinion does not always mean lack of understanding.  

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Fuel cells are the future, not fully electric cars.

Fully electric cars might work as self driving taxis in cities, but not for much else.

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4 hours ago, Niksa said:

wind turbines are fine but their power output is quite low

Modern wind turbines put out a large amount of power, we have a very large number here and putting in more. One of the largest wind farms is where I live up on the hills. While you can still say the energy produced per area of used land is low compared to other energy sources wind turbines are extremely simple to manufacture, install and maintain.

 

4 hours ago, Niksa said:

solar power plants require huge area for collection

Very true for large scale power stations but you can do very well with commercial home installations of solar panels to augment power production. Don't want to get in to a debate about how good these panels are etc but there is no denying they do offset power and can be very effective if enough of the population bother to install them.

 

You're also missing Geothermal power from your list, 40.2% of our power (TPES) is from renewable sources and 56% of that is geothermal followed by hydro at 24%, bioenergy/biofuel is 17% and wind 2%.

 

New Zealand is currently the fourth highest renewable energy user in the OECD behind Iceland, Norway and Sweden. You might see information about a country's renewable power generation but the way this is measured must have been changed, Wikipedia still states ours is 81% renewable which I know we used to band around and nothing has actually changed generation wise. TPES must be a proper international measurement standard or something.

 

http://www.mbie.govt.nz/info-services/sectors-industries/energy/energy-data-modelling/publications/energy-in-new-zealand/documents-images/energy-in-nz-2017.pdf

 

4 hours ago, Niksa said:

To conclude, electric cars are not as good for the environment as their manufacturers are trying to persuade us. Hydrogen fuel cells are much better in the long run.

I have been much more interested in hydrogen fuel cells myself for a long time but the really big sticking point currently is the energy required to separate out hydrogen atoms which is a very large amount to do so. Then you have to bottle it and ship it to supply stations etc, last I heard it was potentially a net loss in energy.

 

Hydrogen might be extremely abundant resource but it likes to stick to other atoms and braking those bonds is proving to be a right pain to do efficiently.

 

High heat hydrogen fuel cells don't really have the requirement of pure hydrogen but they are much larger and I don't know about you but having a huge 500C-800C thermal mass in close proximity to me while driving doesn't seem like a good idea, would make car crashed very interesting though.

 

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0360319914031383

 

Edit:

Also Pyrolysis produces CO2 so not exactly a great thing for people campaigning against CO2.  

 

Quote

Steam-methane reforming, the current leading technology for producing hydrogen in large quantities, extracts the hydrogen from methane. However, this reaction causes a side production of carbon dioxide and carbon monoxide, which are greenhouse gases and contribute to global warming.

 

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